Page 2 of 3 [ 33 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

TheGoggles
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Oct 2013
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,060

12 Feb 2014, 12:24 am

Moviefan2k4 wrote:
had their amputated limbs grow back,


I'm not the kind of person that dons his euphoric fedora of wisdom every time somebody says they're a Christian, so I wasn't going to even say anything until I saw this part. As someone who has worked in the Christian media industry, I can tell you with complete certainty that I know how faith healing works. And the truth is, it really doesn't.

It's not true for the same reason that "The Secret" is clearly not true. Everyone supposedly has the capacity to heal anything if they just believe hard enough and get on God's VIP list. If this were the case, we'd all be pretty much immortal and there would be no debate whatsoever about which religion and which denomination was correct. Faith healing is a series of parlor tricks designed to associate men like Benny Hinn and Richard Roberts with divinity itself. Then you'll buy their t-shirts, and their books, and their DVD's. Because they're so close to God, if you've got a little piece of their mercantile empire, you're a little closer to God by proxy.



drh1138
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 2 Dec 2012
Gender: Male
Posts: 498

12 Feb 2014, 1:07 am

Moviefan2k4 wrote:
People have [...] had their amputated limbs grow back,


I'd love to be presented with incontrovertible evidence that this has happened. Seriously, this is the Holy Grail (pun not intended) of all medicine; if you could demonstrate regeneration in humans of lost limbs, it would be a guaranteed Nobel Prize.

Never mind that you can't prove any of those other things.

Quote:
...there's no way all of that is coincidence or deception.


Right. People have never exploited superstition for personal gain. :roll:



AspieOtaku
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2012
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,051
Location: San Jose

12 Feb 2014, 4:46 am

I killed god by paying attention in science class and opening my science text book! [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-bWz74h518[/youtube]


_________________
Your Aspie score is 193 of 200
Your neurotypical score is 40 of 200
You are very likely an aspie
No matter where I go I will always be a Gaijin even at home. Like Anime? https://kissanime.to/AnimeList


Last edited by AspieOtaku on 12 Feb 2014, 7:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

appletheclown
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 Apr 2013
Age: 29
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,378
Location: Soul Society

12 Feb 2014, 9:30 am

Image
On November 24, 2008 the Catholic Church proclaimed as blessed 188 Japanese martyrs from all walks of their county's way of life. Among them were several of those renown warriors, the samurai.
Christian Samurai in the News link
The Samurai with the Cross. From the Acts of the Martyrs of Japan link
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIUsaOxXpFU[/youtube]


_________________
comedic burp


Last edited by appletheclown on 12 Feb 2014, 9:42 am, edited 2 times in total.

GoonSquad
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 May 2007
Age: 52
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,748
Location: International House of Paincakes...

12 Feb 2014, 9:39 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
God is dead in modern times because science has killed him and humanity required philosophers to point this out. People relied once on faith, now on science so God is more unnecessary than ever before this is why the phrase God is dead was coined. Is God all that has perished? What about philosophers? Are they a complete waste of time, like some claim about religion? Are they even needed in the modern era?
What are your views on this archaic art?


Philosophy in the modern form is little more than mental masturbation. The original intent of Philosophy was to provide it's followers with a framework in which to build a good life. Classical philosophy is still worth a look--Modern, not so much.


_________________
No man is free who is not master of himself.~Epictetus


aghogday
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,912

12 Feb 2014, 10:11 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
Aghogday,
What philosophers meant is not the rise in numbers of non believers, rather, the fact people rely less on faith to solve problems, more on science and this has occurred the world over. It is a global phenomenon. People do not consciously acknowledge it but you see it everyday in how they solve problems. They run to the doctor, not the faith healer. They research instead of praying at the alter. They experiment instead of consulting the Pope. Whether believers wish to acknowledge or not, science has, indeed, replaced God. Only in the sanctum sanctorium of the church is God living.


Hmm..well the world is a little bigger than the US..while true in our culture..to some extent and perhaps true in your area of the country..
not true at all where i live in the deep south..it's still the land of the 6000 year old earth..if ya get my drift...and seriously to a large extent..it is
still that way in much of the rural red state US...
and oh my GOD..certainly not true in Muslim Countries..
perhaps moving in that direction..but a far journey still to take...

And even in eastern philosophies..what many folks would likely call 'WOO' on this little segment of the web...
is a way of life there..for literally close to a billion folks...

