Buddhism anyone?

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I recently began reading the Tibetan Book of the Dead on the recommendation of a good friend. I find that Buddhism, properly explained, is quite sensical, more so than other religions I've read of and the one I was raised practicing. Anyone else?

Theravada buddhist here. One thing you need to know when explorting buddhism is (oh I wish somebody had told me this when I started) don't listen to propaganda such as this school is faster than the other, or this school is for individuals of more capacities. In finding a religion you should, of course, be confortable, but you should not choose just what you like. You should choose what seems to be true, even if unpleasant.

If you have any questions, go ahead!

(going to be self-centered for a bit here) I recognize that since it makes sense to me, it's likely only a matter of time before I begin believing in the continuation of consciousness stuff, specifically until I have the time to think about it and be logical and reflective for a bit, that's how I became an atheist, incidentally not from seeing horrible things happen in the world, just from looking to my own thoughts. (stopping being self centered for a bit) what does your school of thought have as an eventual goal? Buddhahood or what else? I know almost nothing here.

Regarding the tibetan book of the dead: it's not a good place to start, because it's realy directed to those who are already deep practicioners of tibetan buddhism. It's a culture specific book, imo.

If you want to read things that are thought provoking in terms of starting to directing you in believing in life after death and rebirth, read the first book in this list (read also the micro biography of the author at the top of the page): http://www.amazon.com/Ian-Stevenson/e/B001IXRWB8

Regarding theravada buddhism, the goal is to be free from suffering, and thus enjoy pure happiness, peace and freedom. Those who reach this stage are called arahats. They have the same type of liberation as the Buddha, although they might possess different mental strenghts.

I agree with that. I read it too, some thirty plus years ago. Vaguely remember it talking about rebirth and that you should follow one particular light rather than other light or you end up reborn again, but forgotten most of it now. I don't think it is really all that relevant except from a cultural point of view.

The very first book I read on Buddhism was around 35 years ago called "The teachings of the compassionate Buddha". Can't remember the author/publisher. There are various contemporary authors worth reading. D. T. Suzuki, Alan Watts. There are also lots of free talks associated with Buddhism and meditation that were recorded at various retreats you can download and listen to: http://www.audiodharma.org/series/1/talk/1839/
There are various branches of Buddhism as there are with other religions. I suggest you investigate each and see which (if any) ring true to you. Personally I'm somewhat of a mongrel with leanings towards both Zen and Hindu Vedanta which I view as equivalent but merely wrapped up in somewhat different religious jargon and traditions. I'm also drawn to some contemporary teachers such as Ramana Maharshi and Jiddu Krishnamurti.

Edit: There are also various Buddhist forums where you can ask questions. I was a member of this one for a while http://www.zenforuminternational.org/ but is doesn't seem all that active nowadays. There is also a Buddhism section on the Beliefnet forum but I never really got on with that one due to all the adverts, though with Adblock nowadays that probably isn't a problem.

Last edited by TallyMan on 14 Jan 2013, 5:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

Speaking of Buddism and I know this may be random but what happened to your Buddist avatars and avatars of senseis?

Thanks for your input. I'm going to be ...me and read the Tibetan Book of the Dead anyways, largely because I already went through the trouble of concealing it from my parents and school officials, because I do not need or want my parents knowing everything about my beliefs or lack thereof. I will look for the books that you recommended though, thank you for that. And thank you for being helpful!

Do you mean this avatar which I had for a very long time?



This was the actor Kim Chan, he played bit parts in various movies including blade runner (the guy in the cold room who made eyes) and the Fifth Element (the guy on the flying "junk" selling Chinese food.)

I always liked that photo, he looked very serene.

A yes I was just wondering for a few moments because your avatar was gone its back now now im happy hehe!

Although I am not a very religious person per say I do have a lot of respect for Buddhism and have come across quite a few Buddhist monks and nuns in my area they are kind gentle and peaceful people. For those who do not know a Buddhist nun is a female Buddhist monk they shave their head bald also.

I've read up on Zen buddhism. I may not fully understand it, but it seems unrealistic. And a lot of buddhists believe in multiple lifetimes, which to me seems rooted in ancient mysticism.

The belief in rebirth is common in Asian cultures. Effectively Buddhism is an offshoot from Hinduism in which the belief in rebirth is part of their tradition.

Personally I do not believe in the concept of reincarnation as commonly conceived as being a "soul" passing from one life to the next. My own opinion is that there is no soul. When the brain dies so does everything associated with that person - their memories, their personality, everything. In fact you see this same principle in people who develop Alzheimers - their brain slowly degrades and bits die progressively and this is reflected in the persons loss of memories and changes to their personality. Just one of a zillion examples that lends evidence that there is no soul.

However, I do have an insight into what may loosely be termed reincarnation, but it is a concept very difficult to explain to others unfamiliar with deep meditative states and Zen, so I'm not going to attempt to try unless pressed; but even then there is no guarantee that anyone will grasp what I try to communicate. The insight isn't mine alone, it is shared by a number of Buddhists or those grounded in Vedanta or Eastern "concepts" of non-duality.

