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JoeR43
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24 Feb 2010, 3:55 pm

So, I've been in my current job (Cost Estimator / Research Analyst) for about a year now, and unfortunately, things aren't going too well anymore.

Classic aspie sob story: I'm good at the big things that you find on the job description, like statistical / economic analysis, data manipulation, computer skills, etc, but I'm terrible at the little intangible qualities that can really cause friction in the office.

While I don't think they want to fire me just yet, it's obviously a big concern and there could possibly be writing on the wall, so I'm looking to restart a job search tonight.

Some obvious questions:
1) How do you go about seeking other jobs while employed? I'd rather not put the final nail in my own coffin by just bet hedging. Also, since this is my first real meaningful employment (I'm 24 in a few weeks), I lack references and would probably have to use a coworker or two.
2) What kind of jobs should I look for? For background, I have my degree in Mathematical Sciences, and have just begun an online program for my MS in Statistics. Math is good money and relatively low stress, but it requires a lot of academic credentials, and I'm not sure where I can go w/ just a BS and 1 year of experience, even if I'm beginning to progress toward an MS.
3) More generally, what strategies have you used when backed in a corner professionally? Since I'm young and relatively cheap labor, I feel inclined to believe my company would rather retain me than let me go (and just cover their bases by proving I was warned, and then put me in a situation to fail), but I have a lot of work to do on that front.

Also, I've not disclosed my condition or my anxiety problems. I feel like at this point, it's excuse making, not to mention I do think I can do better, asperger's or not. However, I'm more than willing to hear some pointers, or some war stories from people in similar spots.



pandabear
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24 Feb 2010, 4:16 pm

If you're American, the Americans with Disabilities Act may afford some protections, or at least give you something to hit back with.



JoeR43
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24 Feb 2010, 4:23 pm

pandabear wrote:
If you're American, the Americans with Disabilities Act may afford some protections, or at least give you something to hit back with.


I didn't disclose my condition before employment.
Besides, I feel as though my performance has been shaky at times, asperger's or not. Pulling the ADA card might help short term, but not long.



blastoff
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25 Feb 2010, 9:36 am

I find your statement that you find your performance shaky, Asperger's or not, to be rather refreshing. It's quite honest of you and demonstrates good self-awareness. I get tired of people blaming their Asperger's / ADHD / whatever for every problem they encounter. So: thank you.

Yes, you can look for a job while still employed, but it gets tricky. You certainly can't use a current co-worker or superior as a reference unless you've completely given up on your current job and intend to get fired. I'd advise against it. Unfortunately, you have to search for another job in secret, and that's hard for many of us. It also requires some gyrations, as most interviews, should you get one, take place during regular business hours... when you'd normally be at work. The other thing that's problematic is that your prospective employer will look at your current situation and ask you why you want to leave. They'll be highly suspicious of anyone who has only been in a job for a year and wants out. And you can't say "My employer is giving me hints that I might be laid off because of the economy," because that's a lie and you could easily be caught in it.

Speaking of the economy, yes, it will be tough for you to find another job unless you're a very lucky person. You have a job in your chosen field. You're fortunate already.

Maybe one thing that will help is to think of what you'd do better / differently in your next job, and then try to apply those things to your current position. "Do-overs" aren't possible, but maybe you can say, "Gee, if I had a new job I'd dress more appropriately" or "If I were starting over I'd be sure to greet my co-workers by name every morning" and then start doing those things *now*. It may not be too late.

I would encourage you to do what you can in your current job. You may have to have a talk with your supervisor and say something on the order of "I feel like I did a really good job of X, Y, and Z, and your review seems to agree with that. You mentioned that I have trouble with A, B, and C, and I think you're right. I'd like to improve. Can you help me find concrete things to do that will enable me to do better?" This approach shows that you're trying. It doesn't disclose your AS, so it doesn't sound like you're making excuses. I don't know if disclosure is possible or productive in your case. It might turn out that your discussion with your supervisor yields enough benefit that you can continue.

Any possibility of a job coach or mentor?

If you really feel like the writing's on the wall, disclosure might be an option. If you want any thoughts about how to do this, pm me.

I wish you well with all this.



JoeR43
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25 Feb 2010, 10:13 am

blastoff wrote:
I find your statement that you find your performance shaky, Asperger's or not, to be rather refreshing. It's quite honest of you and demonstrates good self-awareness. I get tired of people blaming their Asperger's / ADHD / whatever for every problem they encounter. So: thank you.

Yes, you can look for a job while still employed, but it gets tricky. You certainly can't use a current co-worker or superior as a reference unless you've completely given up on your current job and intend to get fired. I'd advise against it. Unfortunately, you have to search for another job in secret, and that's hard for many of us. It also requires some gyrations, as most interviews, should you get one, take place during regular business hours... when you'd normally be at work. The other thing that's problematic is that your prospective employer will look at your current situation and ask you why you want to leave. They'll be highly suspicious of anyone who has only been in a job for a year and wants out. And you can't say "My employer is giving me hints that I might be laid off because of the economy," because that's a lie and you could easily be caught in it.

Speaking of the economy, yes, it will be tough for you to find another job unless you're a very lucky person. You have a job in your chosen field. You're fortunate already.

