Chronically Single Men, Don't Call Yourselves 'Incels"

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Magna
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02 Jan 2019, 11:18 am

The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
Just say you're "single and looking." End of story.

To a potential partner, that works, but I'd say it's very much a gross oversimplification when specifically taking about my struggles with dating. You can be single and looking and have just gotten out of a relationship, or have been out of a relationship for a few months, and that's considerably different to my situation of never having a relationship despite the desire being present.


I think Kortie's advice is the wisest I've heard today: "Just say you're "single and looking." End of story.". Your specific reason or reasons in the dating world don't matter or are not important.


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kraftiekortie
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02 Jan 2019, 11:25 am

I don't think there's anything "wrong," per se, with saying you're "chronically single."

It's not like calling yourself an "Incel."

I just feel attaching that label to one's self could lead to a self-fulfilling prophecy. Could lead to a perpetuation of the cycle which leads one to "chronic singlehood."



The Grand Inquisitor
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02 Jan 2019, 11:29 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
They live with their parents----but, sometimes, they don't get along with them.

This sort of thing is common with many adolescents and young adults in the world.

Yeah, I think it's just a part of becoming your own person. I love my mum, but we have started to butt heads more as I've gotten older and grown into my own person with my own perspectives and views of the world. I think it's natural. I don't see that I'll still be living at home by the end of the year though. Nothing against my mum, I just don't feel like I have enough space at home, and I feel it would be better for me to spread my wings of independence. I'd like to entertain the idea of getting both an electronic drum kit and a pool table but particularly with the pool table there just isn't enough space living with my mum and brother in a unit (a two-bedroom unit, mind you). My brother and I and another friend who's dissatisfied with his roommates are considering moving out in the next few months.



IsabellaLinton
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02 Jan 2019, 11:31 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I don't think there's anything "wrong," per se, with saying you're "chronically single."

It's not like calling yourself an "Incel."

I just feel attaching that label to one's self could lead to a self-fulfilling prophecy. Could lead to a perpetuation of the cycle which leads one to "chronic singlehood."


Chronic, to me, sounds like a disease: chronic depression, chronic psoriasis, chronic pancreatitis. It also implies the person has some type of deficiency we should feel sorry for, or a defect of some sort (along the lines of a disease).

"Single" is sufficient, and when more questions are asked (inevitably), you tell the truth. "I haven't had a relationship before".
If you really need a one-word summary for your tshirt I guess you say you are a beginner?

Full sentences are always better than catch-words or short cuts, when speaking to people in real relationships. It's a part of conversation. It allows the other person to ask questions and keep the dialogue going.



The_Face_of_Boo
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02 Jan 2019, 11:37 am

I wonder what Sly would reply to this.
I bet he will repeat again but Muslims and Muslims....

Gawd.

The key word in Incel ideology is evil, they are not simply lonely men who whine about women and dating, but it’s far more than that: they are literally the followers of Elliot Rodger’s manifesto and of his actions, an Elliotist cult.



kraftiekortie
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02 Jan 2019, 11:39 am

Sounds like quite a "normal" thing to me, Grand Inquisitor.

I sort of did the same thing when I was 20. I wanted to get out of my mother's place. I was lucky my fiancée at the time had the money for a deposit, whereas I didn't. I was the one with the job, though.



lostonearth35
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02 Jan 2019, 6:23 pm

Everything on this site just turns into a bitter and pointless argument. Why am I even still here?



Hollywood_Guy
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04 Jan 2019, 8:21 pm

The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
SilentJessica wrote:
I wonder if “invocel” would be a good replacement, so the two can’t be confused easily.

It still sounds too close to once imo and may as such invoke thoughts about once culture. I think "lonely guy" or "chronically single man" work better, because for many of us not in the incel crowd, sex is not the primary concern. It still exists, but I'd be far happier to see the day when I get my first relationship than the one when I get my first sexual encounter.


What if society also taints those terms "chronically single man" and "lonely man"? What words can we use after that?



Fnord
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04 Jan 2019, 8:23 pm

lostonearth35 wrote:
Everything on this site just turns into a bitter and pointless argument. Why am I even still here?
Because you would miss all the excitement ... ?

:shrug:



The Grand Inquisitor
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04 Jan 2019, 8:47 pm

Hollywood_Guy wrote:
The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
SilentJessica wrote:
I wonder if “invocel” would be a good replacement, so the two can’t be confused easily.

It still sounds too close to once imo and may as such invoke thoughts about once culture. I think "lonely guy" or "chronically single man" work better, because for many of us not in the incel crowd, sex is not the primary concern. It still exists, but I'd be far happier to see the day when I get my first relationship than the one when I get my first sexual encounter.


What if society also taints those terms "chronically single man" and "lonely man"? What words can we use after that?

Society didn't taint 'incel'. Incels did that themselves.



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04 Jan 2019, 9:16 pm

The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
Hollywood_Guy wrote:
The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
SilentJessica wrote:
I wonder if “invocel” would be a good replacement, so the two can’t be confused easily.

It still sounds too close to once imo and may as such invoke thoughts about once culture. I think "lonely guy" or "chronically single man" work better, because for many of us not in the incel crowd, sex is not the primary concern. It still exists, but I'd be far happier to see the day when I get my first relationship than the one when I get my first sexual encounter.


