The Military

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Hello,

I became very interested in military affairs - U.S. and foreign militaries, including the Soviets' - in junior high school, and I wanted to go to the U.S. Military Academy (aka West Point) when I graduated high school. When I took 9th grade Business Dynamics, and we were asked to research and discuss two different careers, I chose two Army careers (one of them was helicopter pilot, I don't recall the other one). I also occasionally hung around Army recruitment offices.

(I was - and am - quite motion-sick and sea-sick, so I felt that ruled out the other services. Plus, I just felt the Army was somehow much more familiar.)

A kindly retired Army colonel in my area, who took part in local recruiting events, arranged for me to visit West Point the summer after my 9th grade for a soccer game. I didn't watch much of the game itself (I've never liked much about sports - and somehow never gave much thought to the fact that every cadet was required to play sports), though I had a good tour of the grounds.

At one point, in the dining hall, I went up an officer, saluted him, and then wondered out loud why he didn't return the salute - in a tone that might have done one of his superiors proud but still makes me cringe to remember. The lieutenant, calmly as you please, pointed out that one doesn't salute indoors. (With his evident self-control, I'm sure he's gone far in the Army.)

Anyway, I finally figured out, the summer before 12th grade (last year of secondary school for non-U.S. readers), that the military was not for me. I still am and probably will always be interested in military matters. That's as close as I'm going to come...and I have great respect for those of us - Aspie and NT alike - who do serve well.

Cheers,

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NzFJxX8yoY[/youtube]

I am a veteran of the Air Force. I spent almost 12 years in as an active duty enlisted member. I am not sure I would recommend it to a person with an ASD. It was tough to conform, and you have to do what you are told- no excuses, no arguments. If your job requires you to speak to people you speak to people.

I was in Finance and Accounting. My math skills got me put there. It probably sounds great to the mathematically inclined Aspie, but they dont just let you alone to do your sums and bean counting in your quiet little corner. I had to give briefings in front of large groups twice or three times a week and train others. I also had to constantly attend classes and training. This was good for me because it pulled me out of my shell a bit- my social skills were pretty rough before the military. It might not be a good thing for others, though. It may be too much of a shock.

You don't really get privacy or time alone in the first several months to a year. If you have any strong stimming behaviors this will be difficult for you. After initial training you will be able to live a more :normal" life, but in some type of dorm unless you are already married or have kids.

I got out because I am a single mother and I didn't feel it was in my daughter's best interest to stay in and possibly be sent off most of the time to Iraq. Someone else would have to raise her. I dont regret the years I spent because I have a college degree and I did get a lot of good experience from it. I also have Veteran benefits that I am putting to use right now.

Whatever you decide- make the choice that's best for YOU. I have no idea if this is right for you. Not everyone is cut out for it, NT or ASD.

I retired from the Air Force after 20 years fifteen years ago. I joke about having survived the last six or seven years of it, rather than having served it. Asperger's wasn't well known back then, but I don't think that would have made a difference. Back then, I'd say the Air Force thought that if you weren't communicating effectively with your coworkers, subordinates, or superiors, you were being deliberately and consciously negligent. The average noncommissioned or commissioned officer had no concept of any mindset but neurotypical, or of any condition but being very aware of one's nonverbal environment. Fitting in was to be effortless and unfailing, all the time, or else. I think the idea that inability to communicate might be genetic and thus something that had to be worked around, instead of a behavior problem that needed correction, would not have been believed. That was in the intelligence field, too, which is supposed to have some of the mentally sharper people overall. I hope that situation has changed in the last fifteen years. If not, I pity any current military Aspie who gets promoted high enough to supervise someone—or worse, to manage an office. I nearly cracked under the strain of the latter from general overload, and from people repeatedly castigating me for seeing everything they thought should be obvious to everyone. Given the chance to do those years over again, except for the travel, I would do something else.

i hope retired [military] life is agreeing with you. IMHO retired is the best way to be.
when you say you'd want to do something else, does this mean something else in the military or something else not part of the military? just wondering...

Life has its up and downs. I've often thought, though, that I stuck with the miltary for so long partly because I didn't have the courage to look elsewhere. I don't regret the time I sent in uniform, but I can't say that I ever really fit well into the military culture, either.

I'm a former Marine now diagnosed with AS, and I'd strongly advise against it, and strongly-er advise against picking the infantry/combat arms route if you do ever enlist. As a teen, it was also my dream to become a Marine and to jump headfirst into the warrior culture and all that yada, yada. When I was a kid I had had an obsession with military history going back to the Napoleonic Wars, and that eventually distilled into a specific interest in the Marines, and that of course led to me walking into a recruiting office one day. I became obsessed with all things Marine, absorbing as much information as I could. I read several books on the history of the Corps and on Recruit Training, memorized and rehearsed general knowledge (the eleven General Orders, ribbon precedence, the Marine's Hymn, Rifleman's Creed, all that), and was even at a point where I was spending most nights at my recruiter's apartment so that I could spend my days at the office with them (I lived a county away). I would mainly just sit there and write "the knowledge" on pieces of printer paper for hours at a time or practice drill in the bathroom mirror like an idiot. Anyway, I was so, so, so convinced that I was going to spend the rest of my life as an infantry Marine, and that there was simply no other path in life for me.

Buuuuuut the idealism died a very quick death once I got to MCRD. It was like everyone else seemed to just somehow "get" what they were supposed to do, get why they were doing it, and get what was going to happen if they didn't do it. To succeed in that kind of environment, you need to be very perceptive of the rest of your unit, to the sort of "collective mood" or whatever. But I could never plug in, and I was never able to meaningfully function as part of a larger whole. I was in my own head the whole time. I did end up graduating boot camp, but I didn't get any farther than that and was eventually ELS'ed at SOI.

