Romance is empty

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More musings.

Romantic gestures seem very empty to me. Sure they feel great in the moment, but really it's done on a whim. It's not really special. It's hollow. There's no meaning to it really.

You're just one woman out of all the women he's made feel special this month.

Does the fact that those who can make you feel special are doing this to as many women as possible in order to get a buzz mean that it's empty because that's all it is, so the nice feeling of it, is that any less nice?

Should it feel nice or should I ignore it as an empty gesture?

I swear I'm not stoned. This is day 3 of no caffeine or sugar and day goodness knows what of self isolation.

Someone messaged me a nice thing and I don't know how to take it. He'd say don't overthink it, but in the long run, does it even matter? That sounds like depression talking, but what does any of this romance nonsense matter. No one stays. It's all just fleeting. You get one moment every few months or years.

I feel used, by guys. They like a bit of flirting because it makes them feel good, but you're not special. And it makes me wonder whether it's even realistic to be a special someone to someone else? Is being exclusively loved just a stupid narcissistic fantasy lie humans have created?

It's not empty, it gets worse for wear because we're not treating relationships as we should be treating them. This is why our ancestors prized virginity because humans pair bond crazy well with their first partner and so if you set people up to marry their first partner they will stick together for life, but if it's your 100th rodeo then yea of course it wont seem special at all because it's not special. It's treating love like smoking a cigarette, it's emphemeral and not enduring.

One thing I tell women all the time in order to filter players out is to make their suitors wait for you know what. Players can't wait for that because there is no reason for them to wait for it, they have women lined up for it so if you deny them that thing then they'll quickly move on. Those males know how to push a ladies buttons like you couldn't believe, but one thing that is in the lady's power that they can't circumvent is her ability to make the male wait. This one male might know how to say all the right things at the right moment, but if he can't wait for you know what, then you'll be able to discern that he's not really being honest.

But of course in a world of promiscuity, women as well and men don't like to wait, and so they pay the price for it. The lady can no longer discern the good males from the bad because the bad males make them feel so good, and they're just so addicted to having those buttons pushed and feeling good. This is a place where a lady needs to exercise restraint in order to judge a male for what he is, but if she can't restrain herself than she will constantly encounter males that can't restrain themselves either.

Here's an old folk song that's expressing this same complaint:

My Thing is My Own



You'll notice that the protagonist's strength in this song is her ability to keep herself pure. All the males she encounters know how to sing to her tune but none of them can wait for you know what.

Thanks mate. Sorry I'm not young and pure enough for you

It's better to wait for the right person than to just jump into a marriage when you're young. So many unhappy people got married young before they even knew who they were. I know people who stick together even though they can't stand each other because they think it's the moral thing to do. What a life. Thing they had in common. Marrying to young because if raging hormones.

Too many people marry for the idea of love only to find out they never really loved or respected the other person. It was just lust.

I know people who have married later in life who are very happy with their partners because they waited till they knew who they were and what they really wanted and needed.

Plus your first partner could turn out to be a horrible person once you get to know them better. It's not a good idea to just stick with the first person you ever date seriously. Imagine being stuck with someone who doesn't support you for your whole life because you married the wrong person at 21?

I agree, it's definitely good to filter out the players... However... They're all players, unless they're too shy to talk to girls and don't express any interest in me and run away if I show an interest in them.

I gave someone my time last year because he seemed shy and awkward and genuine. Even he was stringing along several women. Finally settled on one. They do settle in the end. Just not for quirky aspie women.

Whilst I understand the social norms and mechanisms of romantic gestures they do not come naturally to me. The ones that I know have been picked up as a kind of learned behaviour and still seem quite illogical. Its probably of no great surprise that my first two wives cites the fact that I was unable to meet their emotional needs as part of the reason for failure of our relationships.

With my third (NT) wife, she sometimes prompts me to do things that make her feel better whilst fully accepting that these things are not an innate spontaneous thing for me. I am happy to go along with this and at least we both have an honest appraisal of the situation. She has a good understanding of ASD having had a previous relationship with an AS man and experience of it within her family.

