For guys who are lonely and seeking women

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I have a question for all of you. I know that there is a lot of guys on this forum who are lonely hearts, who have been ignored, who believe nice guys always finish last, who contemplate being alone, etc and so forth. I understand how you guys feel, after all, I'm one of you.

I digress, so I will ask my question. My question is "What keeps you guys searching for women romantically, after all the things that have happened to you?". I'm not trying to be sarcastic or hateful, I really want to know what keeps you guys going, despite all the mishaps that you have encountered?

When I think about, I would think that if someone did something, and they kept having negative experiences each time they did this particular action, they would give up doing the thing that causes them to have the negative experience. What keeps people who are unsuccessful in beginning or maintaining a relationship from doing the same thing over and over?

Yes, I know what I'm saying is a defeatist attitude, but I suppose that is because I don't see the necessity of trying if it yields to the same result.

I'm not sure exactly how to answer that question, because to be honest, it never occurred to me why I keep trying. I'll break my answer down, point by point.

The reason I keep trying, is because:

I've had success in the past, and thoroughly enjoyed the "perqs."

Lust drives me to keep attempting, and learning from my mistakes.

Because even if I'm socially stunted and feel limited <---(I hate to say that about myself) I know I can find people out there who are willing to date me.

I'm worth it.

Right now, for me, the main reason I don't go out and look is because I KNOW I am going to fail.

I am 41, soon to be 42. Have pretty much been friend zoned or flat out rejected since I have been looking for a healthy relationship since i was 17 or so. That is alot of rejection to put up with, I'd say 99.9% of the time it happens like this.

My heart can only take so much hurt. Right now not finding anyone is a defense for me for not getting hurt.

Keep in mind I am not talking about sex, I know I can go and hire a pro whenever I want. its not the same. I want a health sig other relationship that may lead to marraige.

EDIT: Sorry I misread the question I thought it asked why people stop looking.

Last edited by KenM on 19 Jan 2010, 6:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

Logically, what you're saying makes perfect sense if you are talking about someone who has NEVER had any success in seeking whoever. However there is, at a minimum, a biological initiative at work that makes people tend to attempt to "adapt" (i.e. "giving up" on a particular tactic, instead of the pursuit in general). I believe you yourself have posted about attempting to "reinvent" yourself and change your strategies as a means of finding success with women, right? I feel like that's a pretty natural response to repeated failures in the pursuit. I think in general, people usually give up entirely only when all other possibilities have been exhausted.

Some people can conceive of (and implement) more possible courses of action, or maintain efforts for longer before becoming truly "defeated", than others can; hence, those people continue to try.

Because there's a risk of people questioning your sexuality if you're without a partner, for a prolonged time and at a certain age.

That, and the simple fact it feels good to have attained romantic love, it's a feeling like nothing else.

Jees. I can imagine the conversation with a future girlfriend:
"So Keeno, why do you like me?"
- "Why do I like you??????"
"Yes. Why do you want to be with me?"
- "Well if I'm alone for too long people might start to think I'm queer."

Optimism.

The belief that there is the 'one' out there in the 3+ billion women on this planet. This is buoyed by the fleeting relationships I do have and the women who want me - but just aren't my type and not the 'one'.



The self-delusion that things will be better 'next time'. With a little better information, a little bit more self improvement, a little of ... Basically the gambler's error that the next time will be better. There is always the blame game, "it is their fault, and not mine". Or "this is simply who I am and if they can't handle it, they're not the one."

So ultimately, hold on to hope and make yourself ready for the possiblity. The worst situation will be where you weren't ready and the situation arose.

Well, what you say makes sense, in a Darwinist way almost. True, we aren't undergoing physical alterations to enhance our chance at survival in our current environment, however if one is to be romantically successful, they have to adapt to their environment to have a better chance of mating and passing off their best traits to the next generation. A good observation.

Yes, I did make a post about "reinventing" yourself using pick up artist tactics to improve your chances with the opposite sex. It involved subtle manipulation and social skills. However I've had time to think about what I posted, and I really wonder if women are worth that much effort. What I mean is guys who are lonely, or even some guys who aren't lonely, chase woman as a dog chases after a cat.

I just think about the amount of time some guys invest into women, and I wonder if it really is worth all the effort. In a sense, we are ultimately left to the scrutiny of the women we chase after. Considering aspies in particular, I believe that our female peers are not interested in us because we are introverts, who tend to be shy, nice, etc. Women may like us as friends, but because we are nice and unassertive, we are never considered romantically, thus leading to resentment on our parts. I often see guys on here complain about "bad boys (and by the way, I don't buy this whole "bad boy" argument. What guys might consider "bad boys" might just be guys who are more extroverted, more assertive, more charismatic, etc)" always winning the girls, instead of them. Tell me, who rejected you, the girl you were chasing after, or the guy whom she choose over you?

Maybe it's just me who thinks like this, I thought I'd put my two cents in.

speaking of darwinism, I have to wonder whether the vast unsuccessfulness of people with AS in terms of relationships is a big neon sign saying Nature really doesn't want us to breed? And those that succeed, are succeeding IN SPITE of nature, not because of it?

Sexual reproduction isn't required for the propogation of genes. Check out the Hardy Weinberg theory / principle.

Basically, your siblings share your AS genotypes. You not breeding but making the "family" successful so they can breed will help propogate those genes indirectly.

