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Roman
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pandabear
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09 Dec 2009, 2:49 pm

Interesting. I wonder why he went to Ukraine to do this? Do they pretty much just hand out doctoral degrees for doing next to nothing?



EC
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09 Dec 2009, 4:23 pm

I wonder if they did this just to piss off the Russians... Then again, the Russians like Nazis, so that probably won't work.



makuranososhi
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09 Dec 2009, 4:29 pm

EC wrote:
I wonder if they did this just to piss off the Russians... Then again, the Russians like Nazis, so that probably won't work.


Um, the comment above in bold/underlined is so incredibly inaccurate and out-right false, I'm not even sure where to begin. You might want to review your history, EC - WWII, Eastern Front, specifically.


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09 Dec 2009, 5:35 pm

pandabear wrote:
Interesting. I wonder why he went to Ukraine to do this? Do they pretty much just hand out doctoral degrees for doing next to nothing?


More likely because the subject matter of his dissertation is less taboo in the Ukraine than in the USA. Norman Finkelstein had his academic career wrecked for what you might call "less".
I think if you're an academic in the US and you want to write about such stuff, you really need to be tenured like Mearsheimer & Walt or Kevin MacDonald.



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10 Dec 2009, 12:20 pm

Actually M, they may not like the old school Nazis, but the Russians have quite a handful of neo-nazis, this has been documented for quite some time. If anything, there is quite a lot of racial intolerance of foreigners there.



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10 Dec 2009, 1:04 pm

Is there a doctorate in the house? topic

While honourary degrees are honourable, it depends on the dispensing institution.

Some are worth less than the ones you buy online from XYZ University.

I did not know there were diplomas in Racism 101. :twisted:


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makuranososhi
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10 Dec 2009, 2:52 pm

phil777 wrote:
Actually M, they may not like the old school Nazis, but the Russians have quite a handful of neo-nazis, this has been documented for quite some time. If anything, there is quite a lot of racial intolerance of foreigners there.


Racial intolerance, and being a Nazi, are two completely different things. I would not doubt that there is the former, but have seen nothing that indicates a change in hatred for Nazi Germany and the immense death toll and savagery of WWII.


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10 Dec 2009, 5:18 pm

It may be surprising to find out, but actually there is racism in Ukraine and Russia too.


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10 Dec 2009, 5:22 pm

makuranososhi wrote:
EC wrote:
I wonder if they did this just to piss off the Russians... Then again, the Russians like Nazis, so that probably won't work.


Um, the comment above in bold/underlined is so incredibly inaccurate and out-right false, I'm not even sure where to begin. You might want to review your history, EC - WWII, Eastern Front, specifically.


M.

Even better, look up the "Great Patriotic War" (the Soviet name for the Eastern front of WWII) and you'll get an idea. The Russians are far from being Nazis.


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Roman
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10 Dec 2009, 7:24 pm

sartresue wrote:
While honourary degrees are honourable, it depends on the dispensing institution.


David Duke got two degrees. First, he got a honorary one. Then later he decided to do all the exams, coursework, thesis paper, etc. and fulfilled all the requirenments that earned him the actual degree.

pandabear wrote:
Interesting. I wonder why he went to Ukraine to do this? Do they pretty much just hand out doctoral degrees for doing next to nothing?


I don't know about educational system in Ukraine but I have a good reason to guess it is approximately the same as in Russia. If so, it is far better than in USA. The first two years of college program in USA is high school program in Russia. The first year of Russian college is the same as the third year of college in USA. And in Russia they don't choose majors; they applly to the department, not to school, so they already know their major right when they get there. In other words, they are far more prepared than Americans.

I believe, like others said, the reason David Duke had to go to Ukraine has to do with the fact that his ideas are more politically correct over there than in USA, or most of Europe for that matter. In terms of the amount of work, he actually has an impressive list of sources and stuff.

makuranososhi wrote:
Racial intolerance, and being a Nazi, are two completely different things. I would not doubt that there is the former, but have seen nothing that indicates a change in hatred for Nazi Germany and the immense death toll and savagery of WWII.


Exactly. And in these terms, there is no evidence David Duke ever supported actual Nazis. What he is accused of (which he denies) is white supremacism and antisemitism, but this is not the same thing as Nazism. If anything, his only "racist" connection is KKK, which is linked to America, not Germany, and KKK existed long before Hitler came to power.

