Barack Obama on Bradley Manning: 'He broke the law'
Page 1 of 1 [ 10 posts ]
23 Apr 2011, 1:28 am
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0411/53601.html
This whole Manning thing is just getting worse an worse for Obama. This particular article recounts how he first proclaims that Manning "broke the law" when he's only been accused of such, and then further misstates his legal position when it comes to discussion of classified information (as the president he is allowed to set classification levels). I'd be disappointed in any president that behaved this way towards a whistle-blower, but the fact that Obama ran on promising to (among other things) protect whistle blowers and end the human rights abuses of his predecessor really makes this stink. Let's not forget that he was law professor and doesn't seem to understand due process, or where his executive powers begin and end... I'd facepalm if it wasn't so played out.
_________________
“The totally convinced and the totally stupid have too much in common for the resemblance to be accidental.”
-- Robert Anton Wilson
John_Browning
Veteran
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range
23 Apr 2011, 3:18 am
My big problem is the treatment of an American citizen. If they have to inject him with SSRIs to keep his mind from cracking, that is torture. Also, to the best of my knowledge he is yet to be given a chance to go before a military court and answer the charges against him. I'm not that familiar with the laws for the military justice system, so even though there is a chance the long wait for a trial may be legal, the government is way out of line in it's handling of the matter. While I personally think, that Manning should be executed for treason, I wouldn't be surprised if the government has done something illegal by now in it's handling of the investigation that would require charges to be dropped and him to get released with a dishonorable discharge.
_________________
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown
"A fear of weapons is a sign of ret*d sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud
23 Apr 2011, 3:20 am
John_Browning wrote:
My big problem is the treatment of an American citizen. If they have to inject him with SSRIs to keep his mind from cracking, that is torture. Also, to the best of my knowledge he is yet to be given a chance to go before a military court and answer the charges against him. I'm not that familiar with the laws for the military justice system, so even though there is a chance the long wait for a trial may be legal, the government is way out of line in it's handling of the matter. While I personally think, that Manning should be executed for treason, I wouldn't be surprised if the government has done something illegal by now in it's handling of the investigation that would require charges to be dropped and him to get released with a dishonorable discharge.
Which (legal) enemy has he aided, abetted or given comfort to?
ruveyn
John_Browning
Veteran
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range
23 Apr 2011, 4:09 am
ruveyn wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
My big problem is the treatment of an American citizen. If they have to inject him with SSRIs to keep his mind from cracking, that is torture. Also, to the best of my knowledge he is yet to be given a chance to go before a military court and answer the charges against him. I'm not that familiar with the laws for the military justice system, so even though there is a chance the long wait for a trial may be legal, the government is way out of line in it's handling of the matter. While I personally think, that Manning should be executed for treason, I wouldn't be surprised if the government has done something illegal by now in it's handling of the investigation that would require charges to be dropped and him to get released with a dishonorable discharge.
Which (legal) enemy has he aided, abetted or given comfort to?
ruveyn
I don't have the article handy, but the Taliban in Afghanistan has used some of the information to identify informants, interpreters, and past and present employees of the local government and military bases.
_________________
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown
"A fear of weapons is a sign of ret*d sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud
John_Browning
Veteran
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range
23 Apr 2011, 5:04 am
Biokinetica wrote:
Not having the article doesn't look good. Besides, It's pretty easy to dispute that since it's so obvious that the Pentagon doesn't have a clue as to what's actually going on over there.
Forgive me for not being able to magically pull the entire Google search engine out of my ass at 2am.
_________________
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown
"A fear of weapons is a sign of ret*d sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud
23 Apr 2011, 12:37 pm
John_Browning wrote:
I don't have the article handy, but the Taliban in Afghanistan has used some of the information to identify informants, interpreters, and past and present employees of the local government and military bases.
