Why are so many ppl with Aspergers non-believers?

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lostonearth35
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29 Jan 2014, 10:12 pm

People say Aspies are highly logical, but I'm not very logical at all and nothing I feel or do makes sense. I'm very emotionally-driven, creative, and artistic. But the less I think about god and religion the better because it almost always makes me angry and disgusted. I also hate it when people believe in paranormal things like ghosts because people should have stopped believing in such things by the time bubonic plague nearly wiped out Europe and Christians blamed Jewish people and killed cats that were helping to keep the plague-carrying rodent population under control. :x



zer0netgain
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29 Jan 2014, 11:12 pm

AspE wrote:
zer0netgain wrote:
Another thought....

Maybe it IS self-delusional to have faith, but if I didn't have faith, I'd go put a gun barrel in my mouth and pull the trigger before the sun went down.

Some days, it's faith that keeps me going and believing that throwing in the towel isn't the answer. Science doesn't offer me a reason to hope that tomorrow will be better than today.

It's called the uncertainty principle. The future isn't determined, only more or less probable.


Well, as future events frequently are built on past events, my track records doesn't bode a positive probability for the future. :cry:

That's what I need faith for.



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29 Jan 2014, 11:19 pm

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSFZvR-ssuk[/youtube]Quoting the bible is not going to get you any where! Also heres 50 proofs god is Imaginary! http://godisimaginary.com/ :D


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ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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29 Jan 2014, 11:59 pm

AspE wrote:
ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
AspE wrote:
ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
There are things Evolutionary Theorists should try harder to explain.

Like what?

Most obvious is why did humans become humans and Chimpanzees stayed Chimpanzees.

Humans and chimps evolved from a common ancestor, so actually chimps did not "stay the same", they changed into chimps. But species diverge, it's quite common. You might as well ask why are there both dolphins and whales? Why are there both gorillas and chimps? They filled a different niche in the ecosystem. At one time there were many hominid species, some more apelike, some more like we are now. Many species died off for various reasons. I hope that answers your question. It's not something evolutionary biologists have ignored.

Dolphins and whales are similar in the way they think and behave so it's easy to discern they came from a similar ancestor yet evolved slightly differently.
I support Theory of Evolution, don't get me wrong, I just think it does a piss poor job of explaining why it is, exactly, in great detail, humans are so advanced compared to other species of primate.



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30 Jan 2014, 1:09 am

I absolutely believe in God and Jesus Christ. I didn't become a Christian until college, though. I was raised Christian Scientist, but never really "clicked" with it (actually, I questioned it until I was asked not to come back by a couple of churches) and in middle school became an agnostic. When I reached college, I started with extensive Bible study and eventually had a spiritual experience that gave me the evidence that I needed in order to believe.

I am considered a "liberal" or "progressive" Christian, as I believe in marriage equality, I do not believe that homosexuality is a sin (and even if it was, it wouldn't be my business to cast judgement upon homosexuals), I believe that the universe is 13.8 billion years old, I believe in evolution, I don't proselytize, etc.

I also understand why people do not believe. If I had not had the personal experience that I did at that point in college, then I most likely would still not either. As it stands, I did and so I have unshakeable faith in God's existence.



aghogday
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30 Jan 2014, 8:49 am

bearsandsyrup wrote:
I absolutely believe in God and Jesus Christ. I didn't become a Christian until college, though. I was raised Christian Scientist, but never really "clicked" with it (actually, I questioned it until I was asked not to come back by a couple of churches) and in middle school became an agnostic. When I reached college, I started with extensive Bible study and eventually had a spiritual experience that gave me the evidence that I needed in order to believe.

I am considered a "liberal" or "progressive" Christian, as I believe in marriage equality, I do not believe that homosexuality is a sin (and even if it was, it wouldn't be my business to cast judgement upon homosexuals), I believe that the universe is 13.8 billion years old, I believe in evolution, I don't proselytize, etc.

I also understand why people do not believe. If I had not had the personal experience that I did at that point in college, then I most likely would still not either. As it stands, I did and so I have unshakeable faith in God's existence.


Precisely the same for me..except i will go one step further..that while i found a path to GOD through the teachings of Jesus..i respect all other paths equAlly as potential ways to gain that 100% faith that you speak of...

God speaks to me through incredible synchronistic events..that have no current rational explanation..per sequence of statistical possibility..of the psychological meaningful..events.. that i have even actually recorded now as proof in the last 6 months..some with my iPhone5...camera....

There was a period of my life of over 5 years..where through the worst pain disorder known to mankind..type two atypical trigiminal neuralgia..i lost almost all my emotions...and all hope and faith..and there was absolutely no synchronistic events i was aware of then..but i'm sure they were still happening...now as i look back..with my full mind working with emotions..including hope and faith....

