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Why is self confidence so bad?

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OliveOilMom
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04 Sep 2012, 2:24 am

again_with_this wrote:
OliveOilMom wrote:
again_with_this wrote:
Is it possible that some of the self-confident men you find yourself attracted to are also bullies and jerks, but you excuse this behavior or say it's just bundled with their self-confidence...therefore you need a reason to justify it, as in this post?


Oh, I have been attracted to some jerks and bullies, and I didn't excuse it at all. I knew exactly what they were. It's always just a matter of deciding whether the negative outweighs the positive. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. I also have no need to justify anything. Why would I need to justify liking self confident guys? Is self confidence so inherantly bad that someone should justify being attracted to someone with it?


mds_02 wrote:
again_with_this wrote:
Is it possible that some of the self-confident men you find yourself attracted to are also bullies and jerks, but you excuse this behavior or say it's just bundled with their self-confidence...therefore you need a reason to justify it, as in this post?


i think this is exacty the point of the post.

Why is it always assumed that confident people must also be evil?


I think you both missed what I was saying, probably because you're hung up on the whole "anyone who hates a confident person must be unconfident and jealous" trip.

No, what I was saying is that in addition to self-confidence is it ALSO possible some of these confident types can be jerks as well. Not because of their self-confidence, but in addition to it and separate from it. Their self-confidence is a good attribute, but their additional, separate jerky behavior is an unaffiliated bad attribute. And when someone criticizes them for their jerk behavior, you assume they're criticizing their self-confidence instead. So you let a lot of BS slide because you can's separate the two.

Even right now, because you seem to misunderstand, you've probably written me off as "unconfident guy who's jealous," when that's not what I was saying or the point I was making.


No, I have said that while some confident people may be jerks, they aren't all jerks and probably more are nice people than are jerks. What I get back is people telling me how confident people hurt their feelings, etc. And how confidence is a jerky trait.

So no, I can seperate the two easily. My entire thread is about wondering why some others here can't.

Do they also hate blondes, or redheads or brunettes because somebody with that hair color hurt their feelings in the past? Makes about as much sense.


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Surfman
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04 Sep 2012, 2:43 am

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KeitaroKun
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06 Sep 2012, 1:22 am

Because "confidence" is an annoyin, overused soundbite that everybody says to have, but nobody ever explains how to have it.



RICKY5
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10 Sep 2012, 3:57 pm

ToadOfSteel wrote:
Why do you advocate lying to yourself until you start believing it? Isn't that the path to becoming a pathological liar to others?


Why should a guy not do what works?



TM
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10 Sep 2012, 4:07 pm

KeitaroKun wrote:
Because "confidence" is an annoyin, overused soundbite that everybody says to have, but nobody ever explains how to have it.


Oh confidence stems from success. If you are confident doing something, that confidence can and quite frequently does carry over into other areas of your life.



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10 Sep 2012, 4:13 pm

Self confidence is not bad. A few of the most beautiful people I've met are some of the confident people I've known. Thing is, there's tons more confident douches out there than non-douches, at least that's what I have experienced. So I can understand why a lot of people on here have a bad opinion of confident people.


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Last edited by Pondering on 10 Sep 2012, 4:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TM
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10 Sep 2012, 4:14 pm

Pondering wrote:
Self confidence is not bad. A few of the most beautiful people I've met are some of the confident people I've known. Thing is, there's tons more confident douches out there than non-douches, at least that's what I have experienced.


There are two kinds of confident people:

Jerks who tend to act confident more than actually being confident and then truly confident people. Those who are truly confident rarely put down others.



Pondering
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10 Sep 2012, 4:15 pm

I think that's true. A lot of these so called confident people are surely putting on a show.

TM wrote:
Pondering wrote:
Self confidence is not bad. A few of the most beautiful people I've met are some of the confident people I've known. Thing is, there's tons more confident douches out there than non-douches, at least that's what I have experienced.


There are two kinds of confident people:

Jerks who tend to act confident more than actually being confident and then truly confident people. Those who are truly confident rarely put down others.


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TM
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10 Sep 2012, 4:25 pm

Pondering wrote:
TM wrote:
Pondering wrote:
Self confidence is not bad. A few of the most beautiful people I've met are some of the confident people I've known. Thing is, there's tons more confident douches out there than non-douches, at least that's what I have experienced.


There are two kinds of confident people:

Jerks who tend to act confident more than actually being confident and then truly confident people. Those who are truly confident rarely put down others.

]I think that's true. A lot of these so called confident people are surely putting on a show.