It's a complex world..but we live in only a very small part of it..
relatively speaking..per our limited perceptions..of how we individually see life...

No.. no global replacement of GOD at ALL..at least per ALL the evidence that exists..on this...in the ENTIRE WORLD..

THERE ARE BILLIONS OF US..about 7 at last count...
300 MILLION even IS kinda a few drops in the bucket..overall..still...at about 4 or 5 percent..in our relatively small part that is
US..sometimes..we tend to view our global pants..
as a little larger than WHAT they really are..as metaphor...in THIS MUCH bigger WORLD....

And the phrase 'GOD IS DEAD' attributed to Nietzsche in his little corner ..of Europe..iS certainly only reflective..
of where he lived..Nietzche was an idealist..yes..but certainly no anthropologist..as he had a disdain for human cultivated..
systems..of almost all types..

Culture is as natural as the digits on our fingers..and the prehensile THUMB and written language..
is after all IS SAID AND DONE..what started this whole thing..and our abstract ideas of what the power and force of all of nature IS..
whether the abstract term used is GOD or nature....OR SERIOUSLY WHATEVA THE F**...

IT
s universal..we can attempt to put chains on it..THROUGH HUMAN ANIMAL ABSTRACT LANGUAGE DERIVED FROM
COLLECTIVE HUMAN INTELLIGENCE..RESULTING CULTURES..AND THE FIRST ATTEMPTS AT WRITTEN LANGUAGE..WITH THOSE DIGITS
AND PREHENSILE THUMB...

but it's just decoration..for the essence of what
TRULY IS
GOD ..NATURE..TAI CHI..THE TAO..THE DAO..THE QI..THE GREAT ANIMAL SPIRIT..THE CHRIST ENERGY..ALLAH..ALLAHGODALLAH..THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD...
OR THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF RELIGIONS..AND BILLIONS OF PEOPLE...
TRYING TO ABSTRACTLY DESCRIBE THE FORCE AND POWER..
THAT CONNECTS AND MAKES ALL OF THIS WORK....AS IT IS CURRENTLY
PUT TOGETHER...
AS
IS
[email protected]

BUT NONE OF IT CHANGES THE TRUTH..
AND THE FORCE AND POWER THAT IS GOD..
NOT EVEN ONE IOTA..
OTHER THAN THE FACT THAT GOD CHANGES..
AS huMAN TOO..
IS
GOD...2


_________________
KATiE MiA FredericK!iI

Gravatar is one of the coolest things ever!! !

http://en.gravatar.com/katiemiafrederick


salamandaqwerty
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Nov 2013
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,378

12 Feb 2014, 1:15 pm

Quote:
God is dead in modern times because science has killed him and humanity required philosophers to point this out. People relied once on faith, now on science so God is more unnecessary than ever before this is why the phrase God is dead was coined. Is God all that has perished? What about philosophers? Are they a complete waste of time, like some claim about religion? Are they even needed in the modern era?
What are your views on this archaic art?


Philosophy, the arts and free thought are of utmost importance to any civilization in my opinion.
whether people lay the knife to the throat of god and sacrifice the concept of god on an alter of science or belief is up to the individual. The goal of philosophy was not simply to kill god. It is to question everything even the relevance of it's own purpose through epistemology. It is important to question, It is the cornerstone of scientific process, Without anyone first questioning 'why' there would be no science, science is therefor a branch of philosophy as is theology. Philosophy will remain inherently important until there is no further need to ask 'why'.


_________________
Man is condemned to be free; because once thrown into the world, he is responsible for everything he does


aghogday
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,912

12 Feb 2014, 2:17 pm

TheGoggles wrote:
Moviefan2k4 wrote:
had their amputated limbs grow back,


I'm not the kind of person that dons his euphoric fedora of wisdom every time somebody says they're a Christian, so I wasn't going to even say anything until I saw this part. As someone who has worked in the Christian media industry, I can tell you with complete certainty that I know how faith healing works. And the truth is, it really doesn't.

It's not true for the same reason that "The Secret" is clearly not true. Everyone supposedly has the capacity to heal anything if they just believe hard enough and get on God's VIP list. If this were the case, we'd all be pretty much immortal and there would be no debate whatsoever about which religion and which denomination was correct. Faith healing is a series of parlor tricks designed to associate men like Benny Hinn and Richard Roberts with divinity itself. Then you'll buy their t-shirts, and their books, and their DVD's. Because they're so close to God, if you've got a little piece of their mercantile empire, you're a little closer to God by proxy.


