Right-wing vs Left-wing science
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,784
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
How can you stop me without using violence?
you can't
LOL Wow great point!
How could I stop you without violence? I would point out that somebody owns that cow, and that you'll owe them money if not get in trouble with the law for destroying that property. Since you probably aren't interested in paying for said cow, or spending the evening in jail, you will probably go home and sulk like a good lunatic
I was speaking about an unowned cow
obviously I respect property rights(unlike you socialist)
I doubt you're going to find an unowned cow anywhere - at anytime, as they are a domesticated animal. Less than a hundred years ago, you could have been strung up in the western half of this country for rustling.
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
Give away the cow argument - how about bedbugs? Can humans be said to 'dominate' bedbugs, which are weaker by several orders of magnitude, in any meaningful sense? We knocked them back for a while with pesticides, but now they've evolved a way back and we are their prey.
Fitness has nothing to do with strength and everything to do with endurance over generations.
Fitness has nothing to do with strength and everything to do with endurance over generations.
I think the cow argument is more about the gun than the cow.
Our collective intelligence as human beings has allowed us to develop tools to dominate other creatures, that we would never be able to dominate, given our inherent physical weaknesses. And the same collective intelligence creates an infrastucture that many humans cannot survive without.
We have created a culture so complex that we identify more with the culture than our place in nature; it takes a hurricane, an earthquake, a tsunami, or other natural disaster to remind us, but the lesson is on TV, and is not real until we are personally impacted. Many humans are never cognizant that they are an animal during the span of their lifetime.
But, per your post the bed bug wins with no concern over tools, infrastructure, or culture. The same applies to a Virus or Bacteria. And these examples are only a tiny sample of the thousands of actions we as a species take everyday in what we see as progress, that may eventually reduce our endurance as a species. And there may be a synergetic effect that is too complex for anyone to ever understand.
While we try our hardest to make life as easy as possible for ourselves, the other forms of life, focus on one thing; survival. In many cases our efforts have led to extinctions, but in other cases we have strengthened the resilience of those life forms that survive the challenges we present for them.
At some point there may be a tipping point where our challenges are meaningless.
We have the potential to influence our future, if through collective critical consciousness, we understand that nature has dominion over us.
This may be harder for those of us that refuse to admit we are just another primate dressed in clothing.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 47,784
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
Fitness has nothing to do with strength and everything to do with endurance over generations.
I think the cow argument is more about the gun than the cow.
Our collective intelligence as human beings has allowed us to develop tools to dominate other creatures, that we would never be able to dominate, given our inherent physical weaknesses. And the same collective intelligence creates an infrastucture that many humans cannot survive without.
We have created a culture so complex that we identify more with the culture than our place in nature; it takes a hurricane, an earthquake, a tsunami, or other natural disaster to remind us, but the lesson is on TV, and is not real until we are personally impacted. Many humans are never cognizant that they are an animal during the span of their lifetime.
But, per your post the bed bug wins with no concern over tools, infrastructure, or culture. The same applies to a Virus or Bacteria. And these examples are only a tiny sample of the thousands of actions we as a species take everyday in what we see as progress, that may eventually reduce our endurance as a species. And there may be a synergetic effect that is too complex for anyone to ever understand.
While we try our hardest to make life as easy as possible for ourselves, the other forms of life, focus on one thing; survival. In many cases our efforts have led to extinctions, but in other cases we have strengthened the resilience of those life forms that survive the challenges we present for them.
At some point there may be a tipping point where our challenges are meaningless.
We have the potential to influence our future, if through collective critical consciousness, we understand that nature has dominion over us.
This may be harder for those of us that refuse to admit we are just another primate dressed in clothing.
Being that the bedbug is a parasite living off of human blood, I would think if we ever became extinct as a species, it would soon follow us.
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
Fitness has nothing to do with strength and everything to do with endurance over generations.
I think the cow argument is more about the gun than the cow.
Our collective intelligence as human beings has allowed us to develop tools to dominate other creatures, that we would never be able to dominate, given our inherent physical weaknesses. And the same collective intelligence creates an infrastucture that many humans cannot survive without.
We have created a culture so complex that we identify more with the culture than our place in nature; it takes a hurricane, an earthquake, a tsunami, or other natural disaster to remind us, but the lesson is on TV, and is not real until we are personally impacted. Many humans are never cognizant that they are an animal during the span of their lifetime.
But, per your post the bed bug wins with no concern over tools, infrastructure, or culture. The same applies to a Virus or Bacteria. And these examples are only a tiny sample of the thousands of actions we as a species take everyday in what we see as progress, that may eventually reduce our endurance as a species. And there may be a synergetic effect that is too complex for anyone to ever understand.
While we try our hardest to make life as easy as possible for ourselves, the other forms of life, focus on one thing; survival. In many cases our efforts have led to extinctions, but in other cases we have strengthened the resilience of those life forms that survive the challenges we present for them.
At some point there may be a tipping point where our challenges are meaningless.
