Question to hardcore batman fans
I am a pretty big Batman fan (although I haven't read many actual Batman comics, which might disqualify me). And I like every single incarnation of Batman for different reasons. (But my favourite will always be The Animated Series).
Batman is an icon. He can survive being interpreted in many different ways. There are grim Batmen, camp Batmen, silly Batmen, sarcastic Batmen...
EDIT: Come to think of it, my least favourite interpretation of Batman has to be Christian Bale. His voice is ridiculous.
EDIT: Actually, Batman on the Justice League shows was also very cool. But I guess that's the same Batman from The Animated Series. Basically, if you don't immediately think about this opening sequence when you think about Batman, then I don't want to be your friend:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEx9r5enZsk
EDIT: I just realised that I am sort of contradicting myself. What I mean is, I don't mind if people want to do weird goofy takes on Batman, as long as everyone understands that the true "core" of Batman is the Batman who appears in The Animated Series, Justice League, and the Arkham games. (I'm pretty sure that this is roughly similar to the Batman of the comics, too, but that depends on the writer, of course).
EDIT: Actually, even that isn't quite true, is it? I mean, the Batman in the comics used to be extremely goofy, more like the Adam West Batman. I don't know what my opinions are anymore.
Last edited by Declension on 17 Feb 2012, 6:04 pm, edited 5 times in total.
No, I don't like Schumacher's movies. But then, I don't care much for Tim Burton's either. To me, Batman just doesn't work well with that self-aware campy humor. The old TV series has its moments, but I get tired of it quickly.
Christopher Nolan's Bat-movies? Just plain awesome. I can hardly wait for The Dark Knight Rises this summer.
Christopher Nolan's Bat-movies? Just plain awesome. I can hardly wait for The Dark Knight Rises this summer.
I agree with you 110% on every single point you just made in this post. Finally, a Batman fan who doesn't like Burton's movies.
I thought I was the only one. I love Nolan's films. I am also a huge fan of the Animated Series, Under the Red Hood, and the Arkham games.
The biggest problem with Burton's movies is this: They're Tim Burton movies, not Batman movies. It's impossible to watch them without thinking, "Ah yeah, that's a very Burton moment." I like a lot of Tim Burton's movies, but I think he was a bad choice for Batman.
(I suppose Burton's damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. He filmed Planet of the Apes straight, without all of his usual "quirky" touches, and people complained that it didn't seem like a Tim Burton movie.)
As for Schumacher, I'll put it this way: Only twice in my life have I paid to watch a movie in the theater and walked out in disgust before the movie was over. Batman and Robin was one of those times.
(I suppose Burton's damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. He filmed Planet of the Apes straight, without all of his usual "quirky" touches, and people complained that it didn't seem like a Tim Burton movie.)
As for Schumacher, I'll put it this way: Only twice in my life have I paid to watch a movie in the theater and walked out in disgust before the movie was over. Batman and Robin was one of those times.
I am a huge Tim Burton fanatic, so "Tim Burton moments" are like cinematic drugs to me. That's why I like his version of Batman even though I'm not really a fan of Batman in general. That's also why I think his version of Planet of the Apes was one of his worst movies - it lacked all of the special things that made me a devoted fan of his movies in the first place. (Except for Helena Bonham Carter. She was the best part of that movie IMHO).
Helena Bonham Carter is gold. I'll watch her in anything. Her performance in Sweeney Todd was especially good.
Batman is an icon. He can survive being interpreted in many different ways. There are grim Batmen, camp Batmen, silly Batmen, sarcastic Batmen...
EDIT: Come to think of it, my least favourite interpretation of Batman has to be Christian Bale. His voice is ridiculous.
EDIT: Actually, Batman on the Justice League shows was also very cool. But I guess that's the same Batman from The Animated Series. Basically, if you don't immediately think about this opening sequence when you think about Batman, then I don't want to be your friend:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEx9r5enZsk
EDIT: I just realised that I am sort of contradicting myself. What I mean is, I don't mind if people want to do weird goofy takes on Batman, as long as everyone understands that the true "core" of Batman is the Batman who appears in The Animated Series, Justice League, and the Arkham games. (I'm pretty sure that this is roughly similar to the Batman of the comics, too, but that depends on the writer, of course).
EDIT: Actually, even that isn't quite true, is it? I mean, the Batman in the comics used to be extremely goofy, more like the Adam West Batman. I don't know what my opinions are anymore.
Different strokes for different folks, Bale brings an intensity to the character that West, Keaton, Kilmer and Clooney sorely lacked. As for the criticism about his voice, it's getting predictably boring and cliched. I'd rather have Bale growling than a camp West/Clooney or a wooden Kilmer.
Guess i'm more of a fan of the darker side of Batman.
_________________
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe: Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion; I've watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time; like tears in rain. Time to die." Roy Batty
Batman is an icon. He can survive being interpreted in many different ways. There are grim Batmen, camp Batmen, silly Batmen, sarcastic Batmen...