As a side note, it is true there are neo-Nazis in Russia. I believe they have simply forgotten that Nazis didn't esteem Russians very highly either (Russians were also one of the "worse" races, although not as bad as Jews). So they call themselves neo-Nazis and claim to support Hitler, simply because they hate Jews. But they forgot that he would diagree with them in just about every other point.

But again, it has nothing to do with David Duke. He never claimed any association with Nazism. And by the way when it comes to Russians he disagrees with Nazis. Nazis thought that Russians are one of the lower races; David Duke, on the other hand, regards them as his white brothers that are very instrumental in the white survival (probably because he got a lot of support in this country).



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15 Dec 2009, 12:56 am

makuranososhi wrote:
EC wrote:
I wonder if they did this just to piss off the Russians... Then again, the Russians like Nazis, so that probably won't work.


Um, the comment above in bold/underlined is so incredibly inaccurate and out-right false, I'm not even sure where to begin. You might want to review your history, EC - WWII, Eastern Front, specifically.


M.


Better late than never. Correction: The Russians prefer/sympathize with the Nazis. The proof is in the pudding: Nazis are allowed to march, but genuine dissidents of the government are not; They are harassed, their permits for demonstrations are denied and if they dare do so anyway, they are beaten by OMON. That along with the bigoted view that Russians hold of immigrants. Those are the two things that make me spout such generalities. Hell, they don't even have to be immigrants - Chechens, or whatever group the government hates at the moment will do, too. Anyone who's not "white", really. Nazis beat and kill them, the government jails them and tortures them... Meh.



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15 Dec 2009, 12:28 pm

Roman wrote:
David Duke got two degrees. First, he got a honorary one. Then later he decided to do all the exams, coursework, thesis paper, etc. and fulfilled all the requirenments that earned him the actual degree.

I don't know about educational system in Ukraine but I have a good reason to guess it is approximately the same as in Russia. If so, it is far better than in USA. The first two years of college program in USA is high school program in Russia. The first year of Russian college is the same as the third year of college in USA. And in Russia they don't choose majors; they applly to the department, not to school, so they already know their major right when they get there. In other words, they are far more prepared than Americans.


Have you read any of Dr. Duke's writings on his website? He writes like an uneducated moron--not like an actual professor. Such mindless trash--he is worse than Rush Limbaugh.

His Ukrainian doctoral program can only have been garbage.



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17 Dec 2009, 1:06 pm

pandabear wrote:
Have you read any of Dr. Duke's writings on his website?


Yes I did.

pandabear wrote:
He writes like an uneducated moron--not like an actual professor. Such mindless trash--he is worse than Rush Limbaugh.


If you are talking about the level of professionalism in the writing, independent of the content, then you have to remember that he writes to general public, not to professors. I, for one, have ph.d. in physics, but I would never write on this message board in the same way as I wrote my thesis paper, it is just a common sense.

I think you have to ask yourself this question: if his writings were not racist, would you have been so quick to judge him and say that he is not very professional? What if someone else had exactly the same level of professionalism in their writing, but their message was in line with politically correct point of view, what would have been your opinion of them?


pandabear wrote:
His Ukrainian doctoral program can only have been garbage.


Obviously I don't know about that university from any source other than his website, but he claims it is one of the most famous ones in Ukraine. I don't think he would lie on this one, since a status of a given university is easilly verifiable by running a google search (I was just too lazy to do it).

I think it has more to do with the fact that his point of view is more acceptable in Ukraine than in the West.



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17 Dec 2009, 1:29 pm

Even though Duke is a racist bufoon I'm sure he is still an intelligent guy. Why is it such a big deal that he has a doctorate? I'm sure lots of controversial people have doctorates.


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21 Dec 2009, 2:09 pm

codarac wrote:
I think if you're an academic in the US and you want to write about such stuff, you really need to be tenured like Mearsheimer & Walt or Kevin MacDonald.


And even in that case, you're still likely to be slanted as a "bigot" if you manage to provided scientific evidence for politically incorrect claims. Look how individuals like Arthur Butz, Kevin MacDonald, Phillippe Rushton and many others like them are treated by the media and even academia.

history_of_psychiatry wrote:
Even though Duke is a racist bufoon I'm sure he is still an intelligent guy. Why is it such a big deal that he has a doctorate? I'm sure lots of controversial people have doctorates.


I guess some people are disturbed by the facts that there are intelligent people who disaprove of multiculturalism, the power of Jewish lobbies or other subjects that are not to be touched unless from pre-defined perspectives.