We have the potential to influence our future, if through collective critical consciousness, we understand that nature has dominion over us.
This may be harder for those of us that refuse to admit we are just another primate dressed in clothing.
Being that the bedbug is a parasite living off of human blood, I would think if we ever became extinct as a species, it would soon follow us.
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
They also feed off the blood of pets, mice, rabbits, sparrows, poultry, pigeons, etc. I understand that we by far are their easiest meal, because we trap them in our beds. Other than domesticated animals; there are probably only a few forms of life that will find life harder without us, in comparison to those that might thrive without us.
I think it would be interesting to travel to the future to see what the earth might look like in one hundred thousand years. It is easier for me to imagine humans here in one hundred thousand years, if our population and civilization is pared back significantly by some kind of natural disaster.
It might be our only chance for long term survival as a species.
"YOU MANIACS! YOU BLEW IT UP! OH, DAMN YOU! GODDAMN YOU ALL TO HELL!"
_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do
Bethie
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Joined: 26 Jul 2010
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,817
Location: My World, Highview, Louisville, Kentucky, USA, Earth, The Milky Way, Local Group, Local Supercluster
Aaaaanyway.
Ironically enough,
the right wing IS more likely to view man as having rightful dominion over everything else,
but less likely to believe in evolution, whether it can be accurately characterized as dominance or not (that'd be not).
Left-wingers overwhelmingly accept evolution, yet reject most "might makes right" ethical philosophies.
_________________
For there is another kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions; indifference and inaction and slow decay.
Bethie is not amused!
This of course stems from religious belief, which is unscientific at best. So if we are to refer to such as 'right wing-science' I suppose that lumps it into the 'pseudoscience' category
_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do
"YOU MANIACS! YOU BLEW IT UP! OH, DAMN YOU! GODDAMN YOU ALL TO HELL!"
One of my favorite movies of all time. Crossed my mind more than once, when thinking about this topic. More analogies in that movie with our present day society than there were back in the sixties.
In 100,000 years I can almost there being an entirely new genus of Homo assuming we aren't the last
Perhaps we will genetically engineer ourselves into extinction
_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do
Perhaps we will genetically engineer ourselves into extinction
no we got off of the evolution train 1.5 million years ago.
Our number one selective pressure today is disease resistance
that and the ease of gene movement makes speciation unlikely.
unless . . .
_________________
?We must not look at goblin men,
We must not buy their fruits:
Who knows upon what soil they fed
Their hungry thirsty roots??
http://jakobvirgil.blogspot.com/
Perhaps we will genetically engineer ourselves into extinction
no we got off of the evolution train 1.5 million years ago.
Our number one selective pressure today is disease resistance
that and the ease of gene movement makes speciation unlikely.
unless . . .
That's why I mentioned genetic engineering- I don't mean we'll disappear, but what currently is the standard genus of Homo Sapiens is bound to change as we begin using gene therapy and learn more about or genetic coding to the point that we can make serious changes physiologically
But in any case, 'modern' Humans only appeared about 200,000 years ago, so I don't think it is unrealistic to expect that we'll change significantly over the next few hundred thousand years
_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do
Ironically enough,
the right wing IS more likely to view man as having rightful dominion over everything else,
but less likely to believe in evolution, whether it can be accurately characterized as dominance or not (that'd be not).
Left-wingers overwhelmingly accept evolution, yet reject most "might makes right" ethical philosophies.
and we libertarian believe man as having rightful dominion and in evolution
SMARTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE
Ironically enough,
the right wing IS more likely to view man as having rightful dominion over everything else,
but less likely to believe in evolution, whether it can be accurately characterized as dominance or not (that'd be not).
Left-wingers overwhelmingly accept evolution, yet reject most "might makes right" ethical philosophies.
and we libertarian believe man as having rightful dominion and in evolution
SMARTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE
You're certainly smarter then my pet hamster, I'll give you that. Oh wait, I don't have a pet hamster
_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do
Bethie
Veteran
Joined: 26 Jul 2010
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,817
Location: My World, Highview, Louisville, Kentucky, USA, Earth, The Milky Way, Local Group, Local Supercluster
Ironically enough,
the right wing IS more likely to view man as having rightful dominion over everything else,
but less likely to believe in evolution, whether it can be accurately characterized as dominance or not (that'd be not).
Left-wingers overwhelmingly accept evolution, yet reject most "might makes right" ethical philosophies.
and we libertarian believe man as having rightful dominion and in evolution
SMARTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE
Pretty sure that's not a part of libertarianism.
_________________
For there is another kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions; indifference and inaction and slow decay.
Ironically enough,
the right wing IS more likely to view man as having rightful dominion over everything else,
but less likely to believe in evolution, whether it can be accurately characterized as dominance or not (that'd be not).
Left-wingers overwhelmingly accept evolution, yet reject most "might makes right" ethical philosophies.
and we libertarian believe man as having rightful dominion and in evolution
SMARTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE
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