What does "It's what they're not saying" mean?

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CrinklyCrustacean
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11 Jul 2011, 7:06 am

A few months back, I was fielding a load of questions about a project I was involved in, and someone said he was irritated with me. When I asked for clarification he replied, "It's not what you are saying but what you are not saying." When I asked what it was he thought I wasn't saying, so that I may address it, he didn't answer. I am still totally confused. What on earth did he mean? Was he expecting set phrases which I did not give? How did he expect me to put him at ease when he wouldn't tell me what it was I (apparently) wasn't saying? I just don't understand. Clearly this is a non-literal statement, but the meaning is completely obscure to me. :scratch:



nemorosa
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11 Jul 2011, 7:13 am

An example would be if CEO of your business called a meeting and announced that your main competitor had acquired your business. In this meeting your CEO might talk about:

What wonderful opportunities this brings
Exciting future
Challenges to be met
How the two companies will be stronger together etc.

What he isn't saying is:

There will be job losses
You'll now have different working conditions
You'll all have to move if you want to keep your job.



Australien
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11 Jul 2011, 7:17 am

I am somewhat confused by this phrase as well. How can you draw inferences from a lack of information?

What I think it means is that there are certain things you would be expected to say in a given situation if you were being honest and open and the fact that you did not implies that you are attempting to hide from scrutiny or not confront particular truths. Or I could be wrong, I think it's a stupid phrase. You either have enough information given to you to make an inference or you do not.



wavefreak58
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11 Jul 2011, 8:25 am

Australien wrote:
I am somewhat confused by this phrase as well. How can you draw inferences from a lack of information?

What I think it means is that there are certain things you would be expected to say in a given situation if you were being honest and open and the fact that you did not implies that you are attempting to hide from scrutiny or not confront particular truths. Or I could be wrong, I think it's a stupid phrase. You either have enough information given to you to make an inference or you do not.



It's not even about honesty. Honesty is nowhere near as absolute as we would like to think.

It's about managing perception. nemorosa's examples are really good. What a CEO wants is to get people to accept his leadership. So they highlight the good, ignore the bad and let people fill in the blanks. This affect perception and gives them space to operate. In political circles this is called "spin". This is where truth gets fuzzy. Given any set of facts (assuming they are accurate) and republicans will say one thing about those facts while democrats say another. BOTH will leave things unsaid if it harms their message.

Learning to look beyond the overt message to figure out what wasn't said is important - and really hard for us on the spectrum.


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draelynn
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11 Jul 2011, 8:36 am

There is also the possibility that they were reading something into your body language - or lack thereof - that just wasn't there. They are applying their rules to your behavior and possibly reading unintended messages. That, perhaps, is even worse. In work situation this has been my greatest challenge.



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11 Jul 2011, 8:40 am

Australien wrote:
I am somewhat confused by this phrase as well. How can you draw inferences from a lack of information?

What I think it means is that there are certain things you would be expected to say in a given situation if you were being honest and open and the fact that you did not implies that you are attempting to hide from scrutiny or not confront particular truths. Or I could be wrong, I think it's a stupid phrase. You either have enough information given to you to make an inference or you do not.


Being truthful doesn't matter to these people. What matters is that they say what they need to with the minimum of fuss. In the CEO situation given the CEO doesn't want to talk about the negatives because it causes him problems, like being held up with questions and worries and he just doesn't give enough of a damn.



Australien
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11 Jul 2011, 8:46 am

wavefreak58 wrote:
Australien wrote:
I am somewhat confused by this phrase as well. How can you draw inferences from a lack of information?

What I think it means is that there are certain things you would be expected to say in a given situation if you were being honest and open and the fact that you did not implies that you are attempting to hide from scrutiny or not confront particular truths. Or I could be wrong, I think it's a stupid phrase. You either have enough information given to you to make an inference or you do not.



It's not even about honesty. Honesty is nowhere near as absolute as we would like to think.

It's about managing perception. nemorosa's examples are really good. What a CEO wants is to get people to accept his leadership. So they highlight the good, ignore the bad and let people fill in the blanks. This affect perception and gives them space to operate. In political circles this is called "spin". This is where truth gets fuzzy. Given any set of facts (assuming they are accurate) and republicans will say one thing about those facts while democrats say another. BOTH will leave things unsaid if it harms their message.