Maybe not, but you could try anyway. Does it involve the consciousness surviving the body at all?

To really grasp the Tibetan book of the dead one should go to a teaching on it,it is mostly symbolic,Jung was interested in it.If you just try and read it on it's own it's confusing.But there is more than one Bardo.
I am a lazy Buddhist but I have taken refuge.
Nyingma tradition here,Tibetan.
I don't discuss my beliefs much as they are very personal.

I'm the same; plus they are very difficult to express in a way that others can understand because they are based upon personal experience.



Not exactly. You need to be aware that this "realisation" or "insight" came to me after many years of meditation so isn't necessarily something I can communicate.

To me science is the absolute authority. If I hold any beliefs and science comes along and points out an error in my beliefs then I need to change my beliefs to match the reality as demonstrated by science.

I view science as the means of objectively investigating the nature of reality. However, it has limitations. For example science can tell me the weight of an apple. It can tell me what its chemical composition is and about its DNA, its colour and a wealth of other facts. What science cannot communicate to me is what does an apple taste like. Taste is an emergent property that is related to the chemical composition of the apple, the taste buds on my tongue and my nervous system and brain's activity in response to the piece of apple on my tongue.

Consciousness is an emergent property; based upon the brains activity. The object of the meditation that I do is to investigate this consciousness and to investigate whatever functionality of the mind can be elucidated.

As the mind becomes quiet in meditation, much of the surface noise clears away and you can see deeper levels at work regarding thought processing, emotions and most importantly the sense of self, me, I.

I'll just jump straight to the key observations I've made. These are not logical deductions nor philosophy they are observations directly made:

1. Consciousness is always consciousness of something. There is never any consciousness without it having an object. They are like two sides of the same coin.

2. The sense of self is an artificial construct of the brain. It too is an object of consciousness. People generally think in terms of someone looking and the thing looked at. However, the mind plays a certain amount of smoke and mirrors, because the sense of self isn't actually the viewer, the sense of self (the "I", "me" thoughts) are actually an object of perception too.

The above realisation made other philosophical and Zen teachings drop into place. I have always associated myself with consciousness rather than my body but now there is the realisation that I'm also not the "self" associated with this mind, personality and memories either! My true nature is consciousness itself and whatever it illuminates. The consciousness associated with TallyMan isn't "my" consciousness so much as consciousness has "me". With this realisation the strong distinction between "me" and other living beings has dropped. I used to wonder why I was born as me, why in this time period and in this particular body living this particular life. Then it dawned on me that this actually isn't the case. Many people have the same thought, they experience the same sense of "I" and "me". I'm referring there to the brain's mental constructs of sense of self. This shift in awareness isn't something I can prove to anyone or demonstrate, it is something I directly perceive.

This shifted sense of awareness is expressed well by Thich Nhat Hanh in the poem "Please Call Me by My True Names"

Don't say that I will depart tomorrow --
even today I am still arriving.

Look deeply: every second I am arriving
to be a bud on a Spring branch,
to be a tiny bird, with still-fragile wings,
learning to sing in my new nest,
to be a caterpillar in the heart of a flower,
to be a jewel hiding itself in a stone.

I still arrive, in order to laugh and to cry,
to fear and to hope.

The rhythm of my heart is the birth and death
of all that is alive.

I am the mayfly metamorphosing
on the surface of the river.
And I am the bird
that swoops down to swallow the mayfly.

I am the frog swimming happily
in the clear water of a pond.
And I am the grass-snake
that silently feeds itself on the frog.

I am the child in Uganda, all skin and bones,
my legs as thin as bamboo sticks.
And I am the arms merchant,
selling deadly weapons to Uganda.

I am the twelve-year-old girl,
refugee on a small boat,
who throws herself into the ocean
after being raped by a sea pirate.
And I am the pirate,
my heart not yet capable
of seeing and loving.

I am a member of the politburo,
with plenty of power in my hands.
And I am the man who has to pay
his "debt of blood" to my people
dying slowly in a forced-labor camp.

My joy is like Spring, so warm
it makes flowers bloom all over the Earth.
My pain is like a river of tears,
so vast it fills the four oceans.

Please call me by my true names,
so I can hear all my cries and my laughter at once,
so I can see that my joy and pain are one.

Please call me by my true names,
so I can wake up,
and so the door of my heart
can be left open,
the door of compassion.

---

So there isn't rebirth as such because "I" already am every being that ever lived or ever will live. The emergent property of the brain: "consciousness" is "my" real nature. This consciousness illuminates the brain of TallyMan, the brain of my pet dog, the brains or my chickens, it illuminates your brain and the brains of everyone on this planet.

Thought about teaching any TallyMan?Good lesson there.That is also one of my favorite poems.