But what i think..is too much emphasis on mechanical cognition..with almost a complete escape from social cognition..numbs the mind's ability to discern synchronistic events..that many people in life .. experience .. as their personal proof of GOD...

And there is scientific research that suggests that when one path of cognition..is used in the human brain..per the environment of mechanical cognition..as opposed to social/empathic cognition.. the other path is repressed....

So throughout history people have been sharing their synchronistic events..with others..in hopes to spark some type of faith .. hope or belief .. for those folks..but it is so hard to do for the person that does not experience..'this proof of GOD' .. up close and personal...

Well ..some of my 'synchronistic proof' is recorded with my iPhone 5 here in the last 6 months..as i am receiving more incredible proof of the existence of GOD ..far more proof.. than ever in my life before..and more than i could imagine i COULD receive...

It's going to be my next post here..

and it will be titled:

GOD enLiGhtens the boy with a Star in hIs sKeYe....

Having 100% proof that GOD exists..is an incredible feeling of confidence..in this life..
that brings no fear of death for me..although..my experience of heaven is in the NOW..
and i need no more promise of that to be 100% happy in life..i look no further than NOW..
for thIS..COMPLETE BLISS.

And i believe GOD is fully natural..even with synchronicity..as humans simply only have
one small part of understanding ..through science.. of how the whole dam thing
works...

I too..am 100% sure of that..
Just for the incredible documented experiences i have in the last 6 months..
That defies all explanation..by the current state of science...

But i'll let everyone make their own minds up about my proof...

When that post comes..if they care too..:)

i cannot impose my will on anyone..

All i can do is share
my experiences..

and hope..
it sparks something in someone...

And yes..i do know this can be a life saver..
And no.. i am not alone in that thinking here..
Although.. it might be an unpopular one to state...
For the overall herd of thinking...here....

Where i live..there is relatively little doubt that GOD exists..
Churches are everywhere..
And atheism..although yes..it most definitely exists here..
WHERE I LIVE..
Is rarely ever spoken of...anywhere..where people meet..
and talk...they are the odd folks out by far there..
whereas folks like you and me are the odd folks out..
relatively speaking here in this online environment..

And no.. i too.. do not blame them for feeling that way at all...
i too..am still disillusioned by the total effect of many structured
religious efforts..that oppress folks..whether it is homosexuals..
or folks from other religions...


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Last edited by aghogday on 30 Jan 2014, 9:14 am, edited 2 times in total.

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30 Jan 2014, 8:52 am

Ilovemyaspiegirl wrote:
binaryodes wrote:
I think it might be useful to refine the op's idea a little. In my experience autists tend to have self-generated belief systems. Personally I dont subscribe to any religious system, rather I consume a variety of materials from across the spectrum. I imbibe ideas from regions as diverse as the metaphysic transhumanists to the ancient kaballists to Christian mysticism. This can then by synthesised into a sort of heady syncretic brew.


While I really appreciate your response, you lost me at "imbibe". So unless that was a typo (in which case I'll feel REALLY dumb, I'm afraid I don't really get your reply. But, it is an awesome feeling (as a NT parent raising a child ppl assume isn't as "good" or as smart as other children) to have the honor of being made to feel dumb by an autistic lol.

One of the definitions of the word imbibe is "to receive and absorb into mind". (I am quoting that from the American heritage dictionary, but you'll see variations of it in other dictionaries.). So binaryodes does appear to be using the word in proper context.



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30 Jan 2014, 9:17 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
Dolphins and whales are similar in the way they think and behave so it's easy to discern they came from a similar ancestor yet evolved slightly differently.
I support Theory of Evolution, don't get me wrong, I just think it does a piss poor job of explaining why it is, exactly, in great detail, humans are so advanced compared to other species of primate.


Your failure is too focus on one simply detail, the brain. When it comes to speed we are not advanced at all. When it comes to strength, we are not advanced at all. When it comes to possibility of naturally flying we are not advanced at all. Certain animals normally have niches in their typical habitats. As long as that habitat dont change, further specializing in that niche-technique normally favors the animal. So the niche of Gepards is "running fast". As long as the environment does not change, becoming faster will be of further advantage for Gepards, because that means that the faster Gepards will more likely do more prey then other Gepards, and so more likely inherit their DNA to kids.

If however the habitat changes, then this can lead for the existing niche (=running fast) too become less important, while an sideattribute now becomes the main-niche the animal specializes in. (As example sneaking.) When that happens then these animals, being forced in the surrounding that favors sneaking before fast running, will now slowly develop into getting better into sneaking, simply because the better sneakers, will have more prey, and so more likely inherit their DNA to their kids.

