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Kraichgauer
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21 Aug 2012, 4:17 pm

Missouri Republican congressman and senatorial hopeful Tod Akin has recently claimed that if a rape is legitimate, the woman's body will cause the pregnancy to shut down. And yes, he said this in a public interview. His argument seemingly being that women who seek abortions after rape or incest are lying, and should carry the fetus to term.
Despite the hue and cry from conservative luminaries such as Rush Limbaugh and John Boehner for Akin to step down from his race, and allow a candidate who now stands a snow balls chance of winning to replace him, others such as Steve King, Republican senator of Iowa, and former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee are standing by their man. King has even stated that he's never heard of anyone becoming pregnant from statutory rape.
If anyone wants to blast these troglodytes, please feel free. If anyone can justify their lunacy, I'd really like to read your response.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Last edited by Kraichgauer on 21 Aug 2012, 4:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.

deltafunction
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21 Aug 2012, 4:17 pm

I was waiting for someone to post about this



visagrunt
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21 Aug 2012, 4:49 pm

Oh, it just keeps getting loopier.

First comes the remarkably maladroit, "I used the wrong words the wrong way," attempt to mitigate the impact of this epic piece of stupidity. Then Mike Huckabee very helpfully steps in on the radio and suggests that great people can be the product of these horrible situations.

If there was ever a story to breathe new life into the "War on Women," campaign this is it.

If Romney believes that he can win, he needs to get women and Latino voters moving to his banner, and he needs to solidify his grip on seniors. So far he's batting 0 for 3.


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21 Aug 2012, 5:00 pm

I found a link to what/who is probably where he got that stupid idea. It's the kind of almost-reasonable-sounding propaganda piece that people use to justify some insane position. And it's written by an M.D., no less. I think Akin forgot to remember that the bubble he exists in is not the one that most other people exist in -- the one called "reality".

http://www.christianliferesources.com/a ... e-rare-461

Quote:
Rape Pregnancies Are Rare
John C. Willke, M.D.
Life Issues Connector, April 1999, Reprinted with permission

CLR NOTE: The National Institutes of Health statistics on rape-related pregnancy can be found by clicking here.

First, let's define the term "rape." When pro-lifers speak of rape pregnancies, we should commonly use the phrase "forcible rape" or "assault rape," for that specifies what we're talking about. Rape can also be statutory. Depending upon your state law, statutory rape can be consensual, but we're not addressing that here.

A relatively new category is "date rape." For some reason this is supposed to be different, but, forcible rape is rape, regardless of whether it occurs on a date or behind the bushes. If a college woman is raped on a date, she should undergo a medical examination and treatment, just as she would in the aftermath of an assault rape. It is not a separate category.

Assault rape pregnancies are extremely rare. Most pro-lifers have heard this comment, but too often cannot back it up with facts. A candidate for office in the State of Arkansas made this comment before the last elections. He was roundly criticized and ridiculed by the opposing candidate and the media. Unfortunately, there was no evidence that he offered substantive proof to back up his claim that rape pregnancies were rare.

How many forcible rapes result in a pregnancy? The numbers claimed have ranged the entire spectrum of possibilities. Some feminists have claimed as high as 5 to 10 percent, which is absurd. One problem has been the lack of available studies and accurate statistics. Often women do not admit to having been raped. On the other hand, it has been known that women, pregnant from consensual intercourse, have later claimed rape. Is it possible to know the actual facts?

There have been some studies. In the statistical abstract of the US in 1989, there were 90,000 rapes reported in the United States. (Bureau of Census Table #283)

Another study was from the U.S. Justice Department, which surveyed 49,000 households annually between the years 1973-1987. In 1973, it reported 95,934 completed rapes. In 1987, the figure was 82,505. The study stated that only 53% were reported to police. Factoring this in, the totals were 181,000 rapes in 1973 and 155,000 in 1987. In August 1995, the US Justice Department, using a different study with different questions, returned a result of 170,000 completed rapes plus 140,000 attempted rapes.

