Another Year Older, No Better Off

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I turn 23 on Wednesday, and unfortunately growing another year older has come to represent another year that I've desired a romantic relationship but not had one.

I first started wanting a relationship in 2008 when I turned 12. I think when the not having a relationship really became a problem for me was when my brother (who is a year younger than me) got his first relationship at 11 or 12, and me being the older sibling I was gobsmacked that it happened for him first instead of me. Sure, you can argue that you might not even be able to call it a real relationship at 12 but it's stillbmore than I've ever had at almost double the age.

Throughout the years people would tell me that a relationship would happen for me, and that I should be patient and all the rest of it. And of course it still hasn't. And as my peers continue to age and get more and more relationship experience, I'm lagging behind and concerned that almost all women my age will have had so much more experience than me dating that they won't be able to relate to me and my lack of experience is not only a cause for despair for myself, but possibly a barrier to entry to even have a relationship.

I always wanted to lose my virginity with someone else who was also a virgin. Now, being non-religious and looking for a non-religious partner, the chances of that are almost zero. I'd give anything to have started dating in my teens and have a normal dating life.

Now I'm always alone, depressed, rarely leave the house when I don't have to and feel hopeless. I don't want to get to 25, 27, 30 and never have had a girlfriend. I didn't want to get to 18, 20, 23 without ever having a girlfriend either.

This one significant facet of life where I am infinitely dissatisfied is virtually crushing my will to live. There seems to be no way to make it so that I can get a girlfriend, and nothing else can help.

You're still very young, my friend.

Frankly, I think you overthink all of this. Overanalyze all of this. There are some women who like this sort of thing. Most really don't, though.

I guess I'm lucky I was in my 20's in the 80's, when socialization over all was more casual than it is now. But I still feel you will succeed, ultimately.

I wish you could get into University-----there you will meet people who are more into analyzing things, rather than just acting on instinct.

And then you have some women here on WP who are very analytical......

I have always had a really hard time with romance as well. Over the years I learned how to make friends really well, have found a great career for myself, but romance always eluded me. I have worked really hard at it, and made a good amount of progress to where I have at least had a few girlfriends and flings along the way. This is essentially what I have learned so far.

Romance is a subtle art, and is essentially comprised of all of the things that autistic people struggle with. 80-90% of it is nonverbal communication, subtle implications, and social status.

At the end of the day, I see it as a numbers game. There are fundamentally two things that you can do to improve.

1. Improve your chance of success per opportunity.
2. Increase the number of opportunities you are exposed to.

I think step 1. is largely comprised of the 'superficial' things most autistic people seem to hate. The truth is, improving here means complying with social norms. Wearing clothes that are stylish, being in good physical shape, being well groomed, and keeping neat and stylish hair and beard are the bare minimum. For bonus points, you need to have something that other people want. It could be money (in this day and age, that tends to need to be A LOT, as more people are able to be self sufficient. Being a good enough provider for basic needs is a bare minimum and offers no advantage). It could also be social status. If you are high up in an organization that people (and specifically women, assuming you are straight) desire to be a part of, they will want to share your status by associating with you. In my opinion, the best thing to focus on in this area is fitness, as there are very low barriers to entry, and they can produce some of the strongest instinctual responses. Specifically, I recommend strength training like weight lifting. Muscles are a visually obvious secondary sex characteristic, and while not all women will be moved by them, they likely won't put anyone off, and I would wager that a majority of women (even if its only 60%) like a strong man. Being strong also improves confidence, and following through with the dedication needed to get fit also builds confidence in ones ability to set a difficult goal, stick with it, and succeed.

Step 2. is about meeting more people. If you are not in places where single women are, you will not meet them. I think that bars and clubs are the default for this, and also a horrible path for autistic people. They essentially limit your ability to meet someone to specifically only nonverbal cues. A better approach would be things like yoga classes, salsa dance classes, and perhaps to a lesser extend outdoors groups like hiking groups and rock climbing. This can be hard, as most autistic men seem to be solely interested in super nerdy things like video games, books, science/technology, obscure metal bands, and collection based hobbies (stamps, models, etc). Try to find something that you can enjoy a little that is more mainstream, and has a large number of women who frequent and cycle through.

The elephant in the room, is that romance is an emotional beast. The true way to a woman's heart is to make her feel. If you can evoke strong feelings in someone else, you get their attention. This is why some as*holes can be successful at dating (at least short term one night stand level dating). There is an old joke that you shouldn't want your significant other to get mad at anyone else. Those are strong emotions. If you can make someone feel the whole range of human emotions, they will feel strongly for you. I think there is a path to emotional connection which is based on manipulation, and does not work long term (though it can be VERY successful in the short term). This way involves artificially creating emotional situations (aka drama). There is a noble path, though, that comes from a place of inner strength, strong convictions, and being secure in ones own desirability. People will feel afraid to lose someone who has a high social value, will feel happy and excited to get their attention, and will feel sad when that person is not around.

There is no easy solution, but I hope some of these foundation concepts are helpful. If you've heard them before, I hope the way I phrase them is somewhat novel and helps them sink in.

To Grand Inquisitor:

What are your hobbies and interests?

1) Are there any activities you enjoy, and/or topics you are interested in, that are at least as popular among women as they are among men? If so, what are they?

2) What are your other (more male-dominated) interests, if any?

23 is still young. More people are virgins in their 20s than in the past. You're not that weird in this modern society.

I understand the frustration of people saying, "it'll just happen." For those of us who are let's say a bit quirky, it's not gonna just happen.

I'm heading for 40 over here. I thought something had "Just happened" for me, but it was a mirage. Nothing romantic ever works out or happens for me.

I've got a few male acquaintances now, which I didn't have 10 years ago, so at least I can have some different types of conversation these days than the same old same old with my female friends.

@ The other and Mona Pereth:

Your responses are better than anything I might have come up with.


I remember being 23.
Völlig losgelöst von der Erde...

It would be much better for you, Grand Inquisitor, if you had something you were REALLY interested in. I'm really interested in the weather. I don't need a lover to love the weather.

I truly feel like women like guys better who have interests enough to not focus on THEM primarily (the guy on women). There is a fear amongst women of guys who become fixated on them.

I know this----because I was one of those guys. A woman I worked with wanted to "experiment" on me, so to speak. But I thought she really "loved" me. And I felt like I wanted to marry her. But she was not serious about me at all. We had a couple of dates, I became fixated on her, then she stopped taking my calls. I felt devastated about it for two full years. And my "friends who were women" just didn't want to hear it. And my friends who were guys didn't want to "hear it," either. And women felt disgusted about me---until it was evident that the obsession faded away, and it was evident I had interests other than "finding a woman." I did much better after the age of 23 or so.

My experience taught me that a man should never SEEM like he is pursuing women only. Not that I believe you give off that "vibe." But I'm conveying how things got a little better for me after a pretty long drought because I was fixated on this one woman----and on getting a girlfriend in general.

Don’t listen to the people who say your too young, they say same thing to me and I’m almost 10 years older. They’d probaby it to a 50 year old.
Like the idea that maybe in our 80s or 90s we’d get a relationship briefly before we die with some lady that’s had tons of relationships, kids and lived life is suppose to make us feel better.

I got told that from 20 to 31 I’m still told that, and as we get older our chances get worse. Especially if you don’t have a career that your progressing through and making good money. Most 30-40 olds have a good job, new car, and own their own house , that’s whats expected as a base line. Even if we had that the fact we’ve never had a relationship at 30-40 is a huge red flag to women to avoid getting into one with us, cause “there must be a reason not a single woman would date him in 20-30 years”