I do spontaneously show affection, but not often by the usual gestures and (in my view) disingenuous comments and narrative that appears to be the norm. I think that she is a thing of beauty, and I tell her so. I need to be reminded to buy flowers though. That kind of thing. She knows that I will never be unfaithful as this is a totally alien concept to me. You cant start a relationship, emotional or physical, with someone else whilst you are already in one. It is dishonest, disrespectful and destructive.

I like romance. It makes me feel good. It is meaningful to me.

It inspires me to write poetry and to enjoy aesthetic things in general.

Ok, let's be realistic a bit: Only a super charming smooth and handsome playboy man, aka alpha in every way, has the luxury to achieve this.

An average man would not be able to make a new woman feels special every month, even if he wanted so, maybe only few women in his whole lifetime if lucky.

Last edited by The_Face_of_Boo on 13 Apr 2020, 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

I didn't mean to sound mean, but to give you the truth: human beings have a few shot at pair-bonding, but at a certain point our psychology begins to break down and nihilism/cynisim tends to sprout from that. Where do you think this cynicism arises from? It's coming from entertaining too many suitors and you're tired of the same old rigmarole, and you're finding out that it's all just empty in the end.

In ages past our society would give you the structure you needed to protect you from this, it's all gone away now.



That's extremely risky because humans only have a few shots at pair-bonding to one and only one. Things tend to depreciate in value as they're worn, they don't go up. And this is especially true for women because the spring of their youth is when their stocks are valued the highest so to get the best value for herself she must make an offer when she's at her peak.



That's not how pair bonding works. Those are all externals that come and go in life. One might have a crappy job but if the other is pair bonded to them then that crappy job doesn't matter because they love their significant other not because of the adornments surrounding the life but because of the person that is the life. This is the power of pair bonding to ONE and ONLY one. For most of our history we married very young and families thrived back then because the pair bonding was affirmed before promiscuity could take root. You'll find that as partners accrue the externals tend to matter more and more and here you're even confessing to that, you'll find that a lot of people who cannot pair bond will suddenly lose their love for their partner owing to some misfortune. Pair bonding isn't about externals.

Here is a helpful graphic demonstrating how devastating sleeping around is to our psychology.







That's why families vetted suitors and arranged marriages with the father's blessing.

You're going to slowly find out that good people marry young and as you get old they're all being taken. The only thing that's left is players and you seem to be running in to those quite often. Do you think that's a coincidence? No. You're only going to discover that as you get older more and more suitable men will be taken out of the marketplace and you're going to wonder where all the good men have gone.

I gave you the keys you in order to avoid players but you now have to face the temptation that players represent: They give you strong and powerful dopamine hits and you have to struggle with temptation in order to root them out of your life. It's basically a drug that you have to ween yourself off because they know how to play your fiddle and tell you all the things you want to hear and so repeated failures in trying to find a suitor through this has made you cynical towards romance.

You can keep entertaining them, or you can do this: don't have sex until marriage, avoid sleeping around like the plague. You can either have front-loaded pleasures which are hollow and miserable in the end, or you can have a long one that is harder on the onset but reaps a great reward at the end. There is no easy way about this, but consider yourself warned, treat sleeping around like a loaded gun, because that is what it is, for both men AND women.

I’m not a creep...but I didn’t get married until age 34.

Many “good” people hold off marriage until they are ready

I’m 59. I’m neither a cynic, nor a nihilist. I believe firmly in the idea of love and romance.

That's a disgusting misogynistic thing to say. No one's "value" goes down with age. Not even women. Don't you associate with any older women. You should. You'll find that they are also people with value.



I'm just going to chop down the quote tree a bit.

Waiting till you're older doesn't mean sleeping around. You have a very narrow world view.




That's why families vetted suitors and arranged marriages with the father's blessing.

