Are there evolutionary advantages to beta males?

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Are there evolutionary advantages to beta males?

I found these 2 articles interesting:

http://whiskeys-place.blogspot.com/2008 ... xists.html

http://whiskeys-place.blogspot.com/2008 ... pital.html

beta males are more advanced evolutionarily speaking. If you assume that early man (meaning men and women)were a rough and tumble bunch where survival of the physically fitest reigned, where muscle power ruled, doesn't it seem that the next step in evolution would be a world were reason and mental skill would be more important than physical power alone ?

If one assumes that evolution will fight to assure the continued survival and advancement of the human form I can see no other option.

If early man had to use physical power to "force" things to be to his liking and advantage....it would seem to be self evident that if you could use means other than physical to obtain results you'd be way ahead of the game....enter the beta male.

That is one aspect for one segment of the population, but there is a lot more complexity. Men and women on both sides are just looking to get the best they can get, and often will settle with a Beta for the stability, only to go off and procreate with an alpha the first chance they get. Unfortunately, sometimes this results in children. (Jerry Springer anyone?)

The good thing is not everyone is like that. There are relationships that transcend that, where it's not about money or social status, but rather about commitment, compassion, a desire to help those closest to you. That does in sum describe the beta, male or female. They are there for commitment, compassion, and not so much the shallow stuff.

Good men and women will value you for your compassion, intellect, desire to commit, willingness to work, and base little on whether you've got six-pack abs or a jaguar in your driveway. (With women I've gotten close to, that actually seems to be a turn-off.)

This is a not really the right question as the concept of alpha/beta males is much more ambiguous and dynamic in humans than it is in say wolves. In a biological sense it is really difficult to classify people as such. But the idea of beta males being and evolutionary advantage is false by definition, and also kind of a ridiculous thing to say.

What is true is human need a magnitude of skills to survive and that is why we have so many overlapping groups hierarchies, rather then a single group and leader with total control of breading. So I wouldn’t feel such as sense of injustice because with other animals the chance of you being dead wood is actually more likely.

As a beta male myself, I know I have a risk of that happening. Like you indicated, women have a high chance of trading me up for an alpha male who'll have sex with them, then leave them. Luckily, we have paternity tests now (cue Maury saying "you ARE NOT the father"). And if Maury ever said that to me, I'd dump my girlfriend on the spot, no questions asked. Of course, if I was the father, I'd take the high road, and raise the child with her.

I'm not bad-mouthing women here. But the truth it, you can't fight evolutionary biology. There are guys out there with such obscenely good pick-up skills (and probably great looks to boot), that no girl can resist them. That's who I'm worried about the most. And given how I am, even a guy with average pick-up skills might be able to steal my girlfriend away.

Luckily, I have a way to fight back. I'm well aware that I have no right to insist on having a good-looking girlfriend. So, I go for the ones that alpha males tend to shy away form, the ones no higher than a 6 or even a 5 on the attractiveness scale. I'm a solid 4, by the way. So, by intentionally looking for a girlfriend who isn't very attractive, I reduce my chances of losing her to an alpha male. Because in their minds, they "can do better", and will leave my girlfriend alone. I'll leave the worry of someone stealing their girlfriend to alpha males. I call my method "the unnatural selection", and it got me a few great relationships (not just sex partners, but actual relationships).

Last edited by Aspie1 on 04 Oct 2009, 12:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I think the point of the 2 articles is that logically tool-makers are the better survival mate, than the gorillas, but that people are not driven by logic, not because of the mysterious power of love, but because evolution has its own logic, that has not kept up with the rapid pace of technology. The article also argues that due to the invention of romantic love in the Middle Ages, the lesser extent of harems, and the relative assurance of mates for beta males, the west was able to overtake other societies in technology. However he warns that the dating capital of beta males has plummeted precipitously in the last 50 years or so.

Of course Alpha and Beta may not be the best terms, but since they are popular and well-known, the general stereotype fits.

I don't think you grasped what I said. It is not just a question of semantics. They really don’t fit the human model that well. You are oversimplifying things and using floored logic.

Firstly, evolutionary psychology is often associated with a fallacy called "throw back" behaviour as if there is a direct communication with our ancestors and the past, rather then just similar behaviour traits. We share trait with both bonobos and chimps, as well as unique ones.

Secondly, you are not comparing like with like. A Gorilla is not a tool maker and gorillas are not found with apes that use tools. The great apes are mostly separated even bonobos and chimps (albeit by a river).

Thirdly, a tool maker is no good on his own if he cannot hunt. You need tool makers but you also need other abilities.

Fourthly, you are making the fallacy that you are some incapable of being illogical, or being less that logical is always bad. In fact you are like most human in you harbour delusions about yourself, and these can be useful sometimes. You logic like anyone’s only extends so far.

Fifth, genetics is about passing on genetic traits, not the same as cloning the person. People carry genetic traits that are dormant and do not make them the person they are.

http://blog.taragana.com/n/1-in-3-chine ... ds-176139/

numbers look ....sci-fi :-/

Around here I've heard anecdotal evidence of a bunch of beta males thinking they're alphas and expecting perfect 10 women and not settling for anything less. And then they're surprised when said women, if they get them at all, cheat on them with an alpha.

humans are following more and more the fake serial monogamy system of the birds (the flying birds at least) :Many of the social fathers are not the biological fathers of the offspring , not that extreme in the human society yet but we're on the right track to it .

It's really the most evolutionary advantageous system : giving the offspring the best genes from the best males + protection/care of 2 parents + decreasing the male aggression between males ,the bird system is evolutionary awesome.

Do Bete males get Alpha cast offs? If so where do I apply?

Yes, but they're not castoffs. First, find a financially well off area. You will find plenty of women who are, well, lonely for attention. An alpha male rarely has enough time/energy to give a woman in a long term relationship what they need.

Second, make yourself available and be prepared to offer 'help' in a variety of ways.

Example, during the dot com boom, many women were able to stay home, play house, decorate, raise kids, etc. The problem is the men were all working long hours to pay and deal with up and coming threats (e.g. the next batch of Stanford graduates making google). The women were frequently at home during the day, or walking/jogging, meeting their friends for coffee, or simply fixing up their homes.

Here's where the slacker landscaper/home painter came into play. While the husbands were gone playing alpha male, the beta's were 'working' with the wives on painting the house, hanging out at the coffee shops, jogging in the mid afternoons, etc.

You must ignore the lockdown ring. It's simply a distraction. These are genuinely lonely women.