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swbluto
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03 Dec 2011, 6:38 pm

Lizerina wrote:
swbluto wrote:
Just curious if there's any association between speech therapy (Or early language development "issues") and getting schizophrenia later on, so I was checking it out.


I don't really know of any. I was a late talker, but we figure that's mainly just because I'm the youngest of four and all I had to do if I wanted something was point at it and someone would give it to me. Haha


Huh, interesting. I was a late talker, too. I subjectively noticed some significant verbal differences between me and others and I seem to be "less sophisticated" when I try to talk "normally" (I think?), and I thought that perhaps those who were late talkers or had expressive language disorders would tend to have poorer verbal memory (And my memory testing suggests I have poor "verbal memory" for stories.). Since the core intellectual deficits in schizophrenia start at a very early age and a core intellectual impairment in many schizophrenics is in longterm verbal memory, it would seem reasonable that late-talkers or those with expressive deficits (Like myself, I'm guessing) would be at increased risk of developing schizophrenia.


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swbluto wrote:
The part about it not getting jumbled was a joke (I actually reversed the order of two words earlier in the post if you look enough), and I originally said "words my jumbled don't get". See how that's jumbled? ;)


I know it was a joke. But you say that your words don't get jumbled and then in your next post you say that they do. See how you're contradicting yourself?


By joke, I meant I wasn't serious. As in, I was trying to be sarcastic. Meaning, I was lying the first time I said that. I could see how it wouldn't come across that way, so I could see how it would appear I was contradicting myself.

Maybe this is an autistic-esque ToM language issue of mine. If you're not-autistic, you're not the first non-autistic person who didn't get my sarcasm.

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swbluto wrote:
Got my memory scores back and it seems my memory scores are relatively good (They averaged at the 70th percentile), but there were two pretty low scores and they were "Design II" and "Logical Memory II" which are both longterm memory subtests and they were at the 10th and 25th percentile respectively. The "Logical memory" test is a "Recall the story I told you" test. Also, interestingly, I scored "Low Average" on the BCSE (Brief Cognitive State Exam) which is a measure for alzheimers, dementia, etc.; I'm *supposed* to get an "average" score, not "low average", especially not with my IQ of 132. -_-

This seems to suggest possible longterm verbal memory deficits. So, I looked into the schizophrenic research and, lo and behold, verbal memory deficits are one of the chief impairments in schizoprenia. Most of the research seemed to center around the CVLT and this meta-analysis is pretty informative:

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/article ... urnalID=13

So, I just need to take the CVLT and I'll have the evidence I need. I think I'll try to find a psych, to administer it, on Monday.


Where did you take these tests? If they were on the internet, they're probably not very reliable. You shouldn't believe most of these tests. If you're really serious about this and you actually want to know, go see a doctor!


Oh, it actually was from a doctor! The Wechsler Memory Scale, too! But, she was specifically assessing ADHD and I got the diagnosis of ADHD-inattentive. She didn't rule autism or schizophrenia, however, as she wasn't testing for that, so I'm having an autism screening coming up soon. As far as schizophrenia, I don't have a fricking clue on how to objectively rule it out using tests and stuff.



swbluto
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03 Dec 2011, 7:05 pm

bumble wrote:
I once spent months obsessively looking up stuff on schizophrenia because I was worried that I was developing it. When I spoke to my psychiatrist about it he chuckled and said "No I don't think you have that".

I could be wrong but I doubt schizophrenia is your problem either.


Well, while your case could be reassuring, I'm not sure if you have as many risk factors as I do. I had avoidant personality disorder and OCD and my "prose memory" and "design memory" was far lower than my general memory ability, all of which are associated with schizophrenia (However, oddly, I did quite well on "paired associates" and the draw-what-you-saw test.). Plus, I already have olfactory hallucinations of smoke and I occasionally falsely hear sounds of sirens, dogs and doors slamming when I'm going to sleep and I see weird shapes in my vision at times. And my IQ apparently declined by nearly a standard deviation over the past 5 years. Plus, it seems many people think I have mental problems and many people act like it when they talk to me or hear me talk.

In your case, though, it's clear your verbal memory is above average. The fact that many people think of you as fairly intelligent IN REAL LIFE suggests you're definitely not lacking in the memory abilities underlying speaking and writing and you're obviously good at using more sophisticated, yet *normal*, grammatical and lexical patterns.



