Page 1 of 1 [ 15 posts ] 

Shadowcat
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 15 Apr 2007
Age: 54
Gender: Female
Posts: 129

29 Jul 2010, 1:12 am

What is meant by the words "Extreme Male Mind."

I've heard it described to females who have Autism or Asperger Syndrome.

It also sounds extremely offensive like it's a Woman's disease.



conundrum
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 May 2010
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,922
Location: third rock from one of many suns

29 Jul 2010, 1:16 am

Shadowcat wrote:
What is meant by the words "Extreme Male Mind."

I've heard it described to females who have Autism or Asperger Syndrome.

It also sounds extremely offensive like it's a Woman's disease.


There's a new one--one that should disappear. :roll:

Females on the spectrum are sometimes said to be acting/thinking "like males"--that's probably where this came from. However, stereotypes are usually not helpful.

I think of myself as being able to think/feel like both genders, depending on the situation.


_________________
The existence of the leader who is wise
is barely known to those he leads.
He acts without unnecessary speech,
so that the people say,
'It happened of its own accord.' -Tao Te Ching, Verse 17


Pistonhead
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Jun 2010
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,732
Location: Bradenton, Florida

29 Jul 2010, 1:24 am

I don't know what the professional application for such crude terminology is but if I had to take a guess I would think more competitive, more sexual, more thrill-seeking, more crude, etc. Basically anything but happy to paint nails and gossip.


_________________
"Some ideals are worth dying for"
==tOGoWPO==


Ixtli
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 17 Jan 2009
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 169
Location: Some silly little island in Canada.

29 Jul 2010, 1:28 am

It's a stereotype, plain and simple. The main thing, I guess, is that the stereotypical woman is a social butterfly, gossiping and subtly gesturing wherever she goes. Autistic women aren't usually social butterflies.



TeaEarlGreyHot
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Jul 2010
Age: 40
Gender: Female
Posts: 28,982
Location: California

29 Jul 2010, 1:33 am

Pistonhead wrote:
I don't know what the professional application for such crude terminology is but if I had to take a guess I would think more competitive, more sexual, more thrill-seeking, more crude, etc. Basically anything but happy to paint nails and gossip.


If that's true, then there are a lot of NT females I know that would be diagnosed with AS.

Like a PP has said, I don't think of myself as 'masculine', but I'm not your typical girl, either. I'm transgender, or bigender. Whatever the hip term is these days.

However, I don't see this as a trait stemming from AS. If it were, there would be a lot less AS women with feminine traits.


_________________
Still looking for that blue jean baby queen, prettiest girl I've ever seen.


TeaEarlGreyHot
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Jul 2010
Age: 40
Gender: Female
Posts: 28,982
Location: California

29 Jul 2010, 1:34 am

Ixtli wrote:
It's a stereotype, plain and simple. The main thing, I guess, is that the stereotypical woman is a social butterfly, gossiping and subtly gesturing wherever she goes. Autistic women aren't usually social butterflies.


Oh... is that it? That's an odd way to stereotype us.


_________________
Still looking for that blue jean baby queen, prettiest girl I've ever seen.


Vince
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 31 Dec 2007
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 688
Location: Sweden

29 Jul 2010, 1:41 am

I think that term can probably be traced back to a theory by Prof. Simon Baron-Cohen. As I understand, it doesn't just refer to females. If I've understood things correctly (which I might not have), there are apparently generally some differences between how male and female brains tend to operate (no implication that one is better than the other, just that there's a general difference in what order they might be likely to use different parts in and stuff like that), and Prof. Baron-Cohen made some observation about the average autism spectrum brain operating in a way that's further in the general male direction than the general population... or something like that. Don't take my word for it. You can probably google up some more accurate information. This is just me talking from very blurry memory. Bottom line is I don't think it's intended to be sexist or anything, just an observation about brain behaviors and statistics.


_________________
I'm Vince. I make the music. And puppet.
http://www.swenglish.nu


Chronos
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2010
Age: 44
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,698

29 Jul 2010, 1:55 am

Shadowcat wrote:
What is meant by the words "Extreme Male Mind."

I've heard it described to females who have Autism or Asperger Syndrome.

It also sounds extremely offensive like it's a Woman's disease.


It's an academic way of saying someone is an @-hole.......

It's used to describe someone who has extreme black and white or stereotypical thinking and is not empathetic to the views and emotions of others, and someone who is self centered and egotistical.

Now I did not make this up, and personally I find the term offensive to males even though I am not one, because just because these traits are less common in women, I do not think that warrants labeling them as male traits.



TeaEarlGreyHot
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Jul 2010
Age: 40
Gender: Female
Posts: 28,982
Location: California

29 Jul 2010, 1:56 am

Chronos wrote:
Shadowcat wrote:
What is meant by the words "Extreme Male Mind."