Hmm..well science .. at least modern science does not agree with this...at this time...

The NOCEBO effect AND the opposite effect and affect from the PLACEBO EFFECT WHICH IS BASICALLY JUST THE 'SECRET' OF POSITIVE BELIEF IN A POSITIVE GOAL..WHATEVER IT MAY BE..IS REAL..
AND ACTUALLY CAN MAKE REAL DOCUMENTED MEDICAL DISORDERS HAPPEN IN REAL LIFE..

BUT..please don't take my word for it..

Science is up to par..finally on this..after about 2000 years..and 'silly' rants by folks like the historical man Jesus..

on the REAL HEALING..OR YES POTENTIAL DESTRUCTIVE HUMAN POWER
OF
BELIEF...NEGATIVE OR POSITIVE.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/own ... our-health

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2hO4_UEe-4[/youtube]

AND NO.. OF COURSE it's not going to regenerate an amputated limb..

But in the case of ONE OF THE worst of human maladies..and most common BEING arthritic pain..IT is already a well known fact..

that the pain of severe arthritis..per the underlying physiological effects..varies depending on the psychological state..
of the person..who has those x-ray and MRI..identified deficits..in human JOINT health...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzrjEP5MOT4[/youtube]

And yes it is a scientific fact now that STRESS KILLS..

And yes of course a positive attitude..makes all the difference in the world... on that..

One man's stress is another WOman's challenge and path to success...

Attitude..and positive or negative belief..and yes apathy too..makes us
more fully
what
we are...

With WILL WE HAVE THE POWER TO CHANGE THIS THROUGH THE POWER OF BELIEF..
WITHOUT THAT WE ARE..WELL..
BASICALLY
WET
NOODLES....[/metaphor}(ONLY);)
AND NOT WELL @ALL...

Some folks find this through a belief in the healing power of GOD..
and some folks find it through watching some videos above that say humans can heal themselves..
and believe it..
but the bottom line IS
IT WORKS IN REAL LIFE..A SCIENTIFICALLY DOCUMENTED FACT NOW 2..

SO the folks in the past that did not believe i
T..when just Jesus and those other historical dudes wERE teaching this...

Well..that was only tHEIR loss..
Not the folks that believed IT and YES in TRUE SCIENTIFIC AFFECT AND EFFECT..
SIMPLY HEALED THEMSELVES OR PREVENTED GREATER ILL..
THROUGH
THE POWER AND FORCE..
OF POSITIVE BELIEF..NO MATTER THE OBJECT..CONNECTED TO
THAT
BELIEF.

THIS AIN'T WOO..
IT'S REAL..BELIEF..
[email protected]

but i ain't buying no DVD's..
with my monthly fee for broad band access..
the rest of youtube..is free..:)


_________________
KATiE MiA FredericK!iI

Gravatar is one of the coolest things ever!! !

http://en.gravatar.com/katiemiafrederick


DentArthurDent
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Jul 2008
Age: 57
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,884
Location: Victoria, Australia

13 Feb 2014, 6:11 am

Moviefan2k4 wrote:
God is far from dead; the existence of things unexplainable by science proves that. People have had their amputated limbs grow back,



OK for once you have claimed something Objective. Moviefan I am calling you out. Have the courage of your convictions and statements. You have just stated a factual occurrence, show me the evidence and I will believe.

Sincerely, show me the evidence of human limbs re-growing without any form of mundane intervention and I will become a believer.

This is no trick, no intervention of the devil, demonstrate that human limbs can regrow without any medical intervention and I will praise god and ask for salvation.

Up to you now.


_________________
"I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance anyday"
Douglas Adams

"Religion is the impotence of the human mind to deal with occurrences it cannot understand" Karl Marx


appletheclown
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 Apr 2013
Age: 29
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,378
Location: Soul Society

13 Feb 2014, 8:30 am

DentArthurDent wrote:
Moviefan2k4 wrote:
God is far from dead; the existence of things unexplainable by science proves that. People have had their amputated limbs grow back,



OK for once you have claimed something Objective. Moviefan I am calling you out. Have the courage of your convictions and statements. You have just stated a factual occurrence, show me the evidence and I will believe.

Sincerely, show me the evidence of human limbs re-growing without any form of mundane intervention and I will become a believer.

