Animal Lovers?
Because animals, such as dogs, cats, birds,
need human companionship. It has been
this way for eons.
However, animals that are processed
for food have feelings and minds,
and writing/thinking about this
makes me sad. For example, no animal
would naturally drink the milk
of another animal beyond weaning age
and no animal would naturally
eat the flesh of another animal
with high cholestrol content.
GO ASPIE VEGETARIANS/VEGANS! You guys rock!
Because it was bred into them, by humans. Animals aren't naturally dependant on humans for survival or any projected emotional need (ie: companionship, love, etc.). The only reason pets exhibit this dependance is because they've been raised/bred to do so.
The existence of packs of wild domesticated dogs is proof of that.
Because animals, such as dogs, cats, birds,
need human companionship. It has been
this way for eons.
However, animals that are processed
for food have feelings and minds,
and writing/thinking about this
makes me sad. For example, no animal
would naturally drink the milk
of another animal beyond weaning age
and no animal would naturally
eat the flesh of another animal
with high cholestrol content.
GO ASPIE VEGETARIANS/VEGANS! You guys rock!
Because it was bred into them, by humans. Animals aren't naturally dependant on humans for survival or any projected emotional need (ie: companionship, love, etc.). The only reason pets exhibit this dependance is because they've been raised/bred to do so.
The existence of packs of wild domesticated dogs is proof of that.
Why do you assume that "wild" excludes a need for companionship, etc.? In wolves, for example, if the pack leader rejects one of its pack and the other animals follow suit, the lone wolf becomes dejected, not unlike depression, and likewise doesn't survive, thrive or flourish well on its own and often times will die that way left to its own.
The existence of packs of wild domesticated dogs is proof of that.
Why do you assume that "wild" excludes a need for companionship, etc.? In wolves, for example, if the pack leader rejects one of its pack and the other animals follow suit, the lone wolf becomes dejected, not unlike depression, and likewise doesn't survive, thrive or flourish well on its own and often times will die that way left to its own.
So you propose that animals have a similar emotion to our companionship that's unrelated to it's basic instict to survive?
If a wolf gets disowned by it's pack, then the natural conclusion is that it will die. Perhaps, in part, because of what you say but largely because it knows only how to hunt in a group. If left alone it has no previous experience to call upon and is unable to catch enough prey to survive (unless it manages to find a human settlement for scavenging).
^I have seen animals very well appear to be grieving for the loss of their owner, for example, and there are countless examples where we can see an animal being hurt, rejected, angry, desperate. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, it's probably a duck. Why shouldn't they feel when we do? Or, some of us do anyway.
It seems to be human nature to look at an animal's feelings or existence as less important or lower than our own.
I'm often surprised in how some people including religionists believe an animal has no soul or ie sentience. I think it's strange in what how we view most life forms from a non-pragmatic point of view.
_________________
I live as I choose or I will not live at all.
~Delores O’Riordan
Me neither.
I knew I was always different even as a child.
Me too...
me three...
_________________
As long as man continues to be the ruthless destroyer of lower living beings he will never know health or peace. For as long as men massacre animals, they will kill each other.
-Pythagoras
You'll just get fat and constipated if you eat too much meat. It's not hurting me, just yourself.
I will keep eating meat for the time being, and I balance it with other meals. Since my food is more balanced it is a ton of times healthier than the vegetables-only diet.
_________________
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You'll just get fat and constipated if you eat too much meat. It's not hurting me, just yourself.
I will keep eating meat for the time being, and I balance it with other meals. Since my food is more balanced it is a ton of times healthier than the vegetables-only diet.
I hope I wasn't too hostile with you.
_________________
As long as man continues to be the ruthless destroyer of lower living beings he will never know health or peace. For as long as men massacre animals, they will kill each other.
-Pythagoras
techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,150
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi
I think its fairly safe to say that we are animals - soul or no soul - and that while people can draw a lot of comfort and even health benefits from having warm relationship to a pet like say a cat or dog, its important to keep in perspective that it is a matter of heirarchy. We're providing something - I guess you could look at part of that relationship as the joy of being a provider, a bit like being a parent, but at the same its important to realize that animal behavior can't be praised that much over human, when someone does make that break and loves animals to the exclusion of humans, its something of a fantasized sense of reality and it usually comes at the cost of further, and unnecessarily, damaging their interactions and empathy for other people.
_________________
“Love takes off the masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within. I use the word "love" here not merely in the personal sense but as a state of being, or a state of grace - not in the infantile American sense of being made happy but in the tough and universal sense of quest and daring and growth.” - James Baldwin
I think its fairly safe to say that we are animals - soul or no soul - and that while people can draw a lot of comfort and even health benefits from having warm relationship to a pet like say a cat or dog, its important to keep in perspective that it is a matter of heirarchy. We're providing something - I guess you could look at part of that relationship as the joy of being a provider, a bit like being a parent, but at the same its important to realize that animal behavior can't be praised that much over human, when someone does make that break and loves animals to the exclusion of humans, its something of a fantasized sense of reality and it usually comes at the cost of further, and unnecessarily, damaging their interactions and empathy for other people.
My empathy for people is definitely damaged, so you have that right. I don't have any praise for humans at this point and animals can be a pain too in their own way but by far a much lesser degree than humans so I can't agree with you on that one. I'm much safer, happier and healthier now with my current perspective and I don't see that changing. If it does happen well then, maybe some healing will have taken place but I won't hold my breath on it.
techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,150
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi
That's fine so long as you aren't blocking great and loving people from your life along with the rest.
_________________
“Love takes off the masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within. I use the word "love" here not merely in the personal sense but as a state of being, or a state of grace - not in the infantile American sense of being made happy but in the tough and universal sense of quest and daring and growth.” - James Baldwin
That's fine so long as you aren't blocking great and loving people from your life along with the rest.
I'm not blocking. I'm very open and friendly and people generally like me a lot, IRL anyway. I've just gotten very burned by the people I thought were safe and trusted the most, because of my gullibility and naivete', so I have to find better ways to protect me. A healthy degree of hatred is reasonably fair under the circumstances.
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