Hitler exterminated mentally ill people and sick people

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marshall
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24 Apr 2011, 9:09 am

TallyMan wrote:
(Thread moved from General Autism Discussion to PPR)

Should have been moved to the dung heap. :roll:



HerrGrimm
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24 Apr 2011, 9:51 am

Dasaniman wrote:
i see alot of peoples selfish gene has been activated "crack" "crack" "crack"


If you don't like me saying ACTUAL science (I did say that elimination is impossible unless every single parent got a genetic screen and carried the abortion out) or ACTUAL historical fact, then don't post here.

How would you answer the questions you asked, anyway?

I am pretty sure I know more about this than you :wink:


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Raptor
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24 Apr 2011, 10:06 am

Wikipedia article on Aktion T4:

"Racial hygienist ideas were far from unique to the Nazi movement. The ideas of social Darwinism were widespread in all western countries in the early 20th century, and the eugenics movement had many followers among educated people, being particularly strong in the United States. The idea of sterilising those carrying hereditary defects or exhibiting what was thought to be hereditary antisocial behaviour was widely accepted, and was put into law in the United States, Sweden, Switzerland and other countries. Between 1935 and 1975, for example, 63,000 people were sterilised on eugenic grounds in Sweden."

The countries other than Nazi German only went as far as sterilization where Nazi Germany used that in addition to euthanasia.



HerrGrimm
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24 Apr 2011, 10:14 am

Raptor wrote:
The countries other than Nazi German only went as far as sterilization where Nazi Germany used that in addition to euthanasia.


Asperger's,research was done in reaction to a new law calling for the elimination of children with hereditary diseases. You can tell from the first paragraph of his own paper. He made an effort to stop children from being killed. His work was to show that the children themselves were useful to society. It is discussed in this book. You can click on the Look Inside feature and see the page yourself. It is on Page 10.

Hitler's views were based on American policies (like McLaughlin's), but took it one step further.

I am not really sure what you mean: I do not feel it is really important where they were dying.

EDIT: Oh wait, reading comprehension thing again, I got it now, sorry.


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Last edited by HerrGrimm on 24 Apr 2011, 10:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

kx250rider
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24 Apr 2011, 10:24 am

Understanding Hitler is essential in order to protect us and future generations from another despicable person one like him.

I believe that he had a deadly combination of extreme intelligence, charisma, leadership ability, and general public appeal, to be able to get people to abandon their own morals and follow his example. Maybe on a large-scale rendition of how Manson got his gang to murder people for him, and how a street thug can get innocent kids to join up into a gang, and start hurting, stealing, raping, and killing. He won those people over by creating a mutual "enemy", and then giving his favored people the best self-esteem boost imaginable. When you do that to someone, you can get them to act for you. I pray that anyone with that combination of abilities now and in the future, may use those abilities for good and not evil.

What scares the holy sh*t out of me, is to hear that some schools no longer teach the history of Nazi Germany or the Holocaust. Forgetting it, will GUARANTEE it's repeat!! !! !! !! ! I tell you, the best education I had on the Holocaust, was a few years ago when my wife and I sat in a car with a friend of mine, who told how when he was 7, he and his family got on a train in Czechoslovakia, and his father got off at one place to board another train, his sister at another, and then his mother told him to go to the other end of the train and sit very quietly... They got off the train, and hid in horse stall in Poland for a few days, then snuck out the back window and ran away, and by the grace of God, wound up getting on a ship for Canada and safety in 1939. He has no idea what ever happened to his little sister, and his father was presumed to have made it to the train's original destination; Auschwitz. Have you ever seen a retired millionaire break down bawling while telling a story like that? I tell you that you don't want to. But you'd never forget it.

Charles



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24 Apr 2011, 10:35 am

HerrGrimm wrote:
Dasaniman wrote:
do you think he had good intentions by eliminating the sick?

Hans Asperger did not think so. So that is a resounding 'no'. in my opinion.

I might be way off here, but ...

As I understand things, the sick or infirm or unnecessarily-burdensome or whatever were being summarily eliminated, but then Hans seems to have somehow influenced at least part of that ... and that would make him the first AS activist, would it not?

Either way, I am glad he was there then and we are now here.


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HerrGrimm
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24 Apr 2011, 10:39 am

kx250rider wrote:
I believe that he had a deadly combination of extreme intelligence, charisma, leadership ability, and general public appeal, to be able to get people to abandon their own morals and follow his example. Maybe on a large-scale rendition of how Manson got his gang to murder people for him, and how a street thug can get innocent kids to join up into a gang, and start hurting, stealing, raping, and killing. He won those people over by creating a mutual "enemy", and then giving his favored people the best self-esteem boost imaginable. When you do that to someone, you can get them to act for you. I pray that anyone with that combination of abilities now and in the future, may use those abilities for good and not evil.

