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Jono
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04 Feb 2013, 8:24 am

Jitro wrote:
We're in the Kingdom Animalia, but are we animals? Or does the Animalia Kingdom include humans and animals?


By definition, anything that belongs to the Kingdom Animalia is an animal. So yes, humans are animals. More specifically, humans are one of the Great Apes.



gailryder17
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04 Feb 2013, 8:21 pm

AspieOtaku wrote:
^^^ Thank you and for that I bring you this! [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHxy_wTJfgU[/youtube]Bible thumpers and other fanatics will want this video taken down from YouTube and force the belief that people were made out of nowhere and from dust!


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUh_C-pwWQo[/youtube]

I watched the episode following that. Apparently there is evidence of a fusion of two pairs of chromosomes along our evolutionary line to produce the 46-chromosomed human(which, as explained by the video, is evidenced in our 2nd pair of chromosomes).

I'm wondering what genes that pair contains...


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Jitro
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04 Feb 2013, 9:35 pm

Jono wrote:
Jitro wrote:
We're in the Kingdom Animalia, but are we animals? Or does the Animalia Kingdom include humans and animals?


By definition, anything that belongs to the Kingdom Animalia is an animal. So yes, humans are animals. More specifically, humans are one of the Great Apes.


In common usage, as opposed to scientific usage, the word "animal" refers to nonhuman members of the Kingdom Animalia, humans are excluded.



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04 Feb 2013, 10:03 pm

Jitro wrote:
Jono wrote:
Jitro wrote:
We're in the Kingdom Animalia, but are we animals? Or does the Animalia Kingdom include humans and animals?


By definition, anything that belongs to the Kingdom Animalia is an animal. So yes, humans are animals. More specifically, humans are one of the Great Apes.


In common usage, as opposed to scientific usage, the word "animal" refers to nonhuman members of the Kingdom Animalia, humans are excluded.
The word animal means to animate or moving living beings. We are moving living beings share all the same organs other mammals do, our females have mammary glands which all other mammals do so we are animals. We are mammals warm blooded have fur and posable thumbs like other apes yes we are apes if you cannot accept it thats too bad genetic data and fossil records do not lie.


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04 Feb 2013, 10:25 pm

MCalavera wrote:
Yes, we're animals. The smartest creatures to roam this planet, but nevertheless animals.


I don't know if humans really are the smartest creatures on this planet, they are pretty stupid sometimes.


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MCalavera
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04 Feb 2013, 10:48 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
MCalavera wrote:
Yes, we're animals. The smartest creatures to roam this planet, but nevertheless animals.


I don't know if humans really are the smartest creatures on this planet, they are pretty stupid sometimes.


On average at least.



Tensu
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04 Feb 2013, 10:53 pm

MCalavera wrote:
Tensu wrote:
AspieOtaku wrote:
Yes we are dont let the bible tell you otherwise!!


The Bible never claims we aren't. :roll:

"Animal" is a biological taxa, and the Bible is not a taxonomy book.


I agree the Bible was not meant to be a book of science, but the context of Genesis suggests that the humans are way too different to be classified in the same taxonomical group (whatever it may be) as animals.


No, Genesis suggests no such thing because Genesis never makes any suggestions on how we should classify life.

To Jitro: Yes, people do sometimes use the word "animal" to refer to all animals except humans.

So I guess you could say wether or not we are animals depends on context, but as far as biology is concerned we are classified as animals.



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04 Feb 2013, 11:11 pm

Tensu wrote:
No, Genesis suggests no such thing because Genesis never makes any suggestions on how we should classify life.


Humans, beasts, fish, birds, cattle, and creeping things are what exactly?

Quote:
Genesis 2:

19 And out of the ground Jehovah Elohim had formed every animal of the field and all fowl of the heavens, and brought [them] to Man, to see what he would call them; and whatever Man called each living soul, that was its name.

20 And Man gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the heavens, and to every beast of the field; but as for Adam, he found no helpmate, his like.



Tensu
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04 Feb 2013, 11:26 pm

MCalavera wrote:
Humans, beasts, fish, birds, cattle, and creeping things are what exactly?


The taxonomic system in use at the time the Bible was written.

around 1700s I believe we decided to switch to a system that classified by anatomical similarities rather than behavioral ones.

Then we updated that system when we figured out that plants and fungi are actually very different and single-celled organisms cannot be classified as pants and animals.

Then we tried to update that system which was only designed for modern life to accommodate evolutionary biology, and made a big mess.