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03 Dec 2011, 7:38 pm

dear swbluto If it's impairing your daily life then get a DX and some professional help. If it's manageable right now then why not find alternative ways to deal with it like eating healthy, exercising, possibly even therapy. What a psychiatric DX comes down to is symptom management, you don't have to fit perfectly into a diagnostic box. From what I've read you need to find a way to manage the OCD symptoms unless schizophrenia has become a personal interest? You should be more interested in schizophrenia on a personal level not a diagnostic level if you think it's something that is impairing you. That means trying to better yourself, and leaving the rest to the professionals if it's that bad. I'm going to quote myself from another thread here because I struggle with dyslexia. Schizophrenia is autism? http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp4187364 ... t=#4187364 <----you might like this thread

Angel_ryan wrote:
dmc68 wrote:
So, is the Original Poster more confused now than when he/she started the thread? lol


I think the real problem is the overlap between symptoms. My belief is that people don't necessarily fit into diagnostic criteria boxes nicely which would be based off the theory that all humans are unique. Rather than focusing on labeling people properly and rigidly I think we need to focus on an individual's symptoms and many possible methods of improving the quality of their life which is not limited to medication. That is my biggest problem with the mental health system. The person working with me believes that too and I was advised against allowing an official diagnosis of schizo affective because their worry was that my aspergers would be ignored and the medications used are the same so. Rather than limiting me to medication a window for therapies that would help my autism symptoms is left open. I was warned the window could be closed if I'm officially diagnosed. I genuinely do have my Aspergers diagnosis at this point which gives access to medication and a wider window of therapies. Which has proven to be way more helpful towards my melancholic depression.



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03 Dec 2011, 9:41 pm

Angel_ryan wrote:
dear swbluto If it's impairing your daily life then get a DX and some professional help. If it's manageable right now then why not find alternative ways to deal with it like eating healthy, exercising, possibly even therapy. What a psychiatric DX comes down to is symptom management, you don't have to fit perfectly into a diagnostic box. From what I've read you need to find a way to manage the OCD symptoms unless schizophrenia has become a personal interest? You should be more interested in schizophrenia on a personal level not a diagnostic level if you think it's something that is impairing you. That means trying to better yourself, and leaving the rest to the professionals if it's that bad. I'm going to quote myself from another thread here because I struggle with dyslexia. Schizophrenia is autism? http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp4187364 ... t=#4187364 <----you might like this thread

Angel_ryan wrote:
dmc68 wrote:
So, is the Original Poster more confused now than when he/she started the thread? lol


I think the real problem is the overlap between symptoms. My belief is that people don't necessarily fit into diagnostic criteria boxes nicely which would be based off the theory that all humans are unique. Rather than focusing on labeling people properly and rigidly I think we need to focus on an individual's symptoms and many possible methods of improving the quality of their life which is not limited to medication. That is my biggest problem with the mental health system. The person working with me believes that too and I was advised against allowing an official diagnosis of schizo affective because their worry was that my aspergers would be ignored and the medications used are the same so. Rather than limiting me to medication a window for therapies that would help my autism symptoms is left open. I was warned the window could be closed if I'm officially diagnosed. I genuinely do have my Aspergers diagnosis at this point which gives access to medication and a wider window of therapies. Which has proven to be way more helpful towards my melancholic depression.


Hey, I'm making the best of my life regardless of what I currently have! I'm eating oats and salads, exercising and doing whatever's interesting.

Anyway, I found that an odd thought process that an NT pointed out was actually schizophrenic in nature: http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp4212498.html#4212498

And, I had a weird sensation in my brain as if it were in my hippocampus where it sounded like it was saying "hey" to itself.

w00t! w00t! I'm going to be a schizophrenic, something the rest of you 99% of the world can't be! HAHAHAHAHAHA!



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04 Dec 2011, 12:36 am

swbluto wrote:
[w00t! w00t! I'm going to be a schizophrenic, something the rest of you 99% of the world can't be! HAHAHAHAHAHA!


I can't say I'm as enthusiastic as you. I'm just trying to manage my symptoms so I can have a decent quality life. If I were worse off then I am now I wouldn't be excited I'd be dead. In case you hadn't noticed it's not fun being mentally ill. It drastically reduces the quality of your life and you don't always find the right med or land the best doctor to treat you. :( I was just trying to be nice. This morning I woke up with a head ace and some kind of waking paralysis during which I saw a strange thing floating on my wall and had some freakish monster like voice growling in my ears I seriously could've lived without that. It was like having someone piss in my cereal.