When did Congress declare war on the Taliban or issue a Letter of Marque and Reprisal. What makes the Taliban (legally speaking) an enemy of the United States?
ruveyn
23 Apr 2011, 1:33 pm
John_Browning wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
My big problem is the treatment of an American citizen. If they have to inject him with SSRIs to keep his mind from cracking, that is torture. Also, to the best of my knowledge he is yet to be given a chance to go before a military court and answer the charges against him. I'm not that familiar with the laws for the military justice system, so even though there is a chance the long wait for a trial may be legal, the government is way out of line in it's handling of the matter. While I personally think, that Manning should be executed for treason, I wouldn't be surprised if the government has done something illegal by now in it's handling of the investigation that would require charges to be dropped and him to get released with a dishonorable discharge.
Which (legal) enemy has he aided, abetted or given comfort to?
ruveyn
I don't have the article handy, but the Taliban in Afghanistan has used some of the information to identify informants, interpreters, and past and present employees of the local government and military bases.
Did he intentionally hand of such material to those people? Is there any sign of intent that this was his goal?
All the evidence suggests this was done as a whistleblower. This means that he's due a certain level of protection and if he has, in fact, exposed illegal actions then his illegal acts are, in fact, legal and most moral people would consider it a necessity. To the best of my knowledge, he has actually exposed a number of illegal acts in his leaks. Therefore, he shouldn't be locked up rather less tortured and should be under some form of witness protection.
_________________
Wherever they burn books they will also, in the end, burn human beings. ~Heinrich Heine, Almansor, 1823
?I wouldn't recommend sex, drugs or insanity for everyone, but they've always worked for me.? - Hunter S. Thompson
23 Apr 2011, 2:44 pm
John_Browning wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
My big problem is the treatment of an American citizen. If they have to inject him with SSRIs to keep his mind from cracking, that is torture. Also, to the best of my knowledge he is yet to be given a chance to go before a military court and answer the charges against him. I'm not that familiar with the laws for the military justice system, so even though there is a chance the long wait for a trial may be legal, the government is way out of line in it's handling of the matter. While I personally think, that Manning should be executed for treason, I wouldn't be surprised if the government has done something illegal by now in it's handling of the investigation that would require charges to be dropped and him to get released with a dishonorable discharge.
Which (legal) enemy has he aided, abetted or given comfort to?
ruveyn
I don't have the article handy, but the Taliban in Afghanistan has used some of the information to identify informants, interpreters, and past and present employees of the local government and military bases.
That is assuming he is the real leak in the first place.
23 Apr 2011, 2:57 pm
ruveyn wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
My big problem is the treatment of an American citizen. If they have to inject him with SSRIs to keep his mind from cracking, that is torture. Also, to the best of my knowledge he is yet to be given a chance to go before a military court and answer the charges against him. I'm not that familiar with the laws for the military justice system, so even though there is a chance the long wait for a trial may be legal, the government is way out of line in it's handling of the matter. While I personally think, that Manning should be executed for treason, I wouldn't be surprised if the government has done something illegal by now in it's handling of the investigation that would require charges to be dropped and him to get released with a dishonorable discharge.
Which (legal) enemy has he aided, abetted or given comfort to?
ruveyn
Although I think he should do 25 to life for this, the way the Government is torturing him isn't right either especially when he's still awaiting trial.
For those that don't know, leaking classified material is legal if you expose illegal activity:
Quote:
As per Executive Order 12333 and its subsequent updates:
1.4 the Intelligence Community. Consistent with applicable Federal law and with the other provisions of this order, and under the leadership of the Director, as specified in such law and this order, the Intelligence Community shall:
(a) Collect and provide information needed by the President and, in the performance of executive functions, the Vice President, the NSC, the Homeland Security Council, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, senior military commanders, and other executive branch officials and, as appropriate, the Congress of the United States;
(b) In accordance with priorities set by the President, collect information concerning, and conduct activities to protect against, international terrorism, proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, intelligence activities directed against the United States, international criminal drug activities, and other hostile activities directed against the United States by foreign powers, organizations, persons, and their agents;
(c) Analyze, produce, and disseminate intelligence;
(d) Conduct administrative, technical, and other support activities within the United States and abroad necessary for the performance of authorized activities, to include providing services of common concern for the Intelligence Community as designated by the Director in accordance with this order;
(e) Conduct research, development, and procurement of technical systems and devices relating to authorized functions and missions or the provision of services of common concern for the Intelligence Community;
(f) Protect the security of intelligence related activities, information, installations, property, and employees by appropriate means, including such investigations of applicants, employees, contractors, and other persons with similar associations with the Intelligence Community elements as are necessary;
(g) take into account State, local, and tribal governments' and, as appropriate, private sector entities' information needs relating to national and homeland security;
(h) Deconflict, coordinate, and integrate all intelligence activities and other information gathering in
accordance with section 1.3(b)(20) of this order; and
(i) Perform such other functions and duties related to intelligence activities as the President may direct.
