Odd problem? What to do?

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So, I emailed my son's teacher because he was having problems with his homework. I also explained that he is very literal in his interpretation of her instructions and because of that, he is not doing as well on his writing assignments as I feel he should.

Her basic response was "OK...I think he is a wonderful human being and young man."

That's great. But he is not going to make a living being a wonderful human being. He is going to need to know how to write.

Has this ever happened to you? That teachers gloss over learning difficulties and focus on positive character traits? Why do you think she did this? Do you think it's because she doesn't think he can work harder? Or because she wants to make sure I know that she sees what a good kid he is? How do I respond in a way that lets her know that I appreciate that she appreciates what's good in him, but that he can do more than what he is showing?

My son has said that she is the strictest teacher he has ever had. And he had a .really. strict teacher in 2nd grade. I think that is throwing me for a loop, because he doesn't describe her as being the warm fuzzy type, so I can't figure out why she wrote what she wrote. I know you guys can't mind-read her, but thinking through a variety of reasons why she might have responded this way will help me be prepared to have a more in-depth conversation.

I am always wary of offending teachers because I really need them to be my ally, ykwim?

I'm a teacher, and I use this strategy all the time in dealing with parents and students alike. We are taught to point out both strengths and weaknesses when giving criticism. It sounds to me like she doesn't know your child well enough yet to accurately assess those and was just trying to find something to say. It takes time to figure out how to modify curriculum for individual students, because different things work for different kids, so an entire plan of action might be a bit much to come up with on the spot. I'd watch it for a few weeks and see if she changes anything based on your advice. Then I'd schedule a face to face meeting or phone call to check progress.

Thank you for letting me know that this might just be a "teacher thing."

So in other words, do nothing right now? Does it make a difference that he is not in Spec Ed and does not have an IEP? She didn't give any criticism or even acknowledge that I said he was having difficulty or that he could do more.

How do you know he can do so much better than he is? have you talked to him about it? maybe its not a lack of effort on his part or at least maybe that was the teachers assessment of the situation. I mean I know a lot of times I can try as hard as I can and I still think just as literally because one cannot very well change their thought process or thinking style that they are used to. Not to mention I think its fairly common for people on the spectrum.

Maybe the teacher could explain them in a different way or make a better effort to make sure he understands, but there are a lot of things that could be contributing so its worth looking into them all.

He said he can do better. I know he can do better. Part of his problem is that he takes directions VERY literally. So if she says "give 2 examples" he writes 2 sentences, each with one example, when he is more than able to write multiple sentences about each example. So his thinking ends up looking very simplistic. He is also at that wonderful age where he thinks that if only he can follow every rule (including directions for assignments) exactly correct, he won't stick out anymore. So he can get very focused on the rules, to the exclusion of seeing the big picture. I also feel that this particular teacher expects him to infer more than he is able to.

Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate your point that sometimes they are doing their best, but in this case, I know he can do better if she just structures things in a way that will help him instead of boxing him in.

I've had the best results taking the angle that the parent and the educator are a team. I wonder if the response would be less condescending if you'd finished your letter with "is there anyway we could work together and reinforce each other to alleviate this?"

Of course it all comes down to whether the teacher "gets it" or if they just assume everyone thinks like they do.

Sadly, a lot of parents fall into this trap, mine including. They're so focused on their child being an academic wunderkind, that they feel compelled to achieve it at any cost, burnout and anxiety (the child's, not the parent's) be damned. I'll direct some questions to you; apologies for any perceived harshness. How do you know he can do better? What prompted you to believe that? What sources do you base that belief on? In what context did he tell you he can do better? What tone of voice? (An "upset with myself for missing a simple concept" tone, or an "I won't get to watch TV for a week I don't promise to do better" tone"?) Please think about the answers to these questions. I side with the people who believe that your son is doing just fine, to the best of his ability. And getting him to do better is like getting blood from a turnip.

It's extremely easy for a smart child becomes a victim of his own success. Namely, when people start taking his good academic performance for granted and become upset when they it doesn't happen. Especially so for an aspie child, who may have difficulty asserting himself in the family, and give in to demands for "doing better" due to perceived lack of choice or power over his situation. One thing for sure, I never should have gotten good grades in first and second grade. The material came very easy to me, but I should have underachieved "for good measure". Good grades in early elementary school led to draconian demands to get good grades every year until I graduated high school. Yes, under the same "I know he can do better" pretext.

