Claims that a few "super hot men" are hogging all the women

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Should “really overweight” girls not have standards?

Should “really overweight” girls not have standards?

women are not desirous of dating alpha males. Read back over this thread to get a clearer picture.

I really feel sorry for those men who obsess over this kind of thing.

I understand why and how women are losing interest in men. Frankly, if I were a heterosexual woman today, I'd very quickly lose interest in men upon coming of age. As a heterosexual man, I've lost interest in women for similar reasons (I believe both masculinity and femininity have declined catastrophically in this part of the world).

At any rate, I don't think porn is the sole cause of men's ineffectuality and emasculation, but an effect of an underlying cause, which is the cult of self-indulgence and abnegation of responsibility that has emerged since the 60s. They've bought into the pernicious lie that they can enjoy an unlimited amount of pleasure without paying for it and shirk their responsibilities (usually handing them on to the government or their parents (more often parent singular, given the absence of dads, itself a cause of this problem)) and don't know what they've done wrong when women scorn these sorts of attitudes, given that they've unwisely trusted those peddling the above lie.

I don't think the only manifestation of this problem of male ineffectuality is porn, however. To name a few, I'd also list things like rampant drug addiction; the desire to retreat into a fantasy world, usually consisting of video games; the tendency towards gross perversions such as sadomasochism; poor educational performance; juvenile delinquency; sentimentalism; inarticulacy; the cult of mindless thrills in things like the biker culture and films like "Jackass"; the inability to take themselves seriously; slovenly dress; poor hygiene; the eschewal of responsibility; the deferment of marriage and parenthood.

I don't want to be unfair on men though; I reiterate that both sexes have declined in a way that may well ultimately threaten the viability of western civilisation itself, so low is it on social capital.

I know it will be controversial, but I've concluded that it's only through a return to traditional, nominally Christian values that there is any hope for the next generation, or even mine.

But you're not turning gay, just losing interest in sex and relationships generally, right? As far as I can tell, most heterosexual men are not losing interest in women. Men's sexuality tends NOT to be as fluid as women's.


Above, you've jumbled together a whole bunch of different social trends -- some of which I consider to be bad, some of which I consider to be good, and some of which I consider to be neutral. Among the ones I consider to be bad, some (e.g. drugs) have always been around, with periodic ups and downs.

A major problem I see has been the rise of mass culture and the resulting disappearance, for many people, of a sense of human-scale community. Mass culture is not something most people can participate in directly, and, even for those who do participate directly -- the stars -- it is far from a stabilizing influence. On the contrary, the stars have an incentive to have lives filled with endless divorces, remarriages, quarrels, etc. as a way to keep themselves in the news and thus keep themselves employed. Thus they are motivated to be very bad role models for everyone else. Also, the products of mass culture include a lot of very unrealistic portrayals of romantic love, which too many people then try to emulate and thereby trip themselves up.


Religion, traditional or otherwise, is one way that people can regain the sense of human-scale community that most people in the modern West would otherwise lack. Atheists can gain a similar sense of community, but with more modern values, via organizations like the Ethical Culture Society, the Sunday Assembly, and various groups with the word "Humanist" or "Humanism" in their names.

I believe that a return to traditional patriarchy would be an absolute disaster, and not just for women. More about this sometime later. in another thread.

Not the least bit inclined to homosexuality, but still, I see a definite link between a decline in my interest in women over the past few years and their lack of femininity, just as women seem to be put off by men's lack of masculinity, unless I've misunderstood your OP.

Everything you've said here is sensible enough, though "patriarchy", like most buzzwords, strikes me as something of a bogeyman. I don't think there's much appetite among traditionalist Christians for say, denying women the vote. Certainly not for me.

I don't disagree with you there, though it's unfortunate that some of them, if people just stopped the mollycoddling for a while, would eventually learn to manage for themselves. It's teachers, parents, the government, doctors, advertisers and everybody else reinforcing their "loserhood" that makes their plight pitiable. I don't think most men want to be losers, it's just that they're told by those people that being a loser is okay, and not a great many of them have sufficient independence of mind to realise they're being lied to for cynical reasons. After all, it's a comforting delusion - at least in the short term.

What I mean't is even the "least desirable" girls were putting on airs like they were too good for the likes of me! I guess it's a high self-esteem thing so it caught me by surprise (not what I was expecting).

But of course what I predict:

- WP women will deny the above, this is a given.
- The media is probably blaming it on gaming, and not on the elephant in the room: the rise of online dating (and "coincidentally" it boomed since 2008) which makes getting sex with super hot men very easy for average women, while making it very hard for average men to even get a date with an average woman.

Female sexuality is different from male sexuality. If a straight boy kissed another boy, perhaps to amuse some girls who might be watching, he would be unlikely to undergo a change in sexual orientation as a result. But, as Professor Roy Baumeister at Florida State University and others have shown, sexual attraction in many women seems to be more malleable (see note 3 below). If a teenage girl kisses another teenage girl, for whatever reason, and she finds that she likes it—then things can happen, and things can change. If a young woman finds her soulmate, and her soulmate happens to be female, then she may begin to experience feelings she's never felt before.

Especially if all the guys she knows are losers.

Which brings me to the second point I've encountered in my interviews with young people. Twenty years ago, when I opened my practice in a suburb of Washington DC, it was rare to find 14-year-old boys who were looking at pornography every day. Today it's common—in fact, it's becoming the norm. When I meet with a group of 14-year-old boys and I ask them, "how many of you guys subscribe to a porn site?", all hands go up. I don't believe them. But today, no boy wants to admit that he's the weirdo who doesn't look at online porn. Twenty years ago, hardcore pornography was tucked away in adult bookstores. Today any 14-year-old can access such photos online in seconds. Role models for young men, from pop singer John Mayer to the 2009 World Series MVP Hideki Matsui, talk openly about their collections of porn (see note 4, below).

Is there any connection between these two trends—between the rise in the number of young women who self-identify as lesbian or bisexual and the increasing normalization and acceptance of pornography in the lives of young men? Maybe there is. A young woman told me how her boyfriend several years ago suggested that she shave her pubic hair so that she might more closely resemble the porn stars who were this young man's most consistent source of sexual arousal. She now identifies herself as bisexual. "It was just such a welcome change, to snuggle under a blanket on the couch with my girlfriend, watch a movie, and talk about God and death and growing old, to be intimate emotionally and spiritually as well as physically. I don't know a guy who could even comprehend the conversations we have."