You're going to slowly find out that good people marry young and as you get old they're all being taken. The only thing that's left is players and you seem to be running in to those quite often. Do you think that's a coincidence? No. You're only going to discover that as you get older more and more suitable men will be taken out of the marketplace and you're going to wonder where all the good men have gone.

I gave you the keys you in order to avoid players but you now have to face the temptation that players represent: They give you strong and powerful dopamine hits and you have to struggle with temptation in order to root them out of your life. It's basically a drug that you have to ween yourself off because they know how to play your fiddle and tell you all the things you want to hear and so repeated failures in trying to find a suitor through this has made you cynical towards romance.

You can keep entertaining them, or you can do this: don't have sex until marriage, avoid sleeping around like the plague. You can either have front-loaded pleasures which are hollow and miserable in the end, or you can have a long one that is harder on the onset but reaps a great reward at the end. There is no easy way about this, but consider yourself warned, treat sleeping around like a loaded gun, because that is what it is, for both men AND women.[/quote]

I don't sleep around.

Your family could just as easily select someone unsuitable for you. Arranged marriages lasted because people were unable to part due to societal constraints, not because they were actually happy. Have you read anything about real people's experiences in the past.

You have a certain rosy view of the world, but have you spoken to many acutaul living breathing human beings about their experiences.

Are you married? Do you even know what a good relationship is like to live in?

In retrospect I think that it would have been far better for me to wait until I had figured out more about myself before getting married the first two times which were before my mid 30's.

I agree with you, a number of 'good' people with a greater degree of insight that me hold off until later on.

'Sleeping around' appals me as an idea. Outside of my marriages I have only had relations with other people. Both occasions were disastrous as without an emotional bond and sense of shared values and commitment the physical act in isolation just leaves me cold.

I knew you would say this. That young man I entertained isn't really all that handsome. A few of my friends were totally shocked that I even liked him. One said, "I can't understand why all the girls like him." It was because he showed an interest in us and wanted to talk to us and invite us places and he's incredibly polite. But not really traditionally handsome and certainly no playboy.

These guys have dry spells too. They're not always having lots of women to flirt with. But no one is ever special to them. No one is ever enough. I'm just a nothing to them in a sea of faces. So the flirting means nothing to me now.

I can relate to what you're saying. I'm quite a deep person. What other's find pleasurable I can't. It feels empty because I want something deeper. A connection. To be understood. To be trusted and to trust.

I certainly do know men who have zero interest in them, but they are immature, can't hold a conversation and not very grown up. Why would most women want that.

I bet you're a flirt.

Last edited by hurtloam on 13 Apr 2020, 5:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

Who said you were a creep?

I don't think marriage is a box to tick off in life. You should only do it if you really want to and can really see yourself with this other person. I guess I am romantic. What the possum is saying sounds like some sort of transaction.

I guess romance dissappoints me because I actually do love it, but can't find it. I find flickers. I find moments. But no one stays and it never grows deeper or more meaningful.

I've been fooled too many times and I can't imagine ever finding anything real.

I was speaking about the notion that “all good people are taken” when they are very young. I waited. Many “good people” wait.

I always liked this line from Anne of Avonlea.



Possum needs to read some L.M. Montgomery, L.M. Alcott and Marie Stopes.

I never liked poetry or really noticed aesthetic things. I do love affection & being close with my partner but I'm too direct, straightforward, routine oriented, & mentally slow to get other romance stuff.


I don't find things pleasurable that most of my peers do but I'm not deep either.

The only person I almost always had an easy time holding a conversation with was my 1st girlfriend & we were both VERY immature then. I've grown alot sense then but I'm still very immature in some ways. However some people thought I was mature for my age then cuz I had no interest in sleeping around & no interest in partying. I'm generally quiet with everyone else thou including my current girlfriend but she likes that I'm quiet. The only people she really talks with/to regularly are me & her family. Being social drains her & she feels like she'd have to mask with anyone else. Neither of us are very grown up in some ways & it does make life difficult sometimes but we get by.