There are approximately 100,000,000 females old enough to be at risk for rape in the United States. If we calculate on the basis of 100,000 rapes, that means that one woman in 1,000 is raped each year. If we calculate on the basis of 200,000 rapes, that means that one woman in 500 is raped each year.

Now for the important question. How many rape pregnancies are there? The answer is that, according to statistical reporting, there are no more than one or two pregnancies resultant from every 1,000 forcible rapes.

But, does it make sense? Let's look, using the figure of 200,000 rapes each year.

Of the 200,000 women who were forcibly raped, one-third were either too old or too young to get pregnant. That leaves 133,000 at risk for pregnancy.
A woman is capable of being fertilized only 3 days (perhaps 5) out of a 30-day month. Multiply our figure of 133,000 by three tenths. Three days out of 30 is one out of ten, divide 133 by ten and we have 13,300 women remaining. If we use five days out of 30 it is one out of six. Divide one hundred and thirty three thousand by six and we have 22,166 remaining.
One-fourth of all women in the United States of childbearing age have been sterilized, so the remaining three-fourths come out to 10,000 (or 15,000).
Only half of assailants penetrate her body and/or deposit sperm in her vagina,1 so let's cut the remaining figures in half. This gives us numbers of 5,000 (or 7,500).
Fifteen percent of men are sterile, that drops that figure to 4,250 (or 6,375).
Fifteen percent of non-surgically sterilized women are naturally sterile. That reduces the number to 3,600 (or 5,400).
Another fifteen percent are on the pill and/or already pregnant. That reduces the number to 3,070 (or 4,600).
Now factor in the fact that it takes 5-10 months for the average couple to achieve a pregnancy. Use the smaller figure of 5 months to be conservative and divide the avove figures by 5. The number drops to 600 (or 920).
In an average population, the miscarriage rate is about 15 percent. In this case we have incredible emotional trauma. Her body is upset. Even if she conceives, the miscarriage rate will be higher than in a more normal pregnancy. If 20 percent of raped women miscarry, the figure drops to 450 (or 740).

Finally, factor in what is certainly one of the most important reasons why a rape victim rarely gets pregnant, and that's physical trauma. Every woman is aware that stress and emotional factors can alter her menstrual cycle. To get and stay pregnant a woman's body must produce a very sophisticated mix of hormones. Hormone production is controlled by a part of the brain that is easily influenced by emotions. There's no greater emotional trauma that can be experienced by a woman than an assault rape. This can radically upset her possibility of ovulation, fertilization, implantation and even nurturing of a pregnancy. So what further percentage reduction in pregnancy will this cause? No one knows, but this factor certainly cuts this last figure by at least 50 percent and probably more. If we use the 50 percent figure, we have a final figure of 225 (or 370) women pregnant each year. These numbers closely match the 200 that have been documented in clinical studies.

So assault rape pregnancy is extremely rare. If we use the figure of 200, it is 4 per state per year. Even if we use a figure of 500, we're talking about only ten per state, per year. In the United States in one year, there are more than 6 million pregnancies. Roughly 3 million eventuate in live birth, 1.5 million are aborted and 500,000 miscarry. And so while each assault rape pregnancy is a tragedy for the mother (not for the baby, though), we can with confidence say that such pregnancies amount to a minuscule fraction of the total annual pregnancies in the United States. Further, less than half of assault rape pregnancies are aborted, even though that course of action tends to be vigorously pushed by those around the woman. 2,3

One final thought, Sandra Mahkorn, in two excellent studies, has asked such women what was their chief complaint? One might fully assume it was the fact that she was pregnant, but that is incorrect. Her chief complaint was how other people treated her. Such treatment ranged from negative, to simply getting little support from those around her. Even in a culture that offers little support and aggressively pushes abortion as a solution, fewer that half of such babies are killed by abortion. Think of how many fewer yet there would be if each pregnant victim of a rape were given the support, aid and tender loving care that she and her baby deserve.