Classification CANNOT be used to cover up crimes or illegal activity.
Furthermore, the knowing release of such information is a Federal Crime:
10 USC 904, article 104. Aiding the enemy
Any person who –
(1) aids, or attempts to aid, the enemy with arms, ammunition, supplies, money, or other things; or
(2) without proper authority, knowingly harbors or protects or gives intelligence to, or communicates or corresponds with or holds any intercourse with the enemy, either directly or indirectly;
shall suffer death or such other punishment as a court-martial or military commission may direct. This section does not apply to a military commission established under chapter 47A of this title. (47A is the list of crimes triable by a military commission)
Bottom Line: it doesn't matter what one's beliefs are, it is against Federal Law to release without authority classified information, period. If one believes that information should be released for any other reason MUST be willing to accept the consequences up to and including death, period. one must be held accountable and made responsible for one's actions. This is true of any situation.
1.4 the Intelligence Community. Consistent with applicable Federal law and with the other provisions of this order, and under the leadership of the Director, as specified in such law and this order, the Intelligence Community shall:
(a) Collect and provide information needed by the President and, in the performance of executive functions, the Vice President, the NSC, the Homeland Security Council, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, senior military commanders, and other executive branch officials and, as appropriate, the Congress of the United States;
(b) In accordance with priorities set by the President, collect information concerning, and conduct activities to protect against, international terrorism, proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, intelligence activities directed against the United States, international criminal drug activities, and other hostile activities directed against the United States by foreign powers, organizations, persons, and their agents;
(c) Analyze, produce, and disseminate intelligence;
(d) Conduct administrative, technical, and other support activities within the United States and abroad necessary for the performance of authorized activities, to include providing services of common concern for the Intelligence Community as designated by the Director in accordance with this order;
(e) Conduct research, development, and procurement of technical systems and devices relating to authorized functions and missions or the provision of services of common concern for the Intelligence Community;
(f) Protect the security of intelligence related activities, information, installations, property, and employees by appropriate means, including such investigations of applicants, employees, contractors, and other persons with similar associations with the Intelligence Community elements as are necessary;
(g) take into account State, local, and tribal governments' and, as appropriate, private sector entities' information needs relating to national and homeland security;
(h) Deconflict, coordinate, and integrate all intelligence activities and other information gathering in
accordance with section 1.3(b)(20) of this order; and
(i) Perform such other functions and duties related to intelligence activities as the President may direct.
Classification CANNOT be used to cover up crimes or illegal activity.
Furthermore, the knowing release of such information is a Federal Crime:
10 USC 904, article 104. Aiding the enemy
Any person who –
(1) aids, or attempts to aid, the enemy with arms, ammunition, supplies, money, or other things; or
(2) without proper authority, knowingly harbors or protects or gives intelligence to, or communicates or corresponds with or holds any intercourse with the enemy, either directly or indirectly;
shall suffer death or such other punishment as a court-martial or military commission may direct. This section does not apply to a military commission established under chapter 47A of this title. (47A is the list of crimes triable by a military commission)
Bottom Line: it doesn't matter what one's beliefs are, it is against Federal Law to release without authority classified information, period. If one believes that information should be released for any other reason MUST be willing to accept the consequences up to and including death, period. one must be held accountable and made responsible for one's actions. This is true of any situation.
Page 1 of 1 [ 10 posts ]
| Similar Topics | |
|---|---|
| Im broke |
06 Mar 2024, 11:26 am |
| Gemini broke my brain on neurotypicals |
10 Apr 2024, 10:19 am |
| Secret army of women who broke Nazi codes get recognition |
23 Apr 2024, 8:35 pm |
