Increasing popularity of friends-first approach

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Reading studies and watching documentaries helps people educate themselves. I have my preferred doctors because I study what they do, because I want the best line of medicine, and sometimes secondaries that are suggested along with the array of additional side-meds fit. You learn a lot about doctors by doing that. You can even customize your recipes.
I'm crazy enough to do it.

It ended up great for me on fixing my cough. Some meds act in a lesser amount of time (days), make you feel good in no time.

I like animal behavior and training (particularly dogs and horses) and I think people are similar to dogs in the way they behave. When you move a dog yourself, it won't learn the behavior as it will when you actually stimulate it to create the behavior on its own. I think the approach on autistic people on certain therapies won't work, because of that, and also because unlike dogs they need to be exercising freedom to decide, not to follow directions like dogs need to be stimulated to. Dogs have a natural follow instinct along with being bred to follow human commands and look up to us while domesticated.

You learn about bears in relation to humans? I dislike brown and black bears and prefer the polar bears, they're more loving. But bears will be bears.

Messing with higher ed doesn't intimidate people, it stimulates them, and pays them, that's why they read. Except grandma and she's fixed in her beliefs. Despite this, I liked listening to her sometimes but she is too talkative and I space out. Gaudeamus igitur but school is often useless in job hunt. Following guides is better than following grandma, it has been confirmed.

There are online dating courses for incels, it's like higher ed but better lol. What I learned (I'm not an incel) is that the best way is usually through some sort of friendship or connection.

When me and Pepe were friends we have made a lot of progress on connecting. Actually maybe too much lol because we ended up together. I think my autism prefers having the connection time.

Pepe doesn't speak much trash. He only eats it (goes by the name of Pepsi). That's his behavior. Are there concerns, doctor? (Say yes)

The main problem a relationship specialist has talked about, with dating apps is that people make decisions based on the shopping idea, the product that seems best on a check list does not ensure a quality partner you'll get along with.

The stats on some apps of the male vs female ratio is probably a concern.

Then proximity, for some.

The dangers of humans propagating the species another one.

They also do tests on members on an app I know of and edit their profiles to create random matches.

When have you tried the apps?

Except when we were Poly first before being friends. Then I gained your heart even more.

Argument of authority fallacy. Lame.

Also there might be another fallacy here, but I don't know the name. I'll call it "retrospective fallacy", ie. only analyzing current data with past data, not allowing for new and upgraded interpretations.

*Appeal to authority. Again, if you're gonna make baseless accusations, at least make the right one

It might have been an appeal to authority, if I expected people to take my professors' word for it - but I am merely stating why I personally have chosen to take their word over that of people who "say stuff".

As for "new and upgraded interpretations" - "interpretations" from whom? Formally trained professionals? Or (rando internet entity) with a "clever" idea?

Here's fallacy for you - the Fallacy fallacy - where a legitimate situation is claimed to be a fallacy even though it isn't. Calling this an appeal to authority is just a means of undercutting any legitimacy of credentials.

And it's still just another fancy way of going after the individual rather than the content of the message - going after my credibility, rather than arguing my statements. Lame, indeed....

Have the mods been paying attention to this thread? Not because any rules are being violated but because it has totally run off the rails

Let's just take a closer look at this for a second...

You say it's better off to be clear about intentions from the beginning. That it's better to be clear you want "dates", and not just be "friends". And that if you try to be a friend first, they might get the impression you were only trying to get into their pants.

But if your initial goal is to "date" them, and not be their "friend", then they're not exactly wrong about what your primary goal is. The only reason it's not "manipulative" is cos you were up-front that you just wanted "dates". They're still right that that's what you wanted. I feel like this kinda misses the point...

It's nice the way you added the part about how "if it doesn't work out, you can choose to stay friends", but based on the "friendzone" whining that occurs here in Sex and Sexing Love and Dating, "if it doesn't work out", they still whine about being "friendzoned".

I don’t really get a non-friends approach.

How would you know you wanted to date someone unless you knew them well?

Sexual frustration was mentioned as a potential negative to friends-first somewhere in this thread. Can’t people take care of their own sexual desire?

You ask how you wanted to date someone if you don't know them well. The answer is that that's what dating is for in the first place, to get to know them. The negative is not sexual frustration. Rather, it's that the other person ends up feeling that you're only friends with them in order to manipulate them into a relationship. I've seen too many people in this forum being criticised for complaining about being "friendzoned", but that's exactly what you get when you do this as a general dating strategy. In fact, it's the best way to remain single. Even the other person is interested in dating, if you delay it because you want to be friends first, they end up thinking that you're not interested and instead start dating other people. If you then suddenly spring your romantic feelings on them then, it's already too late and they've moved on.

That's not the way I perceive things. If I moved on, it would be because I wasn't sufficiently interested in the person, for whatever reason, in the first place or because I learned that we weren’t compatible - not because I was turned off by them taking the time to get to know me as a friend.

Last edited by TwilightPrincess on 26 Mar 2023, 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Poly didn't do it for me, remember?
I wanted a friendship instead.

This is probably true but being social / friendly with women for a long period of time first wouldn't work for me.

And I think it doesn't work for a lot of NTs because even before the days of dating sites NT men used to go to places to "pick up chicks", not form platonic friendships with women that would turn to romance several years later.

Even back in the good old 20th century the idea of not being friends first sometimes applied.

Right. Let me ask you this then. What happens if you don't want to move on because you are interested, but they give no indication that they're interested back? What I'm trying to say, is usually when you try to do friends first and the other person is interested in you, then that's how they end up feeling, that their feelings are unrequited, even if you secretly feel the same way, and that's why they move on.

Trust me, I used to think the same way you do. You can find some of my older threads on the topic here in L & D forum. After I got a couple of dating partners by using online dating sites, I eventually figured out that's why I didn't have a gf until my 30's. If you do that then you look to NT's like you're not interested in dating.

My success rate with online dating is not great, but at least I got a few and before that I had none. Part of what made it easier is that at least you know that everyone on a dating site is looking for the same thing, so it skips the part of social interaction where you need to "read" people. Beyond that though, I learned that if you're interested in dating someone, you need to upfront from the beginning about your feelings, whether in real life or on-line. Taking too much time to befriend people before trying to date them might be one of chief reasons why you're still single.

Last edited by Jono on 26 Mar 2023, 5:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I try to go with the flow and read a person’s signals. I can generally tell if a person is or isn’t interested in me, especially if I know them well.

I’ve had previous relationships, including a marriage. I’ll do what I’ve learned works best for me from experience and avoid that which doesn’t. There’s nothing wrong with that.

I would never date a stranger I met on a dating app. I need to be fairly confident that whomever I date isn’t a psycho. I’d rather be single than get into another abusive situation.

Last edited by TwilightPrincess on 26 Mar 2023, 5:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

This is how we did it back in the days before dating apps, social media, and even the Internet.

Strangers → Acquaintances → Friends → Dating → Engagement → Marriage → Death/Divorce

Now people are (re)discovering this progression and acting as if they invented it.

^ Or are saying that it’s totally invalid.