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04 Dec 2011, 11:27 am

Actually now that I think about it I can sorta understand why you wouldn't mind being schizophrenic. Could it possibly have something to do with increased creativity? I do like a lot of writing and artwork created by other MI people. I do believe that suffering can be inspiring to an extent or at least that's my personal experience with it. And, yes Schizophrenia is totally interesting I won't lie but when it's in your face pissing you off, or ruining your life it's interesting aspects melt away leaving a picture of hell. I do like to sugar coat it to myself the same way I like to sugar coat AS to myself. Oh this famous person has it or maybe that one did. Or hey there's some kind of new study on it that says this....and that maybe it makes me special. I've grown out of that kind of thinking to an extent. I do appreciate the MI artists and writers I do look up to, I don't think it was just having a mental illness that made them creative or great, but mental illness itself has always been used as a way to categorize people. If you think your special or creative you don't have to categorize yourself.

Actually I've posted in this tread some of my positive associations towards having schizophrenia http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt178783.html.

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And hey schizophrenia is kinda cool. Just look at John Nash he was total awesomeness, and Enstiern's son was schizophrenic, Oh and the coolest guy ever Philip K. Dick I can name a lot of cool schizophrenic people. Hell other people I know who have schizophrenia I think are creative and kinda cool not just when they're unstable.



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04 Dec 2011, 9:44 pm

Angel_ryan wrote:
Actually now that I think about it I can sorta understand why you wouldn't mind being schizophrenic. Could it possibly have something to do with increased creativity? I do like a lot of writing and artwork created by other MI people. I do believe that suffering can be inspiring to an extent or at least that's my personal experience with it. And, yes Schizophrenia is totally interesting I won't lie but when it's in your face pissing you off, or ruining your life it's interesting aspects melt away leaving a picture of hell. I do like to sugar coat it to myself the same way I like to sugar coat AS to myself. Oh this famous person has it or maybe that one did. Or hey there's some kind of new study on it that says this....and that maybe it makes me special. I've grown out of that kind of thinking to an extent. I do appreciate the MI artists and writers I do look up to, I don't think it was just having a mental illness that made them creative or great, but mental illness itself has always been used as a way to categorize people. If you think your special or creative you don't have to categorize yourself.

Actually I've posted in this tread some of my positive associations towards having schizophrenia http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt178783.html.
Quote:
And hey schizophrenia is kinda cool. Just look at John Nash he was total awesomeness, and Enstiern's son was schizophrenic, Oh and the coolest guy ever Philip K. Dick I can name a lot of cool schizophrenic people. Hell other people I know who have schizophrenia I think are creative and kinda cool not just when they're unstable.


No, realistically, I don't think schizophrenia has a lot of "coolness" to it. And whatever "creative" personality traits that are associated with it, already existed in the individual before developing schizophrenia so schizophrenia does nothing but make it worse. But, who am I kidding, what's not to love?!

It's hard to communicate with people, so annoying people avoid talking to you.

Because of the previous problem, it makes relationships of all kinds all but impossible. Great! Messy breakups are a thing of the past!

And, hey, the employment picture just got a little bleaker. But, that's not a bad
thing, who wants to deal with a tyrant of a boss 2080 hours of the year?

And, for those who already had a boring life, it just makes it a bit more interesting and entertaining at times. (Although, you'd have to be among the half of schizos that have "insight" to amusingly reflect on your experiences. The other half just have to deal with the nightmares while awake.)

So, when you have it, you just gotta embrace the positive aspects and think positively. And there's a lot to love!



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04 Dec 2011, 9:53 pm

Your a computer engineer, I feel people should understand that. Your a logical organism.



bumble
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05 Dec 2011, 2:23 pm

Do you only hear sounds when going off to sleep? If so have you heard of something called hypnagogia? It is actually quite normal and happens to a lot of people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypnagogia

Also with the smoke smell...have you checked out simple partial seizures. It may not be that, but it is just one possibility.
Sinus problems are another.

Back in my early 20s I had a drinking problem. During withdrawal and after I quit, for about a year or so I would sometimes smell the scent of burning rubber even though nothing was burning. In my case this would then be followed by a Deja Vu from hell and then feeling surreal for several minutes which was accompanied by a feeling of extreme fear that would wash over me from nowhere. I put it down to the effects of the alcohol as withdrawal can be associated with seizures. I also had seizures as a baby because I was premature (about 30 weeks) so it wouldn't have surprised me if I was prone to the occasional alcohol induced seizure as an adult (I am not sure if being premature and having a history of them might have made me more prone to them or wether that is irrelevant). I also had chronic sinus problems at the time so that may have been contributing to the phantom smell (unsure).