Charles


WARNING: Slight derailment!

I'm sure Iran and Hezbollah agree with your extremely logical and sensible thought. Hezbollah leaders have college educations, and if you look at the demographic of a suicide bomber you can see they are MIDDLE-CLASS, not lower-class. This included the 19 hijackers.

EDIT: There is some indication that Asperger might have had AS himself. That would make him the first SELF-advocate if that is true.


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24 Apr 2011, 11:21 am

EDIT: There is some indication that Asperger might have had AS himself. That would make him the first SELF-advocate if that is true.

I read that in a few places, too, that he may have very well been an aspie himself. Also that he served as medical officer in the Wehrmacht (or the SS) at some point during the war.



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24 Apr 2011, 11:23 am

Raptor wrote:
I read that in a few places, too, that he may have very well been an aspie himself. Also that he served as medical oficer in the Wehrmacht (or the SS) at some point during the war.


Ironically, he was a medic in Croatia AFTER he did the study (published in 1944, served until 1945). That has nothing to do with any extermination program or any research he did. I usually do not bring that up much.

kx250rider wrote:
What scares the holy sh*t out of me, is to hear that some schools no longer teach the history of Nazi Germany or the Holocaust. Forgetting it, will GUARANTEE it's repeat!! !! !! !! ! I tell you, the best education I had on the Holocaust, was a few years ago when my wife and I sat in a car with a friend of mine, who told how when he was 7, he and his family got on a train in Czechoslovakia, and his father got off at one place to board another train, his sister at another, and then his mother told him to go to the other end of the train and sit very quietly... They got off the train, and hid in horse stall in Poland for a few days, then snuck out the back window and ran away, and by the grace of God, wound up getting on a ship for Canada and safety in 1939. He has no idea what ever happened to his little sister, and his father was presumed to have made it to the train's original destination; Auschwitz. Have you ever seen a retired millionaire break down bawling while telling a story like that? I tell you that you don't want to. But you'd never forget it.


The problem I had with learning about the Holocaust is they only tell you about the villians. They never say how some people sabotaged their own work to stop the war machine, and especially this story. I don't know about you, but this was the most incredible one I have heard from the war.


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24 Apr 2011, 12:46 pm

When the Khymer Rouge in Camodia did their bit they went after the educated. Such as anyone wearing glasses, school teachers, or anyone that seemed like they might know something. All killed. I'm sure many AS types were culled there.



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24 Apr 2011, 1:08 pm

simon_says wrote:
When the Khymer Rouge in Camodia did their bit they went after the educated. Such as anyone wearing glasses, school teachers, or anyone that seemed like they might know something. All killed. I'm sure many AS types were culled there.


Studies have shown that give or take, about 1 in 110 people worldwide have autism (I am going by British data back in 1995; you should stop and think about that for a minute). Good chance people with autism were killed.

But this is one of my biggest pet peeves, and I'm sorry if I misread it but it looks like you said it. If you look at studies, you can see people with AS span a good range in IQ. Some have very serious social problems. It drive me nuts that there needs to be some positive label attached to AS, like 'intelligent' or 'genius'. or trying to find ways to make every positive historical figure out to have AS, while apparently no negative figure ever had it. I found a periodical where it showed people with AS have no increased ability in math, probably because of other factors involved in life. I seriously wish I could say I have autism instead of AS, because that is what it is: autism. The Khmer Rouge was EXTREMELY anti-intellectual and savage, but please stop using AS as if it indicates genius or above-average IQ compared to other people. People with AS span a very wide range and is a spectrum itself, including intelligence and social adaptations. We're still all human beings in the end.


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24 Apr 2011, 1:15 pm

I made no such claims.

But people with special interests and pedantic mannerisms are likely to be swept up in an anti-intellectual purge. And I said school teachers and those with glasses as well. What do they have to do with genius? Nothing either.



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24 Apr 2011, 1:18 pm

simon_says wrote:
I made no such claims.

But people with special interests and pedantic mannerisms are likely to be swept up in an anti-intellectual purge. And I said school teachers and those with glasses as well. What do they have to do with genius? Nothing either.


That is what I thought. I was thinking I was wrong because of my reading comprehension. It was more of a blanket statement for the rest to see as well.


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draelynn
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24 Apr 2011, 7:53 pm

Gee - Hitler is a popular guy round here...



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24 Apr 2011, 9:51 pm

HerrGrimm wrote:
Raptor wrote:
I read that in a few places, too, that he may have very well been an aspie himself. Also that he served as medical oficer in the Wehrmacht (or the SS) at some point during the war.


Quote:
Ironically, he was a medic in Croatia AFTER he did the study (published in 1944, served until 1945). That has nothing to do with any extermination program or any research he did. I usually do not bring that up much.


I wasn't implying that his service to the Third Reich was in an way connected to his studies of Asperger's Syndrome.