The niche of human is simply "cognitive abilities". We are not superior in general, we have a sh***y digestion in comparison with other animals, there are tons of animals having better fighting abilities, strength, claws, teeth, ... But our niche is "brain". Because of us using our brain meanwhile that experienced, that it helps us avoiding to have other needs as strenght, healthyness, ... these other attributes become less important, while "brain" stays important and so we will most likely further develop in "brain".



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30 Jan 2014, 10:11 am

bearsandsyrup wrote:
I absolutely believe in God and Jesus Christ. I didn't become a Christian until college, though. I was raised Christian Scientist, but never really "clicked" with it (actually, I questioned it until I was asked not to come back by a couple of churches) and in middle school became an agnostic. When I reached college, I started with extensive Bible study and eventually had a spiritual experience that gave me the evidence that I needed in order to believe.

I am considered a "liberal" or "progressive" Christian, as I believe in marriage equality, I do not believe that homosexuality is a sin (and even if it was, it wouldn't be my business to cast judgement upon homosexuals), I believe that the universe is 13.8 billion years old, I believe in evolution, I don't proselytize, etc.

I also understand why people do not believe. If I had not had the personal experience that I did at that point in college, then I most likely would still not either. As it stands, I did and so I have unshakeable faith in God's existence.

What "evidence" from the Bible caused you to believe in it?



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30 Jan 2014, 10:14 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
AspE wrote:
ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
AspE wrote:
ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
There are things Evolutionary Theorists should try harder to explain.

Like what?

Most obvious is why did humans become humans and Chimpanzees stayed Chimpanzees.

Humans and chimps evolved from a common ancestor, so actually chimps did not "stay the same", they changed into chimps. But species diverge, it's quite common. You might as well ask why are there both dolphins and whales? Why are there both gorillas and chimps? They filled a different niche in the ecosystem. At one time there were many hominid species, some more apelike, some more like we are now. Many species died off for various reasons. I hope that answers your question. It's not something evolutionary biologists have ignored.

Dolphins and whales are similar in the way they think and behave so it's easy to discern they came from a similar ancestor yet evolved slightly differently.
I support Theory of Evolution, don't get me wrong, I just think it does a piss poor job of explaining why it is, exactly, in great detail, humans are so advanced compared to other species of primate.

I suspect you haven't been paying much attention. It's something scientists do think about. So far, we think it has something to do with climate change forcing us into the grasslands, where we were able to use tools to change our diet from primarily plants to primarily meat. This allowed a reduced gut, better running abilities, and lots of energy to spend on a large brain. This dynamic was a kind of feedback loop that arboreal primates lacked. But in evolutionary terms, we aren't that different from our ancestors. Relatively small changes in our genome can result in seemingly large changes to our bodies and behavior.



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30 Jan 2014, 11:07 am

Ilovemyaspiegirl wrote:
....I'm a Christian but not an extremist! .....But, I'm the mother of a 7 year old daughter with Aspergers and so I guess the stakes have been raised a bit.

While I believe in letting my children (once they're at an appropriate age of course) decide for themselves what they choose to believe in but, I've already raised one adult daughter and did so with a firm belief in God.....

So, now I'm a bit worried though because I've read so many posts from ppl here that claim they feel religion is a way way to manipulate ppl and so on. I think that's obviously been a basis to manipulate ppl for centuries by those that choose to do so but, I don't believe that's how God intended it to be and I would never allow my children to be exposed to ppl that are "that" kind of Christians. However, will my daughter one day feel like I used my own religious beliefs to manipulate her? Will she resent me for trying to encourage her to believe in God?....


There are some Christians who occasionally participate in the mayhem of the PPR section. So, she might grow up to be a Christian. However, don't expect her to be a Chrino (Christian in Name Only). If she does become a Christian, then she will probably have an obsessive interest in the religion, right down to wanting to study Biblical Hebrew and Greek. For a lot of us, it is either that, or no interest whatsoever.



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30 Jan 2014, 12:16 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
I support Theory of Evolution, don't get me wrong, I just think it does a piss poor job of explaining why it is, exactly, in great detail, humans are so advanced compared to other species of primate.
Naturally there is a greater demand for detail when it comes to the evolution of the human genome. What has happened, is that a mutation in a gene responsible for muscle development caused some huge chewing muscles, that other primates still have, to become much weaker in humans. In other primates, these muscles are so strong that the separate plates of the cranium is pulled together and fuse at an early age. In humans however, the plates stay separate until around the age of 30 and is instrumental to giving space for the growing brain.

I don't know what exact details you need in order to be satisfied, but there...

AspieOtaku wrote:
http://godisimaginary.com/ :D
Damn, that page still exists? Hahaha nice!


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