Maybe one thing that will help is to think of what you'd do better / differently in your next job, and then try to apply those things to your current position. "Do-overs" aren't possible, but maybe you can say, "Gee, if I had a new job I'd dress more appropriately" or "If I were starting over I'd be sure to greet my co-workers by name every morning" and then start doing those things *now*. It may not be too late.

I would encourage you to do what you can in your current job. You may have to have a talk with your supervisor and say something on the order of "I feel like I did a really good job of X, Y, and Z, and your review seems to agree with that. You mentioned that I have trouble with A, B, and C, and I think you're right. I'd like to improve. Can you help me find concrete things to do that will enable me to do better?" This approach shows that you're trying. It doesn't disclose your AS, so it doesn't sound like you're making excuses. I don't know if disclosure is possible or productive in your case. It might turn out that your discussion with your supervisor yields enough benefit that you can continue.

Any possibility of a job coach or mentor?

If you really feel like the writing's on the wall, disclosure might be an option. If you want any thoughts about how to do this, pm me.

I wish you well with all this.


Thanks man.
Yeah, I know my AS is a weakness, but it can't be an excuse for not performing to the skill level I know I can.
And meh, most of my general conduct is good; I am trying to get to the office by 8 am everyday now, though (I'll keep it up since I don't want my boss thinking I was just doing it to get off the bad list).

One company I applied to last night, I already interviewed with last year (so I had an HR contact), already impressed them with my analytical ability and quickly picking up some basics of their proprietary programming language (it's a programmer position, obviously), and would've interviewed w/ upper management except I got my current job, so I politely declined. I'm sure if push comes to shove, I can say that my skill set is better suited for them vs. my current company and mitigate the problem of leaving a job after 1 year. Obviously a quick come-and-go is bad, but it's better than an employment gap. Not to mention I don't plan on actually disclosing my company's name unless/until it's needed to avoid any surprise calls to my boss.

My boss? Eh, he can be difficult; even though I'm doing what's asked of me in that meeting, he still seems unreceptive. Hence my newfound motivation to search for jobs.

A job coach / mentor is actually a decent option, I may look into that.

Thanks for the input.



psychohist
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25 Feb 2010, 3:04 pm

One thing to note is that a job search is a two way street. You have to be sure the job is right for you, and not just take any job that you are right for.

One thing I've noticed is that the quality of the manager seems to make a big difference for aspies. A manager who views his job as helping his people do their jobs seems to be good for us, perhaps because we're good at doing jobs if we know what they are. A manager who views his workers as people who help him, the manager, do his job, tends not to be so good, perhaps because we're not good at reading managers' minds about what they view their job as.

If the fundamental difficulty with your present job is that you've got the wrong kind of manager, you may want to make sure that any job you switch to gets you a better manager.



Athenacapella
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25 Feb 2010, 8:41 pm

Agreed about trying to find a mentor or job coach. There is a job coach who works exclusively with Asperger's folks (I'm thinking of using her; debating whether to go with her because it'd have to be over the phone vs. someone I can see in person).

If you can find a mentor at work, that'd be great, too, but has to be someone you can trust.

You don't need to tell them about AS; you could just say that you "have trouble understanding some of the social situations at the office" and need someone to help you out a bit.

Also, depending how closely you think you are to actually being fired, you might be able to improve over the next 6 months or a year, and then perhaps working there only a year won't be so "suspicious.



Logan5
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26 Feb 2010, 7:53 am

As blastoff noted, potential employers are going to want to know why you are looking for a new job. You could try saying that your current job is not challenging enough, or that you are searching for a job that will better use your skills and provide new opportunities for growth. Since you mentioned that you have started working on an MS in statistics, another possibility is that you are looking to move into a different sub-field or speciality. The most important thing when answering this question is to stay positive.


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JoeR43
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02 Mar 2010, 10:03 am

Logan5 wrote:
As blastoff noted, potential employers are going to want to know why you are looking for a new job. You could try saying that your current job is not challenging enough, or that you are searching for a job that will better use your skills and provide new opportunities for growth. Since you mentioned that you have started working on an MS in statistics, another possibility is that you are looking to move into a different sub-field or speciality. The most important thing when answering this question is to stay positive.


I agree.
I also think I'm at the early stage of my career where I can explain away why I'm looking for a change based on job fit. Also, I often feel treated differenly because of my more unsocial tendencies, which is obviously not fun.

And Athenacapella, would this person happen to have a website I can visit? Or do you know of any other similar job mentors?

And psychoist, unfortunately, while I'm at the stage of my career where bouncing around may not be as bad as later on, it's also where I cannot be as picky. Maybe I'll stumble into the right company at some point.



passionatebach
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02 Mar 2010, 1:43 pm

In my career expereince, I have often been written up for matters that I had no idea why I was being written up for those things. Many of these situations involved conduct that the company thought was less than professional. Most of the time it was situations that looking back now, my AS played into.

If you ever actually look at a company SOP (Standard Operating Procedure), an employer can basically write you up at any time for any reason. The rules are written very subjectively. Most work environments are based around personality and perceived obedience.

It can be a hard thing to do your job when you are written up. Unless it is for a serious offense, most of the time it does come to pass. If you are not happy with your current position, use all of the resources that you have to find something different from networking, books, government assistance, etc.