Do you think having AS *feels* different?

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MotownDangerPants
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21 Jul 2010, 9:53 am

I know there is nothing you could compare it to , but I think many NTs have the idea that someone with AS has a distorted view of the world around them. and that having it literally feels like being on drugs. This is a horrible example but all I can compare it to is how things are shown from Max's perspective on the show Parenthood,, he becomes very focused on something and it's like he has tunnel vision that is sort of WAVY.

This has to be the wrong message to be sending, IMO. I also have a somewhat distorted perception of the world around me but it isn't something that would actually cause me to SEE things differently with my EYES, it's just that my senses process things differently. Some of my senses are stronger than others, I have sensitivities, etc. I don't think this is how most NTs think that autistics see the world, I think that many of them think that autistic vision/perception is sort of hallucinatory.



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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21 Jul 2010, 9:59 am

That's not how some people view autism where I live. Everyone seems to know the parents of a kid with autism, or a kid with autism, and they judge someone with autism based on stories the parents have related, or things they have seen the kid do. The truth is, it's generally negative. They have ideas about people with autism and these ideas aren't altogether positive. Often, it's the idea that autistics are "emotionally disturbed", or generally disturbed and unpredictable.
They don't see autistics as people who are perceiving a different reality or are like people on mind altering drugs.



Janissy
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21 Jul 2010, 10:21 am

I think everybody is so familiar with film grammar now that the literal tunnel vision effect in the show will be understood to be just a narrative device.

As to how people without autism imagine the sensory perceptions of people with autism? It's very individual. Temple Grandin wrote "Thinking In Pictures" in which she describes how she percieves the world...in pictures. Lots of people have read that book so maybe lots of people think that her description is the universal experience for people with autism. There was a thread about it a while ago which made it clear that isn't universal.

For some autistic people, it looks to the outside world that their perceptual experience is somewhat similar to taking hallucinatory drugs. Anbuend posted an extremely detailed explanation of her perceptual experiences that sounded so much like Aldous Huxley's book "The Doors of Perception" (about hallucinatory drug use) that I told her so. She replied that some people have mistaken her for a hallucinatory drug user and some have gone so far as to try to wangle a sample of the drugs from her so they can try it themselves. Followup posts from others that this wasn't a universal perceptual experience anymore than thinking in pictures is. I know that if I took LSD I wouldn't start thinking like anbuend. But the differences might not be obvious to an outside observer.

I think if a person has only been exposed to one personal account of what an autistic person's perception feels like (such as reading "Thinking in Pictures") they will generalize and assume it is the universal autistic experience. But being exposed to >1 personal account makes it clear that there is no universal autistic perceptual experience.



Descartes
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21 Jul 2010, 10:29 am

On a similar note, I've been very curious lately as to what it's like to view the world from an NT's point of view.



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21 Jul 2010, 10:35 am

Intellectually, I can understand an NTs point of view, I just don't always agree with it, and there are various shades of NTs so why generalize?
People aren't that mysterious. I have the hardest time empathizing with some of what they (NT and everyone else) say and do and actually wanting to be like some of them, (who appear very shallow, selfish and superficial) but I can understand their point of view and why they are the way they are.



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21 Jul 2010, 10:58 am

Yes, some ignorant persons may use a term like they feel a person is hallucinating/whatever when the actual explanation may be a subtle visual/perceptual difficulty - a hearing difficulty like central auditory processing disorder - face blindness (prosopagnosia) - synesthesia - and so on. Tend to feel that some of those with Asperger's may not have the ability to feel things as much as others - a kind of hemiparesis (weakness). In some cases, a person may have complex partials/Temporal Lobe/absence and so on. - http://www.hemihelp.org.uk/hemiplegia/a ... _problems/ -



Celoneth
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21 Jul 2010, 11:00 am

I probably do experience things differently than NTs do, in terms of sensory inputs and focus and other things, but that's how my brain is wired so it feels perfectly normal to me. I think maybe people assume everything that isn't "the norm" has to feel altered in some way or could be just media misunderstanding autism as usual.



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21 Jul 2010, 11:08 am

I just think of myself as normal, but with a few idiosyncrasies and compulsions. I don't think I perceive the world any differently to anyone else.


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basstrousers
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21 Jul 2010, 11:10 am

I've only recently suspected I had AS, after the idea was put to me a psychologist friend of my mother, and I'm now about to receive a diagnosis.
I never really thought of myself as experiencing life differently from anyone else and since finding out about AS suddenly realised that some of my experiences that I considered normal are not shared with other people.
Looking at WP I can see plenty of experiences that I have shared with other people on the forum, but on the other hand there are many stories I cannot identify with.
I think people are perhaps a little too keen to codify a definitive 'aspie experience', perhaps because it helps create a sense of community among autistic people, but since we're talking about a widely varying spectrum of affection its unlikely that any one autistic person's experience can be regarded as 'typical', in much the same way as suggesting all NTs have exactly the same perspective on life.
I also find that since becoming aware of my AS I am now constantly comparing myself with other people and noticing things that I might be experiencing differently because of my AS.
I don't know if this self-consciousness is something that will pass as I get used to identifying myself as AS (I was very self conscious of my lack of social skills before I was diagnosed anyway) but I still think I see life in the same way.