Anyway, I have not consumed alcohol in over 11 years now so no longer get those symptoms. But the burning smell may not be due to schizophrenia or psychosis. You don't sound psychotic in your posts, but you do seem like you are having a bit of an OCD moment (had OCD myself for a while but got rid of it as it was getting on my nerves...I don't mind obsessions that I enjoy but it was getting ridiculous so I booted it using a variety of therapy techniques I had researched). There I would be trying to enjoy my 14 hour day of doing jigsaw puzzles when I found myself having to keep putting pieces in, then taking them out, then putting them in, then taking them out, then putting them in....it was disrupting my enjoyment basically. I also kept blowing light bulbs because I would repeatedly flick light switches until I got a blister on my finger. It just had to go...



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06 Dec 2011, 6:32 am

People are watching me through the window and there's a man standing in my closet watching me when I try to go to bed. Why won't they just LEAVE ME ALONE???

I'm not taking those thoughts seriously, but they keep crossing my mind to the point where I'm still unable to fall asleep as of 3:30 A.M. I used to get to bed at midnight every night, but not recently. There seems to be one or two thoughts that are constantly keeping me up.

Given the above thoughts, I think if I'm really developing schizophrenia, it'll likely be paranoid schizophrenia.

Also, in other news, my blood pressure isn't going down despite being on an "oats and salads" diet that supposedly reduces the blood pressure for at least 80% of the people who try it. That's interesting because that suggests MY DIET isn't the cause of my high blood pressure unlike it is for many people. What other factors are there? There's weight but I'm just *barely* in the overweight BMI category and I'm not fat at all - I'm only 30 pounds over my particular "perfect weight". And I really doubt that my weight would be the cause of my rather high blood pressure at this young of an age.

So, I researched, and apparently high blood pressure and cardiovascular disease is a common problem in schizophrenia. Great.



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06 Dec 2011, 6:58 am

I also had paranoid thoughts when I was really stressed.
Tony Attwood is writing in his book about it, that fear can get so strong in autistic people that it get's paranoid.
The stress was gone and everything was normal again. :D


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06 Dec 2011, 11:49 am

I thought I was developing schizophrenia as well but I think it's just stress and stimulant antidepressant caused psychosis. I would like to WARN people about wellbutrin as well as stimulant drugs, causing psychotic behavior, amphetamine caused my cousin to snap and commit suicide.

For awhile this semester I have had a hard time telling what was real or not, as I was being stalked by a psychopathic NT girl and completely ripped a hole in reality for sharing metaphysical dreams with people. Anyways, I don't even want to think about that as it sends my head in a tailspin just thinking about it.

I DO believe people with ASD's can have psychic, telepathic, or ESP abilities BECAUSE of the SOCIAL DEFICIT in the brain that causes them to think on a more primal or animalistic level. This rare ability can in turn cause paranoia for having 'super powers' which is probably how people become full blown insane, for recognizing the patterns of God and nature.
This is where the line comes in question between ASD and schizophrenia. I have had severe brain fog which is characteristic of pre-schizophrenia which is releived by cigarette smoking, however it is also characteristic of fatigue syndrome caused by social stress that typically comes with ASD - this is where the 2 roads converge as well - the fatigue gives me characteristic symptoms of schizophrenia/psychosis ie "waking dreams".

Then I think, there is possibly a VERY RARE subgroup of people with PDD's who also experience extreme moods and schizophrenia symptoms.

http://mcdd.webs.com/



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06 Dec 2011, 2:48 pm

I have high blood pressure and paranoia.

The high blood pressure is stress.
The paranoia is mostly stress.

I think you fixate on the possibility of schizophrenia over other, less serious psychological issues because it's the scariest possibility. I'd tell you to worry less, if I was capable of doing it myself.


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06 Dec 2011, 2:55 pm

swbluto wrote:
People are watching me through the window and there's a man standing in my closet watching me when I try to go to bed. Why won't they just LEAVE ME ALONE???

I'm not taking those thoughts seriously, but they keep crossing my mind to the point where I'm still unable to fall asleep as of 3:30 A.M. I used to get to bed at midnight every night, but not recently. There seems to be one or two thoughts that are constantly keeping me up.