Our goal is to offer truly compassionate care to the woman. That is what is best for both mother and child.

1 New England Journal of Medicine, A.N. Groth, Sexual DyFORBESSunction [sic] During Rape, Oct. 6, 1977, p.764-6

2 Mahkorn & Dolan, "Sexual Assault & Pregnancy." In New Perspectives on Human Abortion, University Publisher of Amer., 1981, pp.182-199

3 Mahkorn, "Pregnancy & Sexual Assault." In Psychological Aspects of Abortion, University Publishers of Amer., 1979, pp. 53-72

By J. C. Willke, MD,
reprinted with permission from 4/99 Life Issues Connector



Kraichgauer
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21 Aug 2012, 5:15 pm

I just ran this article by my wife. Her response was: "Who the hell... What...?"
She took the words right out of my mouth.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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21 Aug 2012, 6:35 pm

Idiocy.

He blithely asserts that one third of women are either too old or too young to become pregnant (fair enough) and then assumes that his incidence rate should be reduced by a similar number. But he has already limited his population to females old enough to be at risk for rape in the United States, so why is he reducing for age twice? And even if he is right to reduce this number, I am reasonably certain that rapes do not occur across all age cohorts with equal likelihood. A pre-pubescent girl and a post-menopausal woman can both be raped, to be sure. But how often does that actually occur in comparison to the frequency with which adult women are raped?

And then the little gem about women only being fertile 3 days during their cycle. The question here is not whether a woman is fertile at the time that the rape occurs, but rather whether any of her rapist's germ cells are still swimming in the lucky fallopian tube after ovulation. Human sperm have a lifespan measured in days, if they make it past the cervix.

25% of women have been sterilized?!? Where does that number come from? The best number I have seen suggests that 700,000 tubal ligations are performed annually, and roughly 600,000 hysterectomies. While we can assume that the former procedure is performed exclusively on pre-menopausal women, it bears noting that most are performed after bearing children, meaning that most women undergoing the procedure are in their later, rather than earlier childbearing years. Hysterectomies, on the other hand, may well be performed on women after menopause. If roughly 1 million fertile women are sterilized annually, the number of 25% is completely unfounded.

As for the claim that 15% of men and non-surgically sterilized women are sterile, that is also laughable. Infertility rates are probably near that level, but infertility is defined by the length of time that a couple has tried unsuccessfully to conceive--it does not necessarily indicate that one or the other partner is sterile. Since ferility impediments of either partner will impede conception, actual rates are probably closer to 5% for men and 10% for women. And again we have a case of double counting, since he has touched on infertility and then goes on to examine typical delays in conception.

And the miscarriage data is a complete red herring--you can't miscarry if you don't first become pregnant.

The truth is, pregnancy is rare. A typical woman spends 1.6% of an 80 year lifespan pregnant, and about 4.5% of her childbearing years. If we correct some of this dimwit's lousy math, we will probably find that women who have been raped are just as likely--or even more likely--to be pregnant as a woman in the same demographic cohort.

[/rant]


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21 Aug 2012, 6:39 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
Missouri Republican congressman and senatorial hopeful Tod Akin has recently claimed that if a rape is legitimate, the woman's body will cause the pregnancy to shut down. And yes, he said this in a public interview. His argument seemingly being that women who seek abortions after rape or incest are lying, and should carry the fetus to term.
Despite the hue and cry from conservative luminaries such as Rush Limbaugh and John Boehner for Akin to step down from his race, and allow a candidate who now stands a snow balls chance of winning to replace him, others such as Steve King, Republican senator of Iowa, and former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee are standing by their man. King has even stated that he's never heard of anyone becoming pregnant from statutory rape.
If anyone wants to blast these troglodytes, please feel free. If anyone can justify their lunacy, I'd really like to read your response.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

I saw this a few days ago. The entire republican party is doing a facepalm over this one.