KaiG
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21 Jul 2010, 11:28 am

basstrousers wrote:
I've only recently suspected I had AS, after the idea was put to me a psychologist friend of my mother, and I'm now about to receive a diagnosis.
I never really thought of myself as experiencing life differently from anyone else and since finding out about AS suddenly realised that some of my experiences that I considered normal are not shared with other people.
Looking at WP I can see plenty of experiences that I have shared with other people on the forum, but on the other hand there are many stories I cannot identify with.
I think people are perhaps a little too keen to codify a definitive 'aspie experience', perhaps because it helps create a sense of community among autistic people, but since we're talking about a widely varying spectrum of affection its unlikely that any one autistic person's experience can be regarded as 'typical', in much the same way as suggesting all NTs have exactly the same perspective on life.
I also find that since becoming aware of my AS I am now constantly comparing myself with other people and noticing things that I might be experiencing differently because of my AS.
I don't know if this self-consciousness is something that will pass as I get used to identifying myself as AS (I was very self conscious of my lack of social skills before I was diagnosed anyway) but I still think I see life in the same way.


I'm sort of in this position too. I'm very wary of allowing myself to buy into the label to the extent that it wipes out my individuality and becomes a crutch.


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basstrousers
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21 Jul 2010, 12:10 pm

KaiG wrote:
basstrousers wrote:
I've only recently suspected I had AS, after the idea was put to me a psychologist friend of my mother, and I'm now about to receive a diagnosis.
I never really thought of myself as experiencing life differently from anyone else and since finding out about AS suddenly realised that some of my experiences that I considered normal are not shared with other people.
Looking at WP I can see plenty of experiences that I have shared with other people on the forum, but on the other hand there are many stories I cannot identify with.
I think people are perhaps a little too keen to codify a definitive 'aspie experience', perhaps because it helps create a sense of community among autistic people, but since we're talking about a widely varying spectrum of affection its unlikely that any one autistic person's experience can be regarded as 'typical', in much the same way as suggesting all NTs have exactly the same perspective on life.
I also find that since becoming aware of my AS I am now constantly comparing myself with other people and noticing things that I might be experiencing differently because of my AS.
I don't know if this self-consciousness is something that will pass as I get used to identifying myself as AS (I was very self conscious of my lack of social skills before I was diagnosed anyway) but I still think I see life in the same way.


I'm sort of in this position too. I'm very wary of allowing myself to buy into the label to the extent that it wipes out my individuality and becomes a crutch.


I was thinking about starting a new thread on the topic of self consciousness. I think I'm definitely more mildly affected than a lot of people but I wonder if the fact I've been trying to fit into normal society for the first 23 years of my life would result in my being more adjusted to NT life than someone who is diagnosed earlier. I've heard people describe that if you have AS you're more likely to act like a child when you're a teenager and a teenager when you're a young adult and that certainly applies to me. I always assumed I would get more confident and comfortable with people in time but was just slower than other people, and AS suddenly confirmed that there was a reason why somebody quite intelligent could find simple (or even 'natural') things so much more difficult than everyone else.

I think also I have a 'theory of mind' but its definitely just a 'theory' with me, I can normally look back on a situation and understand somebody else's intentions, but I can't react accordingly in the moment.



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21 Jul 2010, 12:27 pm

Hmm... I'm not sure. I assume I do think differently from NTs, from all I read and observe, but not to such an extent as it makes me a different species or anything! I think my way of thinking is about looking more at details and understanding things by piecing the details together, whereas I observe NTs don't seem to pick up on the details I see, and they are looking at it more as a whole. And they often don't seem to find the details as interesting as I do.

I'm not sure what you mean about Max on Parenthood seeing things as 'wavy'. I haven't found there is much on his perspective in that series - unless there is a new series that I haven't seen yet. He just seems to say a few things which are stereotypical Asperger things to say - he isn't given a personality or anything, which I find annoying. But in terms of actual visual perception, I have Irlen Syndrome, so I do often see things as jiggling around. Not everyone with Aspergers has this, but apparently it's quite common in people on the autistic spectrum, so maybe there is some truth in the 'wavy' thing, although I don't remember that happening on Parenthood at all.

Something I've heard is that NTs will just see the functionally relevant things when they enter a room - somehow they don't register everything else. But I see the details - things that aren't relevant but are there - things like a stain on the floor, or a scratch in the wall, and the shapes and angles such stains, scratches and cracks. When I was a kid, I would fixate on those little things, and so what I would be seeing would be different from what others saw - I would especially fixate on patterns on people's clothes or on wallpaper, and the pattern would seem to be moving, and would become 3D, like looking at one of those 'Magic Eye' pictures. Nowadays I am more aware and I make myself find the relevant things and focus on them, but it doesn't come naturally to me. Apparently NTs have an automatic prioritising ability that automatically filters out the irrelevant stuff.


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21 Jul 2010, 12:57 pm

MotownDangerPants wrote:
Some of my senses are stronger than others, I have sensitivities, etc. I don't think this is how most NTs think that autistics see the world, I think that many of them think that autistic vision/perception is sort of hallucinatory.