Learning to look beyond the overt message to figure out what wasn't said is important - and really hard for us on the spectrum.


I'm actually reasonably good at this (I think) - enduring all-staff meetings has honed my BS detector nicely. I just think the phrase in question is silly.



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11 Jul 2011, 8:47 am

draelynn wrote:
There is also the possibility that they were reading something into your body language - or lack thereof - that just wasn't there. They are applying their rules to your behavior and possibly reading unintended messages. That, perhaps, is even worse. In work situation this has been my greatest challenge.


I think this is often the case for people on the spectrum: lack of or furtive eye contact, in particular, can lead someone to believe that you are hiding something. Another one is tone of voice - speaking very fast in a monotone, or long pauses are things NTs do when they are nervous or hiding something.

If you aren't open about your diagnosis at work, you might try saying something like "I have some odd mannerisms that sometimes people misunderstand. Were you reacting to that, or was there something specific that was said that caused your concern?" You might also add "I'm pretty straightforward and direct - if I missed something, it was an oversight."



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11 Jul 2011, 9:21 am

We all say things that are basically the “punch line” of a conversation without feeling the need to include the whole joke (as it were) NTs more so than other. A crude example would be when someone says “coffee” and they have a coffee cup in their hand it is either a statement of fact “I’m drinking Coffee” or If they are your boss, it is an instruction or invitation to make a cup (of coffee) or join them in a cup (coffee)
Or if someone say “the boss what to see you” and adds a parting comment of “good luck” what they really mean is “you’re in a whole world of hurt, the boss is going to hang you out to dry”
Nts speak in ‘punch lines’ all the time. They say something, but know that what they don’t say will be understood.
Nts use a lot of shorthand. Learning the shorthand and reading between the lines to fathom out what they say and what they mean is next to impossible but it is worth trying.
They are happy to learn the codes of “what I really mean when I say…” and NNTs can do the same all it takes is practice.



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11 Jul 2011, 9:41 am

Guys...

That phrase is standard NT speak for
"Your voice is telling me one thing but your body language is telling me something else"
----
Simplify.



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11 Jul 2011, 9:49 am

OddFiction wrote:
Guys...

That phrase is standard NT speak for
"Your voice is telling me one thing but your body language is telling me something else"
----
Simplify.
How would that work over, say, the Telephone?



SilverSolace
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11 Jul 2011, 10:11 am

Tadpole wrote:
OddFiction wrote:
Guys...

That phrase is standard NT speak for
"Your voice is telling me one thing but your body language is telling me something else"
----
Simplify.
How would that work over, say, the Telephone?

Voice tone or word choice.



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11 Jul 2011, 10:12 am

It's not just body language; it's also connotations (between-the-lines meanings) and tone of voice and whatnot. Sometimes they'll read things that aren't there because they expect something to be there like it would be for NTs, instead of just static.


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momsparky
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11 Jul 2011, 10:38 am

Tadpole wrote:
OddFiction wrote:
Guys...

That phrase is standard NT speak for
"Your voice is telling me one thing but your body language is telling me something else"
----
Simplify.
How would that work over, say, the Telephone?


For example:

momsparky wrote:
I think this is often the case for people on the spectrum: lack of or furtive eye contact, in particular, can lead someone to believe that you are hiding something. Another one is tone of voice - speaking very fast in a monotone, or long pauses are things NTs do when they are nervous or hiding something.

If you aren't open about your diagnosis at work, you might try saying something like "I have some odd mannerisms that sometimes people misunderstand. Were you reacting to that, or was there something specific that was said that caused your concern?" You might also add "I'm pretty straightforward and direct - if I missed something, it was an oversight."



OddFiction
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11 Jul 2011, 10:43 am

Tadpole wrote:
OddFiction wrote:
Guys...

That phrase is standard NT speak for
"Your voice is telling me one thing but your body language is telling me something else"
----
Simplify.
How would that work over, say, the Telephone?


Bah. Unclear me.
I should have writ:

"Your WORDS are telling me one thing but your body language (or poor prosidy) is telling me something else"

Amen to MomSparky for clearing that up.


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nemorosa
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11 Jul 2011, 10:47 am

OddFiction wrote:
Guys...

That phrase is standard NT speak for
"Your voice is telling me one thing but your body language is telling me something else"
----
Simplify.


I disagree. What you describe is called lying. Quite different from what people mean by "what they are not saying".