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timeisdead
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16 Feb 2010, 7:04 am

They claim we have an inability to generalize but on the same token don't many NTs have the inability to specifiy (note that I said many, not all)? It seems they lack the ability to pick up differences in the usage of language. I know much of the generalization is used to support their own theories in life but these generalizations are often full of logical fallacies.



FireMinstrel
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16 Feb 2010, 7:48 am

What's worse is that many people see those who specify things a lot as creepy.
I remember back in college when I'd devoured this biography on Led Zeppelin, and was discussing the band with a friend. I'd brought up some detail about the circumstances in which one of their songs was written. My friend looked at me weird and began making sarcastic comments about how the author must be some kind of loser for remembering all those details. Then I got angry and began insulting him by saying that he doesn't even try to learn anything, and that generalizing all the time and treating everything like a joke would guarantee him a lifelong residence in his parents' house.
Glad to say though that we're still friends, and now he's very much into specifics with his new love: live sound equipment, which he takes very seriously. He also has his own apartment. :P



pandd
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16 Feb 2010, 8:10 am

timeisdead wrote:
They claim we have an inability to generalize but on the same token don't many NTs have the inability to specifiy (note that I said many, not all)? It seems they lack the ability to pick up differences in the usage of language. I know much of the generalization is used to support their own theories in life but these generalizations are often full of logical fallacies.

No, they do not, most can can be quite specific when it is utilitarian to do so.

Most people most of the time do not need to pick up the specifics of language that you refer to. It's just not a particularly necessary skill for day to day functioning.

Most people are quite capable of being specific about things they might need to be specific about, when it suits them and according to their needs, although there is of course the usual variation in language skills that can impact on the ability of some individuals to communicate in a specific manner.



CTBill
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16 Feb 2010, 4:19 pm

FireMinstrel wrote:
...biography on Led Zeppelin... I'd brought up some detail about the circumstances in which one of their songs was written.

Just out of curiosity, was that Hammer of the Gods? I read it about 25 years ago now. If so, which song? I wonder if I can still remember the circumstances...



ursaminor
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16 Feb 2010, 4:40 pm

Led Zeppelin was a name that was thought up by someone after he heard how good his idea was (it was going to go down like a "lead zeppelin") and to avoid mispronounceation as Leed Zeppelin, he made the name Led Zeppelin.

Perhaps you could have simply stated: "Inabilities to generalize, discuss."
Someone who helps me with my homework on Mondays and Fridays said that some autistics see every pen as a different pen (note, this is an example) and they have to try out every new pen, while NTs usually see some pens and they know how pens work.
This is in an evolutionary perspective, very useful, but like many evolutionarily useful traits, it has lost its usefulness in the modern world.
I have problems with seeing every person as equal, except equal in rights.
I see every person as a different person, although I am almost certain that lots of people do this, but I have some problems with generalizing.



Michael_Stuart
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16 Feb 2010, 4:44 pm

When I'm talking about something, I'll usually make a broad statement and then say "Well, I guess technically you could if..." and go on to explain some way to do the thing I generalized as not being possible.



timeisdead
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16 Feb 2010, 10:53 pm

ursaminor wrote:
Led Zeppelin was a name that was thought up by someone after he heard how good his idea was (it was going to go down like a "lead zeppelin") and to avoid mispronounceation as Leed Zeppelin, he made the name Led Zeppelin.

Perhaps you could have simply stated: "Inabilities to generalize, discuss."
Someone who helps me with my homework on Mondays and Fridays said that some autistics see every pen as a different pen (note, this is an example) and they have to try out every new pen, while NTs usually see some pens and they know how pens work.
This is in an evolutionary perspective, very useful, but like many evolutionarily useful traits, it has lost its usefulness in the modern world.
I have problems with seeing every person as equal, except equal in rights.
I see every person as a different person, although I am almost certain that lots of people do this, but I have some problems with generalizing.


I see the point of generalizing when it comes to safety or for the purpose of identifying objects but I dislike how many NTs generalize the world so much that there are no true exceptions to their rules and even those exceptions never count.



Callista
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16 Feb 2010, 10:59 pm

NTs can generalize because the specifics come across in their nonverbal communication. Never having to be extremely specific, they never learn it unless they specifically set out to do so. It's one of those annoying communication gaps that have to be crossed when NT and autistic want to get information from one head to another.


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timeisdead
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16 Feb 2010, 11:34 pm

Callista wrote:
NTs can generalize because the specifics come across in their nonverbal communication. Never having to be extremely specific, they never learn it unless they specifically set out to do so. It's one of those annoying communication gaps that have to be crossed when NT and autistic want to get information from one head to another.


Yeah, they can communicate through body language. Maybe since they are so used to not thinking in a hypercategorized way, that's why they even use many generalizations online, where their body language isn't visible and their tone of voice isn't heard. Many misunderstandings on web forums occur because of this.



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18 Feb 2010, 7:40 am

CTBill wrote:
FireMinstrel wrote:
...biography on Led Zeppelin... I'd brought up some detail about the circumstances in which one of their songs was written.

Just out of curiosity, was that Hammer of the Gods? I read it about 25 years ago now. If so, which song? I wonder if I can still remember the circumstances...


There is a new Led Zeppelin biography it is called "When Giants Walked the Earth: A Biography of Led Zeppelin". It seemed interesting but too expensive. I heard that Jimmy and Plant were against it being published because there are too many details in it. I read the first few pages in a bookstore and the book starts with a story about about girls and drug abuse. I thought "Well that is because they didn't like it being published!".



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18 Feb 2010, 7:46 am

I find that I have the opposite problem. Maybe I generalize a little too much. And especially when it comes to people who are similar to the people who gave me a hard time, in high school.


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