What's the chance that Adam Lanza was autistic?

Post Reply New Topic

Well, that's if you believe in the concept of 'evil'. I don't. When he was a little baby, and his mother was holding him in her arms, there's no way you could say, yeah, that baby was "born" an evil murderer.

He was mentally ill, yes. But evil? No, I don't believe that. I don't believe in evil.

There were reports that his brother Ryan said that Adam was diagnosed with AS and another mental disorder. But so far, we haven't heard squat of what exactly and specifically that other mental disorder was. You would think the family would've spilled the beans on that, too.

His former school's former safety coordinator confirmed he had AS by documents his mother showed him. That seems to be solid if said individual recounts it correctly (the coordinator is there to help troubled students). Throw in those his mother seemingly told (friends), and if they recount it correctly too, then that'd be supporting of that.

All of his social behavior reported from those who knew/knew of him sounds like AS.

So, a high chance.

Not that it matters much, as even if there's a remote chance it played a part (epic meltdown for some reason), it's still only a part.

Citation needed here. I haven't seen anything more substantial than hearsay - that is, stories in which people are cited as saying they heard he had a developmental disability, or that his mother had told them that he had AS, both of which are hearsay and not really valid evidence that he had any such diagnosis.



It also sounds like prodromal schizophrenia, schizotypal personality disorder, or schizoid personality disorder.



Not meltdown behavior.

Does it even matter if he was autistic or not?

Guys, don't forget the personal background. We don't know what environment Lanza was raised in. We don't know how he was treated by his peers. We don't know his beliefs and attitudes.

It is a large puzzle, and autism is just one piece in it. There are hundreds of other pieces and we'll never know which ones caused him to go on a killing spree.

It matters to me in the sense that spreading rumors as fact is a fairly dubious practice.

The former director of security for Newtown Public Schools, Richard Novia, confirmed the diagnosis on CNN, per the link below, and on Headline News by Nancy Grace.

http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/national/a ... -withdrawn

http://www.hlntv.com/video/2012/12/17/f ... -aspergers

Independent confirmation from actual medical records, will not come until if and when his toxicology and medical record is released to the public as a result of the investigation.

It doesn't seem like there is much question that he was diagnosed with the disorder at some point in time, however I guess the potential that he was misdiagnosed and re-diagnosed with another disorder after Novia saw the documentation, could be a possibility.

Considering that Novia's report could easily be refuted by any medical records, that contradicted his report, I find it hard to believe that he was telling a lie. He indicates in his relationship with Lanza that there was no indication that he was violent or had the potential to commit violent crime; the concern expressed by Novia was for Lanza's safety not the safety of others.

That is still hearsay, unfortunately. It does sound plausible.

If you look at the Columbine shooting, several people gave false information to reporters, and there's no truly logical or rational reason why some of them did so. At this point, I'm still going to hold out on believing this until I see someone who actually diagnosed Lanza say so. This seems unlikely.

Actually, Novia provided information he was not an aggressive or violent individual in school so he takes away any potential link of aggression or violent behavior away from any disorder he was diagnosed with at that time. This presents evidence that other factors came into play other than his diagnoses that resulted in the act.

That's a good thing, for anyone that is concerned with the violence and asperger's connection.

That information is not nearly as disconcerting as the information that is provided by WebMD, that does not link a general association of violence with autism or asperger's syndrome. But one can judge for themselves what the head of criminal forensics in Sweden is suggesting in her "expert" analysis of the issue, which is much worse in my opinion than the disclaimer that WebMD makes that there is no link between violence, autism or asperger's syndrome.



This is the number one hit on google for Asperger's and violence; in my opinion it is a reckless expert opinion. WebMD is the most popular source of health information on the internet with 86 million hits a month. This is the only reputable source that is providing this kind of correlation that I am aware of. The expert in the article suggests that a fixation on weapons for people with Asperger's can lead to violence. That is the first time I have heard of any "expert" anywhere making that association, otherwise there seems like there would be cautionary notes in the clinical environment of allowing access to guns for individuals diagnosed with the condition.