I like they are trying to show AS in primetime. Most of the population has a distorted view of the whole spectrum. I have not found many people that even know what it is besides those whose lives are impacted. I love how the family hovers around him and everyone wants to understand it. My family hates I am different and are embarrassed, always have been embarrassed. They don't change their plans to include me, they leave me out. They never took it on and hovered. They moved on and I remain in the same vacuum I have always existed in. I do feel different. My senses are raw, like nerves without a cover. I don't see wavy but I just don't see, it is like I feel it..I feel noise..I feel smells.



KaiG
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21 Jul 2010, 1:12 pm

basstrousers wrote:
KaiG wrote:
basstrousers wrote:
I've only recently suspected I had AS, after the idea was put to me a psychologist friend of my mother, and I'm now about to receive a diagnosis.
I never really thought of myself as experiencing life differently from anyone else and since finding out about AS suddenly realised that some of my experiences that I considered normal are not shared with other people.
Looking at WP I can see plenty of experiences that I have shared with other people on the forum, but on the other hand there are many stories I cannot identify with.
I think people are perhaps a little too keen to codify a definitive 'aspie experience', perhaps because it helps create a sense of community among autistic people, but since we're talking about a widely varying spectrum of affection its unlikely that any one autistic person's experience can be regarded as 'typical', in much the same way as suggesting all NTs have exactly the same perspective on life.
I also find that since becoming aware of my AS I am now constantly comparing myself with other people and noticing things that I might be experiencing differently because of my AS.
I don't know if this self-consciousness is something that will pass as I get used to identifying myself as AS (I was very self conscious of my lack of social skills before I was diagnosed anyway) but I still think I see life in the same way.


I'm sort of in this position too. I'm very wary of allowing myself to buy into the label to the extent that it wipes out my individuality and becomes a crutch.


I was thinking about starting a new thread on the topic of self consciousness. I think I'm definitely more mildly affected than a lot of people but I wonder if the fact I've been trying to fit into normal society for the first 23 years of my life would result in my being more adjusted to NT life than someone who is diagnosed earlier. I've heard people describe that if you have AS you're more likely to act like a child when you're a teenager and a teenager when you're a young adult and that certainly applies to me. I always assumed I would get more confident and comfortable with people in time but was just slower than other people, and AS suddenly confirmed that there was a reason why somebody quite intelligent could find simple (or even 'natural') things so much more difficult than everyone else.

I think also I have a 'theory of mind' but its definitely just a 'theory' with me, I can normally look back on a situation and understand somebody else's intentions, but I can't react accordingly in the moment.


Sounds like we have the same mindset. I wasn't diagnosed until midway through university. I think I'm a pretty mild case as well, but since I can hardly be objective with this issue, I don't know how far I can trust my own judgement. I certainly feel like I'm around 6 years behind my peers when it comes to social development, though. Only in the last few years have I begun to exhibit the social behaviours that I observed in my classmates in my mid-teens, such as a willingness to go out and do things in a social context.

It's bizarre to think that I was so far behind everyone else socially when I was also quite far ahead of most of them intellectually and, in some ways, in maturity. At school I always got along with adults better than people my age, and many of my interests seemed more mature than those of the people around me.


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21 Jul 2010, 1:15 pm

Everyone got a distorted view of the world. The brain is a master of illusions and shortcuts. What can be say of the autist view of the world is that it's "different".


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21 Jul 2010, 2:22 pm

Janissy wrote:
I think everybody is so familiar with film grammar now that the literal tunnel vision effect in the show will be understood to be just a narrative device.


I'd like to be able to believe that, but honestly, humans are so effin' stupid I think 99% of them see something like that and actually assume that it means Autistic people see the world as wavy and distorted, and are constantly out of whack, like someone tripping on LSD. Remember, we're talking about the creatures who think Big Brother and Survivor are 'reality' and enjoy Jersey Shore because it gives them something to feel superior to. :roll:


I appreciate the fact that ASDs are getting more attention in mainstream media and dramatic fiction, but it irks and frightens me that the depictions are so often infinitely removed from the truth, because they're created by writers who don't have ASDs and get their information from articles online, most of which they interpret literally and regurgitate without any comprehension (which is often how the articles themselves are written) - like Big Bang giving Sheldon an obsession with trains, without any understanding that' train' obsessions was just an example, and not everyone with AS is a train aficionado.

Still, I think its easier for viewers to relate to an adult character than to a child, so in the long run its those who will help facilitate public understanding of what 'seeing the world differently' means. Sheldon clearly sees the world differently than a neurotypical person, but he never appears to be drugged. I just wish the creators of BB would 'out' him and actually call him an Aspergian.

Same with Gregory House - his friends (all 1.5 of them) on the show have speculated whether he might have Asperger Syndrome, I wish they'd just come right out and diagnose him - to anyone familiar with the disorder, its laughably obvious. OTOH, he is constantly drugged, primarily because he sees the world differently.

Speaking of television characters likely to have ASDs, I'd like to nominate Alan Harper from 2 and a Half Men.

Hmm...why did I come in here? :?