How are we sure plants have no feelings?

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somebody wasn't paying attention. re-read my last post.



you, not being a plant, can't say for certain. If a single-celled organism can "feel", why not a plant cell?

though I guess plant cells have cell walls as opposed to membranes... that could muck things up a bit.



it's different when living tissue is involved.

I read it through completely at least twice before starting my reply, which was specifically to that post. I quoted several portions of it in my reply. I re-read it just now, just in case.

There isn't anything there that would establish that neurons are not needed. The closest thing to an attempt to establish that is an unsupported conclusory statement that language is being foolish when it strongly implies that they are needed.


You, not being a rock, can't say for certain.
You, not being a human being other than yourself, can't say for certain.

Thus, by your argument, we can establish that human beings, other than yourself, are not capable of feeling anything, while at the same time, rocks can feel.


Why do you think that a single-celled organism can feel?


What does the type of cell wall have to do with anything?


In what way is it different?

What is your definition of living tissue? Does it include viruses? DNA within a living cell? DNA not in a living cell? Cell membranes? Cell walls? Individual atoms within a living cell? Individual electrons within an atom within a living cell?

I'm saying neurons are needed, you're saying living tissue. What about living tissue makes it able to feel without neurons?

http://www.ted.com/talks/stefano_mancus ... gence.html

Well, from what little i know. I've heard that in more pragmatic ways, being "nice" to the plant and caring for its needs will allow it to grow more than ignoring them. =/

According to something I've heard (hence I don't believe if I should believe it), cucumbers have about six times higher physical sensitivity than human beings...

yes, i agree. and i think some scientific studies have shown that plants can sense people's presence, that they grow better while hearing music, and that they react to cutting with some sort of plant-response. i don't think that it is pain like people feel, but they respond in their own way.

i don't believe in the idea of souls or spirits, but if it were true, i would like to think all living things have souls.

OP, this concept makes me think of Jainism, a little.

Has no one seen the old horror movie "Attack of the Killer Tomatoes" ?

It is us against them. If we don't eat them first then they will eat us!

Remember "The Day of the Triffids"

I guess if plants have feelings then it's just as "wrong" to eat them as it is to eat animals. Then we'd starve to death.

In order for something to live, something else has to die. It's just a part of nature and we need to understand and accept that. Otherwise living things would become too numerous and the whole world would be destroyed.

My houseplants told me that I was too young to watch them pollinate!

We don't know whether plants have feelings---we simply don't give a s**t.

The only reason we have empathy (or should I say, "neurotypicals have empathy"?---hmm...) in the first place is because it's in your best interest to be aware of the feelings of those who can hurt you if they're displeased. It's not evolutionarily advantageous to waste time and energy caring about the feelings of someone who can't retaliate to the damage you inflict them, and has no allies who would for some reason or other do it for them.

They feel fear though:

http://www.pri.org/stories/2014-01-09/n ... out-plants

Zombie post rises from the grave!
But I suppose it's a bit relevant with the new studies that talk about how plants react to pain

http://www.collective-evolution.com/201 ... -find-out/

Like 20 years ago I remember hearing newstories about how trees "talk" to each other. One tree gets attacked by bugs, and it sends out pheromones into the air that other trees pick up. And the whole forest starts to put out defensive chemicals.

Yeah, it's a pheromonal phalanx. If you're a tree sending out defensive chemicals, and the tree next to you isn't, there is still a chance for the pests to get a foothold in your forest and eventually they might develop a strain that is resistant to your defensive chemicals. And then you're doomed. Better then to warn your competition, present a united chemical front and live to compete another day.

Not only do plants have feelings we probably hurt their feelings on a regular basis when we use un pc terms to describe some of them. Like calling some of them "weeds".

With species like dandelions, and crabgrass, and the like, instead of the common practice of calling them "weeds" i prefer to call them "cultivationally independent Americans".

Thread over.

You win.