I'm surprised, but I haven't seen anyone in the mainstream TV media calling her out and correcting her on her analysis, except for Peter Bell from Autism Speaks, who was not involved directly in the conversation with the expert, in the article, who provided an assertion that autism had nothing to do with the crime, but was described as an autism advocate, not an expert in the article.



http://www.webmd.com/brain/autism/news/ ... s-violence

Last edited by aghogday on 04 Jan 2013, 4:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

Sociopaths are often like that too cause it's anti-social personality disorder after all, and people with ASPD are known for often being intelligent. But sociopaths are sometimes popular at school too though since we all know how the jerks are often well-liked in high school and middle school.

Last edited by Venger on 04 Jan 2013, 3:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I don't know if you noticed in the second link but Novia was actually interviewed on national TV, on Headline News. The video is provided there. Novia presents himself in a very professional manner in the video, and presents Lanza as a human being, not a monster of some kind, in his school life.

I think the only reasonable potential of error would be that the documentation that Novia had access to was incorrect. There is nothing in Lanza's behavior that suggests he did not have Asperger's syndrome in his high school years There is plenty to suggest though that something went very wrong later on his life, that may have little to nothing to do specifically with any of his potential diagnoses at the time Novia states he was informed of his diagnoses.

If anyone would have noticed that, per a professional in a school environment, it would likely be a public director of safety in the school environment. I suspect that part of Novia's motivation to provide the report was to protect his professional reputation, to reinforce information that there was no signs of predictive violence that were missed on his safety watch, in his relationship with Lanza.

What the "expert' in Web MD fails to mention is the substance abuse connection and psychosis in actual research specific to Schizophrenia and Asperger's syndrome and any other person in the general population that commits a crime. The toxicology report may be more important in understanding this case than the medical history, per any potential diagnosis of a disorder, unless he was prescribed a legal prescription for an issue like psychosis and was not taking the medication.

Last edited by aghogday on 04 Jan 2013, 5:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

I don't think anyone is saying that he was born evil. What I think is that, along the way, he made some choices that--gradually, perhaps--drew him towards the sort of mind-set that sees human life as unimportant, and killing innocents as a possible course of action. That sort of mind-set is what I define as "evil", and people don't become that way overnight.

I don't see it is possible to "not believe in evil". Evil is a concept that either applies or doesn't apply. I suppose you could say that you believe there is no such thing as an evil person, but I don't see that that's a rational statement considering that there are people who, while not impaired in any way, willingly choose to hurt others for their own benefit. Maybe if you edited your statement to, "Nobody is irredeemably evil," then I'd be willing to agree--with the caveat that it's entirely possible for people who can be redeemed, to choose not to be.

Whether he had autism is irrelevant--autism would not have made a difference either way. It doesn't impair moral reasoning; that's been shown in several studies. It doesn't increase the risk of violence.

People like to blame violence on mental illness; they like to pretend that rational people don't hurt each other. They don't like to think about the fact that human beings still have the emotions of the chimpanzees who will literally tear an intruder to pieces--with the big brains and ability to think which lets us plan much more devastation than a chimpanzee ever could. The average human being is perfectly capable of doing evil things. It's just that most of us decide not to. We're also capable of using those same big brains to consider the consequences of our actions, define and follow a moral system, or think about and compare multiple perspectives. Every one of us chooses between good and evil, repeatedly.

Yep, though I didn't point them out due to others saying he had AS (since they're all close enough in many ways other than age of onset); though his social deficits appeared to be worst than the Personality Disorders, and more in line with AS or Schizophrenia.

Probably not, no, but I can see a meltdown triggering underlying things -- it does remove some inhibitions.

Just another person demonizing those who like certain objects (combined with a certain disorder); an obsession with weapons is as unhealthy as an obsession with ants, which is to say not at all.

Unless it's an obsession with "bullet ants". Their extremely painful sting feels like being shot with a gun(hence the name).

An obsession with ants itself doesn't imply that one will get stung by an ant; having an obsession may mean one is less likely to be stung as they're aware of the dangers involved.