EDIT: Come to think of it, my least favourite interpretation of Batman has to be Christian Bale. His voice is ridiculous.
EDIT: Actually, Batman on the Justice League shows was also very cool. But I guess that's the same Batman from The Animated Series. Basically, if you don't immediately think about this opening sequence when you think about Batman, then I don't want to be your friend:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEx9r5enZsk
EDIT: I just realised that I am sort of contradicting myself. What I mean is, I don't mind if people want to do weird goofy takes on Batman, as long as everyone understands that the true "core" of Batman is the Batman who appears in The Animated Series, Justice League, and the Arkham games. (I'm pretty sure that this is roughly similar to the Batman of the comics, too, but that depends on the writer, of course).
EDIT: Actually, even that isn't quite true, is it? I mean, the Batman in the comics used to be extremely goofy, more like the Adam West Batman. I don't know what my opinions are anymore.
Different strokes for different folks, Bale brings an intensity to the character that West, Keaton, Kilmer and Clooney sorely lacked. As for the criticism about his voice, it's getting predictably boring and cliched. I'd rather have Bale growling than a camp West/Clooney or a wooden Kilmer.
Guess i'm more of a fan of the darker side of Batman, namely the Nolan films, the Arkham games, the Animated Series and the classic comics like Knightfall, Long Halloween, Hush, Killing Joke and Red Rain.
_________________
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe: Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion; I've watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time; like tears in rain. Time to die." Roy Batty
(I suppose Burton's damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. He filmed Planet of the Apes straight, without all of his usual "quirky" touches, and people complained that it didn't seem like a Tim Burton movie.)
As for Schumacher, I'll put it this way: Only twice in my life have I paid to watch a movie in the theater and walked out in disgust before the movie was over. Batman and Robin was one of those times.
agreed. Burton's movies just don't seem like real Batman films to me. They're not horrible like Schumacher's, but they're not very good, either
[Guess i'm more of a fan of the darker side of Batman, namely the Nolan films, the Arkham games, the Animated Series and the classic comics like Knightfall, Long Halloween, Hush, Killing Joke and Red Rain.
agreed
[Guess i'm more of a fan of the darker side of Batman, namely the Nolan films, the Arkham games, the Animated Series and the classic comics like Knightfall, Long Halloween, Hush, Killing Joke and Red Rain.
agreed
+1
Oh and I despised the portrayal of Bane.
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Am usually bored so PMs are welcome!
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils ...
[Guess i'm more of a fan of the darker side of Batman, namely the Nolan films, the Arkham games, the Animated Series and the classic comics like Knightfall, Long Halloween, Hush, Killing Joke and Red Rain.
agreed
+1
Oh and I despised the portrayal of Bane.
Look no further than Tom Hardy, he'll give Bane his balls back. Watch Bronson or Inception for proof of how decent a choice he'll be for Bane.
_________________
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe: Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion; I've watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time; like tears in rain. Time to die." Roy Batty
I answered no, but I'll gladly admit to sitting down and watching Schumacher's Batman movies for their pure 'so-bad-it's-good' entertainment value. If I want a hearty laugh, Batman and Robin is where it's at...and the thing is, I think Schumacher intended that. Joel Schumacher is a very capable director, who has made good films, so it makes no sense for him to completely fail at the Batman thing, unless it was completely intentional camp.
Actually, the more I'm talking about it, the more I wish I'd answered 'yes' to the poll question. No, they are by no means good if you're looking for something remotely serious or accurate to the comics, but they are still hilarious.
As for Burton/Nolan...I like one film a piece. I love Burton's original Batman, on which I disagree that it has the look and feel of a 'Burton film.' I don't think it's immediately obvious or obvious at all that it's a Burton work. I think Keaton was a fantastic Batman, and a likeable, believable Bruce.
Batman Returns is complete ass. Total, over-the-top Burton crap. Gotham goes from looking like a gritty, dangerous city, to a colorful, art deco winter wonderland. AWFUL. The script is super corny, and not in the hilariously bad way that Schumacher's films are...just plain bad.
I hated Batman Begins...way too long, too dull, too implausible...Bale was crap as Batman and totally despicable as Bruce Wayne. Katie Holmes was obnoxious. The editing of the fight scenes or any action-filled scene was horrific. Yuck.
Now, The Dark Knight...THAT'S where it's at. A great movie...better cast, better plot. Bale was still 'meh', but everything else was totally on point. For the record, I've always been a huge Christian Bale fan (since 'Mio min Mio' when he was 12 years old), but I don't think he's a great Wayne/Batman.
I wrote an article comparing Batman and The Dark Knight within the confines of genre, and how both are excellent films considering their intent. You can read it here, if interested: Batman, The Dark Knight and the Importance of Genre
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