Given the above thoughts, I think if I'm really developing schizophrenia, it'll likely be paranoid schizophrenia.

Also, in other news, my blood pressure isn't going down despite being on an "oats and salads" diet that supposedly reduces the blood pressure for at least 80% of the people who try it. That's interesting because that suggests MY DIET isn't the cause of my high blood pressure unlike it is for many people. What other factors are there? There's weight but I'm just *barely* in the overweight BMI category and I'm not fat at all - I'm only 30 pounds over my particular "perfect weight". And I really doubt that my weight would be the cause of my rather high blood pressure at this young of an age.

So, I researched, and apparently high blood pressure and cardiovascular disease is a common problem in schizophrenia. Great.


A three letter answer for you: O C D

Intrusive thoughts as in OCD (not thought insertion as with schizophrenia)
Anxiety as a result of those thoughts
Raised blood pressure and insomnia as a result of anxiety (cortisol and epinephrine running through your blood stream...increases blood pressure and can make it difficult to relax enough to sleep).
Obsessing over the possible cause of those thoughts
Compulsive research to ease anxiety (same as a ritual).
More intrusive thoughts.
Increased anxiety...

...Repeat cycle endlessly until you break out of it.

As hard as it is, try focusing on something else. Ignore the compulsion and thoughts..do not respond to them, do not react to them, let them sit in your head and do nothing with them and they will soon fade.

If you get a surge of anxiety from resisting a compulsion ride it out, that will fade soon too.

You remind me of me 5 years ago. No I have never yet gone on to develop schizophrenia but I have been where you are now!

This place used to have a good forum to discuss these problems: http://www.ocdforums.org/ Although it is a British site as, well, I am British lol. But going to such forums helped me when I was going through a rough time with the OCD stuff.



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06 Dec 2011, 4:10 pm

I think autistics have the same fantasies as schizophrenic. But the schizophrenic does not know that he is dreaming.



Lizerina
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06 Dec 2011, 4:48 pm

bumble wrote:
swbluto wrote:
People are watching me through the window and there's a man standing in my closet watching me when I try to go to bed. Why won't they just LEAVE ME ALONE???

I'm not taking those thoughts seriously, but they keep crossing my mind to the point where I'm still unable to fall asleep as of 3:30 A.M. I used to get to bed at midnight every night, but not recently. There seems to be one or two thoughts that are constantly keeping me up.

Given the above thoughts, I think if I'm really developing schizophrenia, it'll likely be paranoid schizophrenia.

Also, in other news, my blood pressure isn't going down despite being on an "oats and salads" diet that supposedly reduces the blood pressure for at least 80% of the people who try it. That's interesting because that suggests MY DIET isn't the cause of my high blood pressure unlike it is for many people. What other factors are there? There's weight but I'm just *barely* in the overweight BMI category and I'm not fat at all - I'm only 30 pounds over my particular "perfect weight". And I really doubt that my weight would be the cause of my rather high blood pressure at this young of an age.

So, I researched, and apparently high blood pressure and cardiovascular disease is a common problem in schizophrenia. Great.


A three letter answer for you: O C D

Intrusive thoughts as in OCD (not thought insertion as with schizophrenia)
Anxiety as a result of those thoughts
Raised blood pressure and insomnia as a result of anxiety (cortisol and epinephrine running through your blood stream...increases blood pressure and can make it difficult to relax enough to sleep).
Obsessing over the possible cause of those thoughts
Compulsive research to ease anxiety (same as a ritual).
More intrusive thoughts.
Increased anxiety...

...Repeat cycle endlessly until you break out of it.

As hard as it is, try focusing on something else. Ignore the compulsion and thoughts..do not respond to them, do not react to them, let them sit in your head and do nothing with them and they will soon fade.

If you get a surge of anxiety from resisting a compulsion ride it out, that will fade soon too.

You remind me of me 5 years ago. No I have never yet gone on to develop schizophrenia but I have been where you are now!

This place used to have a good forum to discuss these problems: http://www.ocdforums.org/ Although it is a British site as, well, I am British lol. But going to such forums helped me when I was going through a rough time with the OCD stuff.


Or it could be just about any other anxiety disorder...

Which, now that I think of it, sounds WAY more likely than schizophrenia. Anxiety can also cause some hallucinations.

Also, schizophrenia usually comes on fairly suddenly and intrusively in adults. It's mostly just childhood schizophrenia that comes on progressively and subtly.