What if everyone were literal thinkers
11 Jan 2010, 3:48 pm
AceOfSpades wrote:
There would be even more misunderstandings. If you read between the lines of a vague comment, there are a lot of givens which you pick up on based on who the person is, what that person believes in, how that person behaves, etc. So in a normal conversation, you don't need to be that detailed since you can fill all the blanks.
If everyone was extremely literal, there would be non-stop arguments over semantics. Not only that, but all the obvious givens would have to be pointed out, making conversations long-winded and draining. It's supposed to be a conversation, not a lawyer reading my rights.
@0_equals_true: You have a link to that article? I'm not asking you for proof on anything, I'm just interesting in reading it.
If everyone was extremely literal, there would be non-stop arguments over semantics. Not only that, but all the obvious givens would have to be pointed out, making conversations long-winded and draining. It's supposed to be a conversation, not a lawyer reading my rights.
@0_equals_true: You have a link to that article? I'm not asking you for proof on anything, I'm just interesting in reading it.
I absolutely agree. There are misunderstandings sometimes, but they aren't that common. What vague, non-literal speech does is streamline talking and increase efficiency. It's like file compression. If an enormous amount of information can be conveyed in just a few vague words, then that's the way to go. And when two people know each other well, a verbal shorthand evolves that lets the two people communicate very efficiently. Only lawyers use literal language and then only when they need to as part of their job. Nobody has ever found legalese to be the most efficient and easiest to understand language even though it is the most literal. In fact, legalese is frequently misunderstood by non-lawyers because its' verbose literalness makes it hard to figure out exactly which part of the 10 page document is the part that contains the most important information.
11 Jan 2010, 11:18 pm
Quote:
You are demonstrating the problem with the lack of abstract thinking. Abstract thinking is the basis for logical deduction. Sometimes you don't have all the information so you have to work out what is inferred. The assumption that if everyone is literal minded they would all understand each other is unfounded. You can only convey a limited amount of information within a statement. Abstract reasoning is a skill, people incorrectly think it has to do with subjectivity and vagueness when it fact it is about getting the message across, overtime conventions will be established.
Ok, I misunderstood. Maybe I'm more abstract than I thought I was. I always thought it meant that you kept vaguing it up more and more. Are you saying I'm not a good abstract thinker? If so, how can I program well?
Quote:
The second is just a poor phrase. You can rephrase the statement to “You are not entitled to what you haven’t earned” or “You are not entitled to take anything for free”. There are a number of socio-political arguments about whether the things people ‘earn’ really belong to them, and what constitutes earning, but I will stick to the original message first. ‘Nothing’ is referring to automatic entitlement. The inference is entitlement is contrasted with earning so they don’t contradict, which I agree is problematic. You made a number of logical fallacies in your deductions but despite that made valid points. However the purpose of this statement is to communicate something, so logically you would consider what would likely be the case. In reality the statement is really about people’s desire to hold onto what they have got, and defend this on the premise of having earned it.
Thank you! We have to constrain the subset to what you have said? I understand now? You and Tantybi make sense! What are my logical fallacies? Please point them out. I am sure I do have fallacies in my thinking. I could be completely wrong. If I am, then I am.
Quote:
If you are totally concrete and literal you are a very black and white thinker and incapable of more than base deductions, which means your logic barely scratches the surface. Black and white thinkers hold the belief they are very logical and there opinion is absolute truth because what they 'witness' must be true, when in fact logic requires work, it reveals many unknowns, you can't know everything and you aren't always right.
The honest truth is I do not know what thoughts in my head are correct and wrong. For all I know, all thoughts could be wrong in my head. In fact, if I can't always be right, then can I always be wrong? I have to assume I know nothing just like Socrates.
12 Jan 2010, 12:39 am
Quote:
The honest truth is I do not know what thoughts in my head are correct and wrong. For all I know, all thoughts could be wrong in my head. In fact, if I can't always be right, then can I always be wrong? I have to assume I know nothing just like Socrates.
I don't think anyone knows when they are wrong so all I can do is respect other peoples opinions and listen to what they have to say. Ask questions if someone has a different opinion than you or different point of view. That helps.
One of the things that annoys me about black and white thinkers is they are so closed minded and judgmental they don't want to be corrected and they never listen. That's one of the things I despise about them. Some of them don't also shut up until you agree with them and they keep shoving it in your face until you agree and they refuse to drop the topic until you agree. Another thing I hate about them. I am very hateful towards these people so I trash talk them.
I think this can all be corrected if they decide to work at it. Heck even some people off the spectrum have this issue. My dad has a cousin like this and she is not aspie. After seeing these people, I sure knew I did not want to be like them. So it amazes me how an aspie can go through many years of their life and still be this way without seeing any of these other people. They would see how irritating it is and they would want to change that about themselves because of a realization they had.
I wonder if it's even possible to be black and white and not have this stuff I listed above? I have had bad experiances with two black and white thinkers, my ex's, and now I despise them all. I loathe them.