I'm just going to assume that you're a young(er) guy, so make very, very sure that your commitment is serious and not some quixotic attempt at bridging fantasy and daydreaming with reality, because the results can really derail your life. Realize that you're not going to be able to just focus on your job and just your immediate responsibilities as a Marine, no matter what MOS you would pick. You're always going to be regarded and treated as part of a larger whole, and expected to act as such. You're never going to be able to just "do your own thing."

I'm also not sure how an official diagnosed of AS (which I'm assuming you have based on your profile) is going to effect enlistment, as I didn't know I had it during my time in.

Hiya WrongPlanet, by the way. I been lurkin'.

I'm not up to date on some of the acronyms you've used. Are these correct?

MCRD = Marine Corps Recruit Depot
ELS = Entry-Level Separation
SOI = School of Infantry
MOS = Military Occupation Skill

I agree it is not a very good atmosphere for people who are not up to being "team players". I felt my work and performance was much more important than the games and politics (and there are a lot of those). The main reason I was a good supervisor was because I hated brown-nosers and appreciated the work and effort of those under me. My bluntness was usually fine because people knew exactly where they stood. I lucked out having supervisors who were interested in honesty and hard work as well. I you end up in one of those units where the suck-ups are getting all the awards and you are not appreciated it can be very disillusioning and bad for your career advancement.

double post

Last edited by pumibel on 29 Mar 2010, 10:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I'm not even a full-fledged aspie, but the Air Force was very difficult for me. This was peace time, so I just plodded away at my desk job, but even so, it was not fun. If you're single, you live in the dorms, without much choice of roommate. If you're roommate wants to invite everyone on the floor into your room for a party, you can't complain without making yourself look bad.

And like someone else said, if you make it to a high enough rank to be able to supervise people, you'll be given people to supervise, and that is a nightmare.

Oh, and in basic training, you learn all about how to address your superior officers and non-commissioned officers, and proper protocol. But then when you get to your duty station, it all changes. Sometimes you have to call your boss "sir" and other times you can get away with calling him "John" or even "smeg-head." And no one will ever tell you those little unwritten rules. If you say sir to someone, they may well jump down your throat and say, "Don't call me SIR, I work for a living", and spend the rest of the year chiding you about it. But you never know, because the opposite could happen as well.

Of course, this is based on my experience from 1985-1991. I'm sure a lot has changed. Like smoking 2 feet away from your sleeping roommate is no longer mandatory.

I would not bother with it. I wasted 9 Years of my life on it. US army reserve.

The reserves are treated like garbage. Pay is terrible even after years in it. Retirement is a joke. $$$ for college is a lie.
The regular army is full of entrenched morons who will "office politic" you right out of Army because you are smarter than them.
You also need to stay in 20 years or you get NOTHING when you get kicked out. Finding a “position” to be entrenched in, is the only career goal. Even the worst private company vests you after only a few years.

A couple of my friends also were in, air force etc. All kicked out after a few years, all got nothing. ;
Only real winners are those that get a permant disability, that is a check for life.

I think back to when I quit about all the excellent test scores, medals, and all the schools I went too. I all ment nothing.

The military also will hold back your personal growth.
As an NCO, I boiled my job down to babysitter.

Famous quote.
"No intelligent man should ever subject himself to the ignorance and brutality of the military"

XD <3

I was going to join the military and go into the officer program. I scored very high on the officer aptitude test, but...and this is stupid but true, I could never run that 12 minute mile.

I think if you have AS, lower ranked officer would be a better choice than enlisted because because I think officers are a little more removed from that highschool mentality and more concerned with the military as an actual profession, than many of those who just enlist, with the exception of career sargeants.

I also like the idea of a chain of command, a code of ethics, and direct, unambigious orders.

But keep in mind if you do go into the military....

1. You are going to be yelled at at some point....really yelled at.
2. You might be assigned a combat role, and if so, might have to kill someone.
3. You might have to "rough it".
4. You may be put on a plane for Iraq and end up in China, so you need to be flexible.
5. You will have to wear uniforms whether they are comfortable or not.
6. Weapons are loud.
7. You can't get out of it easily once you join, even if you have a medical condition.

I was going to join the military and go into the officer program. I scored very high on the officer aptitude test, but...and this is stupid but true, I could never run that 12 minute mile.

I think if you have AS, lower ranked officer would be a better choice than enlisted because because I think officers are a little more removed from that highschool mentality and more concerned with the military as an actual profession, than many of those who just enlist, with the exception of career sargeants.

I also like the idea of a chain of command, a code of ethics, and direct, unambigious orders.

But keep in mind if you do go into the military....

1. You are going to be yelled at at some point....really yelled at.
2. You might be assigned a combat role, and if so, might have to kill someone.
3. You might have to "rough it".
4. You may be put on a plane for Iraq and end up in China, so you need to be flexible.
5. You will have to wear uniforms whether they are comfortable or not.
6. Weapons are loud.
7. You can't get out of it easily once you join, even if you have a medical condition.

That's interesting because I know I exhibited Aspie traits, in fact there were quite a few in my unit that did, and the people didn't act like adolescents who refused to grow up, but then again that was over 20 years ago (seems like yesterday). I do have the impression that the military has lost some of its Esprit de Corps, but if any one branch still tries to hold to that, it would be the Marine Corps. Thanks for serving, three theaters…glad you survived and returned.