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How to get on with Neurotypicals

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jennyishere
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22 Mar 2023, 7:18 pm

Pepe wrote:
jennyishere wrote:
I think it's really hard to generalise about neurotypicals, just as it is about people with autism. I'm neurotypical but I certainly don't get along with all other neurotypicals. We don't all interact in the same ways, and even a single individual will vary their interactions depending on a whole range of factors.


OMG!
SECURITY!! !

Because of the 4 decades of gang-stalking I endured by the neurotypical community, I was extremely resentful towards them.
I came to WP almost 10 years ago as a refuge.
Little did I realise how feral SOME on the spectrum could
be.
Thankfully, most have left.

The consequence of my joining this website:
1. My resentment towards NTs significantly mitigated.
I have sorted out NT websites now when I actively avoided them before.
2. I am no longer a "snowflake" and have become emotionally tough.
As Nietzche said:
"Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger."
I am still damaged by my life-long history of experiences, but I am in a much better position to cope with life these days.
3. I am in better touch with reality and accept there are unpleasant ppl in both the NT and ND universe.
How could it be otherwise? 8)


I'm really sorry that you had those experiences, Pepe, and I'm glad that you're finding life a bit easier now. :heart:

Yes, I'm neurotypical, with a neurotypical husband and neurotypical adult children.

I originally joined Wrong Planet many years ago because I wanted to learn more about autism. I was teaching more and more students with ASD diagnoses. Some of my favorite students over the years have had autism. I also have a close friend who is autistic and has three autistic adult children. My children have a couple of friends with autism as well. I've popped in and out of WP many times over the years.

I've mainly stuck to posting in the games forums because I don't have lived experience of autism myself and it's not appropriate for me to butt into most discussions about autism. I do occasionally comment when a topic involves neurotypicals because I feel that I am on more familiar ground there. :)



Pepe
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22 Mar 2023, 7:50 pm

jennyishere wrote:

I'm really sorry that you had those experiences, Pepe, and I'm glad that you're finding life a bit easier now. :heart:

Yes, I'm neurotypical, with a neurotypical husband and neurotypical adult children.


We need to upgrade our screening processes. 8O <joke> :mrgreen:

jennyishere wrote:

I've mainly stuck to posting in the games forums because I don't have lived experience of autism myself and it's not appropriate for me to butt into most discussions about autism. I do occasionally comment when a topic involves neurotypicals because I feel that I am on more familiar ground there. :)


We have a resident NT who has no problems butting in involving themselves in autism-related discussions.
I don't see why you can't present a reasonable/responsible NT POV.
If anyone complains, tell them Pepe said it was ok.
I am the top skunk on this website, so I have influence. 8) <joke> :mrgreen:



jennyishere
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22 Mar 2023, 8:04 pm

Thanks, Pepe! :salut:
I've learned a lot from visiting Wrong Planet and I enjoy my interactions with other members, so I'm sure I'll be sticking around for a while yet. :)



cyberdad
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23 Mar 2023, 12:54 am

It's weird how many people ask questions about NTs on this forum but when a real life NT pops in (ok butts in) they run away



jennyishere
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23 Mar 2023, 1:49 am

cyberdad wrote:
It's weird how many people ask questions about NTs on this forum but when a real life NT pops in (ok butts in) they run away


I suspect that a lot of people here have already suffered through way too much well-meaning (or not) advice from neurotypicals. I'd run away too, if I were them.



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23 Mar 2023, 1:57 am

I like having Jenny on the forum. Both her and Radish lighten the place up.


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jennyishere
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23 Mar 2023, 2:07 am

Where_am_I wrote:
I like having Jenny on the forum. Both her and Radish lighten the place up.

Thanks, Where_am_I! I've enjoyed lots of fun exchanges with you and Radish in the games thread. :clown:



cyberdad
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23 Mar 2023, 2:21 am

jennyishere wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
It's weird how many people ask questions about NTs on this forum but when a real life NT pops in (ok butts in) they run away


I suspect that a lot of people here have already suffered through way too much well-meaning (or not) advice from neurotypicals. I'd run away too, if I were them.


hmmm I guess that's possible, Also possible they come here to escape people like me. But then why do they ask?



jennyishere
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23 Mar 2023, 3:12 am

cyberdad wrote:
hmmm I guess that's possible, Also possible they come here to escape people like me. But then why do they ask?


Needing to vent? Seeking empathy and moral support from others who have experienced the same issues? Looking for practical solutions from fellow autistic people who have managed to overcome these problems? Other valid reasons?



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23 Mar 2023, 3:16 am

jennyishere wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
hmmm I guess that's possible, Also possible they come here to escape people like me. But then why do they ask?


Needing to vent? Seeking empathy and moral support from others who have experienced the same issues? Looking for practical solutions from fellow autistic people who have managed to overcome these problems? Other valid reasons?


Yes...
Yes...
And yes... 8)



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23 Mar 2023, 4:45 am

cyberdad wrote:
KitLily wrote:
Define 'weird' please.