This is no trick, no intervention of the devil, demonstrate that human limbs can regrow without any medical intervention and I will praise god and ask for salvation.

Up to you now.


Our hair, tongue, and finger nails.


_________________
comedic burp


Fnord
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2008
Age: 65
Gender: Male
Posts: 57,002
Location: Stendec

13 Feb 2014, 8:43 am

DentArthurDent wrote:
Moviefan2k4 wrote:
God is far from dead; the existence of things unexplainable by science proves that. People have had their amputated limbs grow back...
OK for once you have claimed something Objective. Moviefan I am calling you out. Have the courage of your convictions and statements. You have just stated a factual occurrence, show me the evidence and I will believe. Sincerely, show me the evidence of human limbs re-growing without any form of mundane intervention and I will become a believer. This is no trick, no intervention of the devil, demonstrate that human limbs can regrow without any medical intervention and I will praise god and ask for salvation. Up to you now.

Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen. Fundies have a knack for either ignoring challenges to their beliefs, flooding the conversation with convoluted doctrinal doubletalk in answer to a challenge, or attacking the character of the person who challenges them.

In this respect, they behave just like conspiracy theorists do.

Might as well add "Regenerate missing eyes and brain tissue" to the chalenge, since there is no valid evidence that these have occurred without medical intervention, either.



appletheclown
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 Apr 2013
Age: 29
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,378
Location: Soul Society

13 Feb 2014, 9:26 am

If God created people, and people created medicine using things God made, medical science would not exist without God.

His bible is there for those who wish to read it. The US has no law making Christianity forced upon everyone in it. Choose to or not to read/believe it. If I were to walk up to an atheist and say, "Have a bible!" he says "No, but thanks anyways.", I would be very satisfied with that polite response. I would give no less polite of a response to an atheist who walks up to me and says "Would you please read what your religion is doing to these homeless people?", I would say, "Thank you, I did not know my deacon was such a tosser! You are very kind!"

I love it when people get nasty over nothing. *sarcasm*


_________________
comedic burp


AspieOtaku
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2012
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,051
Location: San Jose

13 Feb 2014, 11:01 am

How can someone be dead if they don't exist?


_________________
Your Aspie score is 193 of 200
Your neurotypical score is 40 of 200
You are very likely an aspie
No matter where I go I will always be a Gaijin even at home. Like Anime? https://kissanime.to/AnimeList


appletheclown
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 Apr 2013
Age: 29
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,378
Location: Soul Society

13 Feb 2014, 12:08 pm

posted by accident


_________________
comedic burp


aghogday
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,912

13 Feb 2014, 1:54 pm

AspieOtaku wrote:
How can someone be dead if they don't exist?


Well in this case dead is a metaphor..not meant to be taken literally...

AT least that is HOW the original quote as designed by Nietzche was intended...

Got ain't a person..and while some people try..try..try.. to anthropomorphize GOD..

A force does not die..a force ONLY EXISTS...

OR DOES NOT EXIST...

SO PER THE TRUE GOD..PER THE IDEOLOGY OF FORCE...


IT'S A STATEMENT BY SOMEONE (NIETZCHE) WHO LIKE SO MANY FOLKS.. HERE..

was disgusted by so called Christians reading the New Testament literally..and old testament...

and making GOD into a friggin bearded man in the sky....

So he lashed out..like some folks do on this forum..BUT

It's just as fundamentalist thinking..to reduce everything in life..to what is only known in science...to date...

That's the kind of thinking..that kept the world flat as long as it was viewed that way..

It's only the out of the box..thinkers..that live on a round world..

The rest of them..might as well still live on a flat world..

But that ..my wrong planet discussion mate...

is another metaphor..that i will explain in further detail..if need be.....

LIFE IS A HELL OF LOT MORE COMPLICATED AND BEAUTIFUL AND UGLY THAN
WHAT SCIENCE CAN CURRENTLY MAKE IT OUT TO BE....in TECHNICAL DESCRIPTIONS...

BUT only each human being can potentially discern this for themselves as they evolve in one lifetime...
as living beings....Some folks never never escape the illusions of culture..

to even get
close.


_________________
KATiE MiA FredericK!iI

Gravatar is one of the coolest things ever!! !

http://en.gravatar.com/katiemiafrederick


ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,265

13 Feb 2014, 8:18 pm

God is Dead originally appeared in Goethe's Faust Nietzsche just borried.
How's that for controversial?