We need a new taxonomic system. One that is modular enough to adapt to the constant debates about who evolved from what.

When we get one, will you argue that all information in any book that makes any mention of the old taxonomy is false, even if the information has nothing to do with taxonomy itself?



MCalavera
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04 Feb 2013, 11:55 pm

Tensu wrote:
MCalavera wrote:
Humans, beasts, fish, birds, cattle, and creeping things are what exactly?


The taxonomic system in use at the time the Bible was written.

around 1700s I believe we decided to switch to a system that classified by anatomical similarities rather than behavioral ones.

Then we updated that system when we figured out that plants and fungi are actually very different and single-celled organisms cannot be classified as pants and animals.

Then we tried to update that system which was only designed for modern life to accommodate evolutionary biology, and made a big mess.

We need a new taxonomic system. One that is modular enough to adapt to the constant debates about who evolved from what.

When we get one, will you argue that all information in any book that makes any mention of the old taxonomy is false, even if the information has nothing to do with taxonomy itself?


So, biblically speaking, are humans animals or not? Genesis suggests they're separate from each other. Whether that's right or wrong is irrelevant. The point is how the Bible considers them.



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04 Feb 2013, 11:58 pm

MCalavera wrote:
Tensu wrote:
MCalavera wrote:
Humans, beasts, fish, birds, cattle, and creeping things are what exactly?


The taxonomic system in use at the time the Bible was written.

around 1700s I believe we decided to switch to a system that classified by anatomical similarities rather than behavioral ones.

Then we updated that system when we figured out that plants and fungi are actually very different and single-celled organisms cannot be classified as pants and animals.

Then we tried to update that system which was only designed for modern life to accommodate evolutionary biology, and made a big mess.

We need a new taxonomic system. One that is modular enough to adapt to the constant debates about who evolved from what.

When we get one, will you argue that all information in any book that makes any mention of the old taxonomy is false, even if the information has nothing to do with taxonomy itself?


So, biblically speaking, are humans animals or not? Genesis suggests they're separate from each other. Whether that's right or wrong is irrelevant. The point is how the Bible considers them.


Genesis says we exercise more power over the planet than other species do.

Do you disagree? Do rabbits and squirrels have as much ability to shape the world as we do?



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05 Feb 2013, 12:48 am

Well, if "animals" means "Animalia", then of course humans are animals. But you already knew that.

In everyday speech, the word "animal" is often used to mean "Animalia except humans". There's nothing wrong with that, it's just one of a million examples of a technical term being different from colloquial usage.



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05 Feb 2013, 12:54 am

MCalavera wrote:
So, biblically speaking, are humans animals or not?


That question can't be answered, because the writers of the Bible never heard of the word "animal".

They apparently had a classification system that distinguished humans from non-human Animalia. But that's not the same thing as claiming that humans are not "animals".



MCalavera
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05 Feb 2013, 4:58 am

The animals in the Bible were the beasts, the cattle, the creeping things, the fish and the fowl.

Biblically speaking, humans were creatures made in the image of God unlike the animals.

So yes, you're right that it's not the same classification system as today, but that's not the point.



Tensu
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05 Feb 2013, 11:31 pm

MCalavera wrote:
The animals in the Bible were the beasts, the cattle, the creeping things, the fish and the fowl.

Biblically speaking, humans were creatures made in the image of God unlike the animals.

So yes, you're right that it's not the same classification system as today, but that's not the point.


There is a debate as to what exactly the "image" of God means.

And even if we are theomorphic, how would that mean the bible says we couldn't fall under the modern definition of the word "animal"?

There are ways in which humans are different from all other animals, that is why our laws apply only to us and not to other animals. Dose this make the declaration of independence wrong? Dose it mean the constitution claims that we deserve our own biological taxa? Hell no.

Genesis focuses on the ways in which we are different than other animals instead of the ways we are similar because it is a message to us about those differences and the responsibilities that come with them, in a similar way that the law treats humans and other animals as different because laws are made for us and focus on the ways we are different than other animals, such as our needs/desires for complex property laws and civil rights, instead of the ways we are the same.

Our current biological taxonomy focuses on the ways we are the same instead of the ways we are different because it is about determining how closely related forms of life are.



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06 Feb 2013, 9:40 am

In the flesh, we are animals. But we have the mental ability to transcend from our animal ways through through morality, rationality, and philosophy. Animals do not have those characteristics.