I briefly worked with a guy back in 2010 who subsequently disclosed to me he had Aspergers. We actually got on, and he seemed pretty intelligent and ran his own business. But he did weird things.
1. He refused to sit down anywhere with his back to another person (He told me he felt paranoid)
2. He had a grandiose sense of self and when he spoke of his achievements (which were impressive) it came across as elitist like he was better than other people
3. I thought he would sympathetic about having a child on the spectrum, instead when he heard she was non-verbal (at the time) he said something rather horrible like "I'm not interested in low functioning autism" (like it triggered him or something?). I took that as a cue to avoid/leave him alone.

All three of those things were in his power to control, but he chose to be weird. That's what I mean.


But I don't do any of those things. So what do I do that's weird? Because I don't know. 'Doing weird things' is just too vague.

I know you're trying to explain but those things he did don't apply to me.


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KitLily
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23 Mar 2023, 4:48 am

cyberdad wrote:
KitLily wrote:
I agree. I sometimes wonder if we are just two alien species on the same planet. :?:


Hardly. Those of you who post regularly on this forum seem to have "normal" and "logical" thought processes and I doubt anyone who was NT visiting this site would know any better if they interacted with you.
Basically you all carry the same values and beliefs as your NT parents, siblings or spouses/partners or children.
This who NTs are a different species thing doesn't really hold much water.


That's my point though. I can appear 'normal' IN WRITING AND ON PAPER AND ONLINE. It's just when I have to interact with people in real life- speaking, socialising, joining in conversations etc- that I get labelled as 'weird.' So what am I doing in real life that is weird? I'm confused.


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23 Mar 2023, 4:52 am

jennyishere wrote:
KitLily wrote:
Define 'weird' please. Because I have no idea what 'weird' is in life. I just go along as I am and get stared at/ gossiped about/ excluded.

I'm not a murderer/ rapist/ abuser etc. I'm just a person, generally kind and helpful to others. So what am I doing that is weird?


I'm not a murderer/rapist/abuser either. :)

I think most neurotypical people, especially women, subconsciously and quickly assess others on the basis of how they present themselves. This includes how they dress, personal hygiene, facial expressions, posture, gait, gestures, voice, speech style, etc. Anything that differs from the "norm" can make NTs feel unsure whether that person will be welcoming or comfortable to interact with. Some people are more "judgy" or more accepting of difference than others, of course.

I think that people with autism can present in ways that make NTs feel uneasy. These might include a lack of facial expression (or an angry/grumpy/preoccupied expression), lack of eye contact (or too much), flat or loud voice (sounds bored or aggressive), overly formal language (sounds standoffish), lack of ice-breaking smalltalk, difficulty with holding a conversation (long silences, monologuing), etc. In informal contexts NTs also often use a lot of non-literal language, which can lead to awkward misunderstandings.

I don't think it's anyone's fault, just a communication mismatch and the typical human fear of the unfamiliar. But I can't really tell you how to change, it, either. :(


Thanks Jenny.

That's the point isn't it- we can't change the way we communicate or interact, so are we doomed to be excluded forever? We don't know what 'the norm' is so we can't be it.

I do find I get on better with men, probably because of what you say about women assessing people more often (probably because they are more worried about safety and who is a potential threat). Men tend to be more straightforward and easy to understand IMO.


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Trueno
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23 Mar 2023, 4:55 am

KitLily wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
KitLily wrote:
Define 'weird' please.


I briefly worked with a guy back in 2010 who subsequently disclosed to me he had Aspergers. We actually got on, and he seemed pretty intelligent and ran his own business. But he did weird things.
1. He refused to sit down anywhere with his back to another person (He told me he felt paranoid)
2. He had a grandiose sense of self and when he spoke of his achievements (which were impressive) it came across as elitist like he was better than other people
3. I thought he would sympathetic about having a child on the spectrum, instead when he heard she was non-verbal (at the time) he said something rather horrible like "I'm not interested in low functioning autism" (like it triggered him or something?). I took that as a cue to avoid/leave him alone.

All three of those things were in his power to control, but he chose to be weird. That's what I mean.


But I don't do any of those things. So what do I do that's weird? Because I don't know. 'Doing weird things' is just too vague.

I know you're trying to explain but those things he did don't apply to me.


I met an aspie.
He was weird.
Therefore all aspies are weird.

It’s what’s known as a false syllogism. Flawed logic.


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KitLily
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23 Mar 2023, 5:05 am

Trueno wrote:
I met an aspie.
He was weird.
Therefore all aspies are weird.

It’s what’s known as a false syllogism. Flawed logic.


Seems that way. I really hate the word 'weird'. What does it even mean? What is defined as weird and what isn't?


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KitLily
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23 Mar 2023, 12:15 pm

On the other hand, I think some people (NT or autistic, any type) just don't know how to communicate.

One time I emailed the receptionist of the college I'd just taken a course at. In the email I asked if I could come and fetch my portfolio of work and where would it be? I gave the name of my course and my own name. She replied that portfolios were kept at reception and I was welcome to fetch it anytime.

I went in the next day and went to the receptionist to say that I'd come to fetch my course portfolio, could I please have it? I gave the name of my course and my own name. She stared at me as if I was speaking a foreign language. I repeated myself. She said 'I don't suppose you're the lady who emailed me?' I said yes, I was that lady, and did she have my portfolio? She looked bemused and searched around, eventually finding it. She handed it to me, still looking at me like she'd seen a ghost/alien.

I know it was the same receptionist because she said I'd emailed her. So why the incomprehension? I thought that was a really simple request.

It was very odd indeed.


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