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21 Aug 2012, 8:34 pm

That's true, the Republican party as well as Romney are trying to convince Akin to step down from his campaign because they know his idiotic comments are ruining their chances among women voters. At one point, the Republican party was close to being able to get the majority of the Senate, but not now.



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21 Aug 2012, 9:31 pm

I had to laugh when I heard him say this. How exactly would the body distinguish between rape and rough but consensual intercourse? I also find his lame attempt at backpedaling to be just as laughable. I personally would love to know the research on which he bases his beliefs on. You cannot make such a claim without research to back it up.



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21 Aug 2012, 9:55 pm

It's unfortunate he made such a personal gaffe, but as a U.S. representative who runs to run for the senate, he's in a position to influence political reform of all stripes. e definitely buried himself with that one.



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22 Aug 2012, 3:07 am

you have a lot of faith in missouri, don't you?



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22 Aug 2012, 3:09 am

visagrunt wrote:
If Romney believes that he can win, he needs to get women and Latino voters moving to his banner, and he needs to solidify his grip on seniors. So far he's batting 0 for 3.

willie the wonk knows that in 31 states, official voter suppression laws will see that he wins with a comfortable margin. otherwise he wouldn't have chosen ryan as his veep. he knows he doesn't have to pander to anybody but his base. god help us americans. :(



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22 Aug 2012, 3:23 am

redrobin62 wrote:
It's unfortunate he made such a personal gaffe, but as a U.S. representative who runs to run for the senate, he's in a position to influence political reform of all stripes. e definitely buried himself with that one.

Yeah, what's worse are people like Akin who are better at managing what they say, so that most of the population doesn't know that they hold some crazy/extreme ideas until they quietly introduce them into legislation.



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22 Aug 2012, 4:50 am

auntblabby wrote:
visagrunt wrote:
If Romney believes that he can win, he needs to get women and Latino voters moving to his banner, and he needs to solidify his grip on seniors. So far he's batting 0 for 3.

willie the wonk knows that in 31 states, official voter suppression laws will see that he wins with a comfortable margin. otherwise he wouldn't have chosen ryan as his veep. he knows he doesn't have to pander to anybody but his base. god help us americans. :(


I honestly hope not.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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22 Aug 2012, 7:16 am

This was the legal position on rape in the 13th Century. Sadly some people are still there, whereas the rest of us have moved into the 21st.

This article explains it:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/the-h ... NTCMP=SRCH



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22 Aug 2012, 10:29 am

I seriously hope this republiCLOWN does not make it in. Because then it WOULD affect me, being that I actually do live in Missouri. It's bad enough that my home state of MO is home of rush limbagh. DO NOT WANT.

Anyone who lives in Missouri who is reading this, take it upon yourself to vote when the time comes!! Someone like this does NOT deserve to get in.

Quote:
A woman is capable of being fertilized only 3 days (perhaps 5) out of a 30-day month.


^^this does not take into account that semen can stay in a woman's system for up to a week. Thus making the chances greater. That, and not all women's systems behave the same way. Some women ovulate more often than others.

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One-fourth of all women in the United States of childbearing age have been sterilized, so the remaining three-fourths come out to 10,000 (or 15,000).


I find this very hard to believe, as expensive as tubal litigation is (it is SIX TIMES the cost of a vasectomy, and yes, my bf and I checked because we're looking into sterilization when we're able to do it). I would like to know where they got these "facts"

Quote:
Only half of assailants penetrate her body and/or deposit sperm in her vagina,1 so let's cut the remaining figures in half. This gives us numbers of 5,000 (or 7,500).


^^and they would know this how? they were there when it happened?

I also find it interesting how incredibly dated those studies linked at the bottom were.

This makes me SO angry that I live in a country so $^&*(& BACKWARDS.