Of course, a lot of people tend to perceive forcefulness, though-mindedness and a host of other things as "rude", "jerkish" and various other forms of behavior also, which is inaccurate.

Some people have thick skins other have skins so thin that Stevie Wonder could see through them with his eyes closed.



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10 Sep 2012, 4:34 pm

80-90% of coming off as tough-fighter type person is in the act of it or "putting on a show" of it with words. A lot of "confident" guys who do that can't back it up very well when getting in an actual physical fight with somebody. Because they count on it to keep them out of a fight in the first place.



TM
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10 Sep 2012, 4:41 pm

Venger wrote:
80-90% of coming off as tough-fighter type person is in the act of it or "putting on a show" of it with words. A lot of "confident" guys who do that can't back it up very well when getting in an actual physical fight with somebody. Because they count on it to keep them out of a fight in the first place.


As long as you can tell them from the remaining 10 - 20% that will snap you in half, or are capable of handling that 10 - 20% you should be fine. Also, just as a general rule, anyone who tells you that they'll kick your ass, won't.



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10 Sep 2012, 4:48 pm

TM wrote:
Venger wrote:
80-90% of coming off as tough-fighter type person is in the act of it or "putting on a show" of it with words. A lot of "confident" guys who do that can't back it up very well when getting in an actual physical fight with somebody. Because they count on it to keep them out of a fight in the first place.


As long as you can tell them from the remaining 10 - 20% that will snap you in half, or are capable of handling that 10 - 20% you should be fine. Also, just as a general rule, anyone who tells you that they'll kick your ass, won't.


I remember a lot of people like that who were big-talkers, but you'd never see or hear of them getting in actual fight with somebody to prove it. I also suspect a lot of them were sociopaths(ASPD) that liked to "pose" and put on a fake show constantly.



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10 Sep 2012, 4:52 pm

Animals puff themselves up for defence.

Self confidence, true or false, good or bad, reduces your chances of being picked on, establishes territory, attracts mates, gets jobs, brings fame etc etc

Geese ward of dogs with shows of confidence, until they choose the wrong dog.... dead meat



Last edited by Surfman on 11 Sep 2012, 6:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

TM
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10 Sep 2012, 5:00 pm

Venger wrote:

I remember a lot of people like that who were big-talkers, but you'd never see or hear of them getting in actual fight with somebody to prove it. I also suspect a lot of them were sociopaths(ASPD) that liked to "pose" and put on a fake show constantly.


Sociopaths do not put on shows, they will f**k you up especially if they are so called "reputation defending" sociopaths. Of course, if you go by the number of people that members on this forum identify as sociopaths (including myself at one point), you'd think ASPD was as common as a cold.



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10 Sep 2012, 5:08 pm

TM wrote:
Venger wrote:

I remember a lot of people like that who were big-talkers, but you'd never see or hear of them getting in actual fight with somebody to prove it. I also suspect a lot of them were sociopaths(ASPD) that liked to "pose" and put on a fake show constantly.


Sociopaths do not put on shows, they will f**k you up especially if they are so called "reputation defending" sociopaths. Of course, if you go by the number of people that members on this forum identify as sociopaths (including myself at one point), you'd think ASPD was as common as a cold.


I suppose that's true for the most part since prison inmates for example are usually sociopaths. A lot of them perceive themselves to be much tougher than they actually are though. I don't mean the prison inmate ones necessarily though.



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10 Sep 2012, 5:29 pm

Venger wrote:
TM wrote:
Venger wrote:

I remember a lot of people like that who were big-talkers, but you'd never see or hear of them getting in actual fight with somebody to prove it. I also suspect a lot of them were sociopaths(ASPD) that liked to "pose" and put on a fake show constantly.


Sociopaths do not put on shows, they will f**k you up especially if they are so called "reputation defending" sociopaths. Of course, if you go by the number of people that members on this forum identify as sociopaths (including myself at one point), you'd think ASPD was as common as a cold.


I suppose that's true for the most part since prison inmates for example are usually sociopaths. A lot of them perceive themselves to be much tougher than they actually are though. I don't mean the prison inmate ones necessarily though.


You should keep in mind that Robert Hare's research on sociopaths has some limitations. It's what happens when your only source of research subjects for your chosen personality disorder tend to be the prison population. If you read Hare's book "Snakes in suits" you get a somewhat different picture that helps nuance the overall perception.

It's also worth to note that according to Martha Stroud's "The Sociopath Next Door" only about 20% of prison inmates are sociopaths.