Babies are very vulnerable and child death is one of the key measurements of a health of a society (infant mortality rates). By having many siblings, aunts and uncles and only a few children, those children are more likely to survive, grow and suceed in life. Evolutionarily speaking.

The same thing can be said of having that "gay uncle" who takes an interest (non-sexual of course!) in the nieces and nephews, helping them grow, mentoring them, and ultimately passing on the fruits of his labor. The genotype of the family continues even though he never had offspring.

Of course it could be said, as it is said by my family, "you're just an alien, you don't understand", to which I chuckle as I am reminded of the avatar of WP.

Eh, that depends on how many siblings such a person has, if any, and whether the siblings reproduce. Out of 4 kids, only my sister had any.

One qualitative difference between being rejected by a girl and getting an electric shock every time I open the bread basket is that there is not as much to lose/gain. I don't have to eat bread, I can always eat something else. However, quite frankly I don't see any alternatives to a stable relationship with a woman to satisfy my desire for a relationship - this is a trivial truth, but at least a counterexample to the general rule of yours that I quoted.

You're not the first person to mention the "one" to me, nor will you be the last. I find this romantic idea of the "one" to be interesting. You said that hopefully out of 3+ billion women, there is the "one". However, I believe that there is a select group of woman who you are most compatible with via interests, beliefs, ideas, etc. Of course, you will never meet most of these women, but any one of them could be the one you find yourself most happy with.

I also think this notion of the "one" is a psychological stalling tactic to give someone a glimmer of hope, despite their current situation, and to help them from sliding into apathy or depression. "I will meet the perfect guy/girl someday (depending on your sexual preference), and I'll fall in love, and everything will work out". However, there is no perfect "one", everyone has their individual flaws and shortcomings, and I believe that love and relationships are a serious of compromises, as opposed to fairytale endings, which is what comes to mind when I hear the term this silly term known as the "one". I know that, and I haven't even been in a real relationship

Everything else you said makes sense and I agree with. Yes, there is always the blame game, which is not productive, but at least it gives you a sense of control and that what happens to you is an influence other than your own.

This is a very interesting question that I had a hard time answering once I really thought about it.

After mulling it over, I have to conclude that simple biological imperative has to be a major component, this would tend to explain the apparent irrationality of continuing after many years of failure.

In my case, I think vanity also has something to do with it. Rightly or wrongly, I tend to view being single as a personal failure which offends my ego (like other people really care whether I'm single or not). This can be a very powerful motivator. Many years ago, I was involved in a boating accident that very easily could have killed me. The only thing that kept me swimming after I perceived that my body was totally exhausted was the thought that it was such a stupid way to die.

So I've concluded that giving up is not an option even if I know that the chances of success are quite remote.

Also, I think there are beneficial side-effects to the effort, the constant changing of tactics, venue, objectives, etc. that are part of the effort keep life interesting and I think promote general well-being beyond that provided by romantic love.

The way to cope with the depression resulting from frequent and unvarying rejection is to keep making the effort without regard to the probability of success: The "Don Quixote" principal.

This keeps me reasonably happy under the circumstances, although SSRI's don't hurt either ;o)

I agree. The one does not mean there is only a singular woman out there. There's a contigent of women who will meet your needs and make you happy. Humans are adaptable and there are only a finite number of specific characteristics which we will not accomodate.

For some people, it may be 1:1,000,000, and if you live in a town of 20,000 and never leave, your odds or meeting someone who matches your criteria diminishes. However Bayesian statistics dictate there is a finite number of women you do need to meet prior to encountering the "one".



Well, looking at it strictly from a mathematical perspective, assuming the 1:1,000,000 holds true, there are thousands of matches. However, most people aren't picky. Encountering and dating even 1,000 (a high number even by today's standards) women will yield a potential match. For most people, if they went on 50 dates, they would encounter someone who matches.

I will agree with your point of "love and relationships are a serious of compromises", but on some things, people will not compromise. This may be their core beliefs, principles or even tastes.

So if a person makes a list of all the "must haves" traits embodied in their partner, most lists will be under 100. Add in a LOT of preferences and the list may break 250 total. And this is the "ideal" description.

Now we know that human psychological is remarkable adaptable (e.g. Stockholm syndrom) so a person can, with the right stimuli adjust and accept nearly everything.

So, playing the odds, throw in Bayesian probability, and adjust for human pyschology and one study I read reported 43 dates was sufficient to meet the "one".

I tried to date/enter a relationship about 4 times, and none of them reached fruition (or anything long term . . . and no, sex was not involved). I guess my problem was that I honestly didnt know what i was wanting out of a relationship, not to mention that most people either overlook me, or something about me is intimidating. To this day, i dont know how i would even show my interest, let alone know what to do to keep it going (there is one im attracted to right now, but I only see her once in a while, and she's working when i do). Then again, im the typical game guy, and unfortunately not many women here are into that (and the ones that are have already found someone). Then there's the constant fear of drama . . . i dont want it, i dont need it.

But, id say the big thing is my defensive nature . . . i cannot stand making the first move (or what i call, "the first mistake"). Even then, if i were to be approached, id probably freeze up out of shock. I may try something online sometime in the future, but im not one to get my hopes up on anything (that and im not in a good financial or social situation, seeing as how i work 12-14 hrs a week and had to move back in with my parents).