What if society also taints those terms "chronically single man" and "lonely man"? What words can we use after that?

Society didn't taint 'incel'. Incels did that themselves.


Maybe society didn't taint 'incel', but they do play up the messages and there's some worry that the description of 'incel' will stigmatize all lonely single men who are not those violent woman-haters who committed the horrible actions in Toronto and other cities.



The Grand Inquisitor
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04 Jan 2019, 9:46 pm

Hollywood_Guy wrote:
The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
Hollywood_Guy wrote:
The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
SilentJessica wrote:
I wonder if “invocel” would be a good replacement, so the two can’t be confused easily.

It still sounds too close to once imo and may as such invoke thoughts about once culture. I think "lonely guy" or "chronically single man" work better, because for many of us not in the incel crowd, sex is not the primary concern. It still exists, but I'd be far happier to see the day when I get my first relationship than the one when I get my first sexual encounter.


What if society also taints those terms "chronically single man" and "lonely man"? What words can we use after that?

Society didn't taint 'incel'. Incels did that themselves.


Maybe society didn't taint 'incel', but they do play up the messages and there's some worry that the description of 'incel' will stigmatize all lonely single men who are not those violent woman-haters who committed the horrible actions in Toronto and other cities.

Well quite frankly, the only thing we can do is cross that bridge when we come to it.



hale_bopp
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05 Jan 2019, 12:57 am

Anyone who broods on incel forums deserves to be single. What a festering, negative environment.



The Grand Inquisitor
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05 Jan 2019, 4:10 am

hale_bopp wrote:
Anyone who broods on incel forums deserves to be single. What a festering, negative environment.

That's a very simplistic way of looking at it. Most incels have developed depression from being unable to find a partner, or for some, being unable to have voluntary sexual intercourse (ie not prostitution), and have understandably developed self-esteem issues as a result of being forced to live in a society where sex and love are shoved down their face at every turn, yet they can't participate in a romantic/sexual relationship. Anyone who can't see how that would f*** up your self-esteem and give you a very pessimistic view of the world clearly has never felt as though it was impossible for them to attract a partner as a result of their established inability to do so, when it was something they cared deeply about accomplishing.

I agree that brooding on forums does nobody any good, but in my relatively well-informed opinion, I'd say the way that some of these guys post is a reflection of the pain they feel inside rather than who they are to the core of their being.

You just can't know what these guys have been through to make them how they are currently. For some, it could be as simple as strongly desiring positive attention from the opposite sex and never being able to satiate that desire. For others, their hatred of women might take root as a result of being horribly bullied and outcasted at school by mostly female peers, or having an abusive/neglectful mother and having no positive experiences with females at all in any capacity.

Nobody is born a monster, and there's always a reason behind why people are the way they are. From experience I'd say an inability to attain anything romantic or sexual from the opposite sex, or get any kind of validation from the opposite sex in spite of a strong desire over a prolonged period of time is up there with the most difficult things to deal with emotionally, and certainly for me it's been the most difficult thing emotionally for me throughout my life. If you've never experienced the problem, I can understand how it might look like no big deal to an outsider, but trust me, I can say for certainty that at least for guys, it is a very big deal, and an assault to our self-esteem.



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05 Jan 2019, 4:32 am

The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
[color=red]That's a very simplistic way of looking at it. Most incels have developed depression from being unable to find a partner, or for some, being unable to have voluntary sexual intercourse (ie not prostitution), and have understandably developed self-esteem issues as a result of being forced to live in a society where sex and love are shoved down their face at every turn, yet they can't participate in a romantic/sexual relationship.


What's your point? People have self esteem issues for a lot of reasons. I would say about 80% of people do, with at least half of that severely so. Bullied, told they're ugly, Retarded, been lied about, been gang bashed, raped, assaulted, humiliated, been neglected by their family, ostracized by their classmates and betrayed by their friends and loved ones.

It's partly our experiences who make us who we are, but it's also our choices. If you have a self esteem problem, Tom, dick and Harry aren't going to fix it, neither is Sarah across the road. Fix it yourself.

I'm fixing self esteem issues from being bullied about my body shape by going to the gym and dieting. I am also saving up to see a psychotherapist about the other abuse and betrayal I've received in my life, because it's more important than buying new video games.

Quote:
Anyone who can't see how that would f*** up your self-esteem and give you a very pessimistic view of the world clearly has never felt as though it was impossible for them to attract a partner as a result of their established inability to do so, when it was something they cared deeply about accomplishing.


See above.

Quote:
I agree that brooding on forums does nobody any good, but in my relatively well-informed opinion, I'd say the way that some of these guys post is a reflection of the pain they feel inside rather than who they are to the core of their being.


See above.

Quote:
Nobody is born a monster


This is something I 100% do not agree with, though a lot of incels probably aren't, but they're not making respectable choices in regards to the solution by spamming on Reddit that Mary is a slut because she didn't reply to his dating site message, scratching their bum then playing video games for 12 hours.

I've got no problem with chronically single men/women etc. A lot of single people deserve a chance and have been waiting a long time. I hope they find someone. I would definitely date someone who had been chronically single for a very long period of time if they seemed like a great person. I have a massive problem with people who identify as "incels" or behave like "incels".