I've heard it described to females who have Autism or Asperger Syndrome.

It also sounds extremely offensive like it's a Woman's disease.


It's an academic way of saying someone is an @-hole.......

It's used to describe someone who has extreme black and white or stereotypical thinking and is not empathetic to the views and emotions of others, and someone who is self centered and egotistical.

Now I did not make this up, and personally I find the term offensive to males even though I am not one, because just because these traits are less common in women, I do not think that warrants labeling them as male traits.


I think all those traits you listed are just as prevalent in women. Women are just less likely to show that side of them.


_________________
Still looking for that blue jean baby queen, prettiest girl I've ever seen.


DandelionFireworks
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 16 May 2010
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,011

29 Jul 2010, 2:08 am

It refers to the balance of Empathizing/Systemizing scores. Men tend to score higher Systemizing and women tend to score higher Empathizing, with NTs clustered around the mean regardless of gender. Almost no one is extremely one way or the other, but the number of extreme Systemizing women is negligible enough not to show up in statistics. At all.

People on the spectrum tend to score higher Systemizing, lower Empathizing on this test.

It tests reason and logic, and viewing things through your logical worldview rather than through your emotions. An Empathizer will look at a problem and see that the solution is being around other people and talking to them about it, going no deeper than "oh, I'm sorry!" A Systemizer will see a problem and see that the solution is... well, something else, like being more assertive, or turning the crank a quarter-turn to the left.

As it happens, people on the spectrum tend to score as extreme Systemizers, maybe because so many questions on the EQ are about how much you like to socialize. For instance, I'm a female Aspie extreme Systemizer. You're not supposed to get a female anything extreme Systemizer. Ever.

Also, I think I heard somewhere that testosterone levels are somewhat higher in people with autism.

That's all. It's not meant to be offensive.


_________________
I'm using a non-verbal right now. I wish you could see it. --dyingofpoetry

NOT A DOCTOR


ColdBlooded
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Jun 2009
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,136
Location: New Bern, North Carolina

29 Jul 2010, 2:23 am

Yep. I'm also a female extreme systemizer, according to the EQ/SQ. But you can ignore this comment, because i don't exist :lol:



TeaEarlGreyHot
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Jul 2010
Age: 40
Gender: Female
Posts: 28,982
Location: California

29 Jul 2010, 2:27 am

ColdBlooded wrote:
Yep. I'm also a female extreme systemizer, according to the EQ/SQ. But you can ignore this comment, because i don't exist :lol:


I think I am, too. I'm too lazy to look up my posted score, though. lol


_________________
Still looking for that blue jean baby queen, prettiest girl I've ever seen.


MotownDangerPants
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 May 2010
Age: 40
Gender: Female
Posts: 955

29 Jul 2010, 5:00 am

I don't know if they really use it so much anymore to describe to autism, Hans Asperger did, "extreme male intelligence". He said it didn't even occur in women. It just means that autistic thinking is considered to be a very male-oriented way of thinking.

I don't think it's offensive. I'ts possible that autism could be caused partially by overexposure to testosterone in the womb. Many non-autistic females with have been exposed to high testotserone levels have masculine personality characteristics and a more male-oriented way of thinking.

I've always been told I think a man/computer, or told by boys that I was really good at ___________, "for a girl".

xD



CockneyRebel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Age: 49
Gender: Male
Posts: 113,547
Location: Stalag 13

29 Jul 2010, 7:30 am

I've always felt more male, than female, so it makes sense, to me. I'm also a very strong S-type thinker. If that's the case, however, than why am I sensitive? I thought that only girly girls were supposed to be sensitive.


_________________
Who wants to adopt a Sweet Pea?


StuartN
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Jan 2010
Age: 60
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,569

29 Jul 2010, 8:30 am

Shadowcat wrote:
It also sounds extremely offensive like it's a Woman's disease.


It is offensive, and a lot of medicine has insensitive terminology (we used to call Psychology 101 the "famous Dead White Men" module).

However, there are some interesting correlations between autism and prenatal androgen exposure. Possibly there are some associations with gender identity, "tomboy" behaviour and non-stereotypical gender roles. (http://www.springerlink.com/content/38717828gu707634/).

One consequence of higher prenatal testosterone exposure is a lower 2D:4D digit ratio, i.e. the index (pointing) finger of both hands is smaller (94% of the length) of the ring finger in people of either sex with autism, but the index finger is shorter than the ring finger in women without autism. www.autismresearchcentre.com/docs/paper ... g_etal.pdf - the overlap between autistic and non-autistic 2D:4D is too great for screening purposes.