Now that I vented, the teacher's "wonderful young man" response seemed very generic and almost a brush-off. I'd go as far as calling it an insult to the OP's intelligence. The teacher clearly didn't know how to properly respond, and said the one thing she believed would appease an unhappy parent. Interestingly, not unlike an aspie child who memorizes a phrase or two that NT's like to hear, and spews it out when needed.

Last edited by Aspie1 on 13 Feb 2013, 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

It does make a difference if he is not on an IEP. Does she at least know he is on the spectrum? If you don't have an IEP, and you haven't told her, chances are she doesn't know, and she certainly has no idea what accommodations to give, because that varies from kid to kid. A lot of teachers will not make accommodations with no IEP, though they should. My son is not on an IEP, as he is extremely high functioning, but they have him in the mid-level reading group, when he is reading lexile 600 books at home (upper third grade level, when he is in first grade), just because he can't process as fast as the other kids so they think he doesn't understand. And then they wonder why he is acting up, when clearly he is bored. I think when teachers are getting "good enough" work out of students, they aren't super motivated to help the student do better, as I can guarantee you there are numerous other students NOT on grade level at all that she has to worry about. It's not right, but it's the way it is. If he is not getting bad grades on the work (ie below 70%), just not doing HIS best, she is probably content with that and not really willing to do more. I don't advise that you do nothing, just give it a few weeks so you don't make a pain of yourself, and readdress it in person next time (when she has been given some time to prepare to give you some answers), from the standpoint of making a plan together (with you working with him as well as her) and not blaming her because she writes her questions "wrong".

I agree with this.

I see you are from the US. I think most schools in the states today are very tech savey. I can get my kids grades online or any of the teachers email addresses the same way. I think: I have had some success keeping in contact with teachers the kids are having issue with. I drop a email asking how he or she did today? This week? What kind of assignment. And like Kalor mentioned use some team building terms when corresponding. "We" statements instead of "I" or "you" when possible. What can I do to help you? Are we having any issues this week? ect ect. He has done some neat things this week. Did you teach him that.

I have found this serves two purposes. First it removes him from being just another face in the crowd. And it puts the spotlight on her. 2nd A little praise and acknowledgement go a long way. It tends to motivate them to create opportunities.

Just some suggestions.

Bryan

We received the aforementioned result in our son's language assessment, and was just after some advice going forward.
Is this something that is likely to improve with time? Obviously we will continue speech therapy. I must say that this does explain a lot, like issues with executive functioning which have become more apparent since starting primary school a couple of weeks ago.

That is very odd indeed.

I would reply to her something like
"I am glad you like my son but I would appreciate if we could look at possible solutions for this problem"

or something like that, polite, acknowledging that she sais something nice about him, but also point out that you actually wanted some kind of response, even if it's just a response saying she needs more time to figure him out.

First of all, I do not expect him to be an "academic wunderkind" and that is quite an assumption on your part. How do I know he can do better? Because he is a smart kid and he knows how to write more than one sentence at a time. If you asked him to explain the answer to the question, he would have done so with much more detail and clarity. But because he interprets "two examples" as meaning "two sentences" he did exactly what he thought he was supposed to do because he was nervous about "doing it wrong." He is barely getting C's in school and his IQ is at a minimum in the high average range. I don't expect him to get all A's. But I do expect him to get grades that reflect his level of mastery of the content. In what context did he tell me he could do better? In the context of seeing his grade and in realizing that he took the directions too literally and the assignment too narrowly.



I will be honest and say that this sounds like very convoluted logic to me. "I shouldn't have done my best when it was easy, because then too much was expected of me when it was hard." I am sorry. I am not going to downgrade my son just because he has ADHD and NVLD. I'm not going to sell him out and lower my expectations so that he never achieves his best measure of success in life. And perhaps if it was too hard for you, it wasn't because you were incapable of mastering the material, perhaps it was because your parents and teachers didn't understand how to change things to make it fit the way you processed information.



That's why I'm asking, and thank you for your thoughts. I want to get some ideas about why she would say this so that if I meet her I can be prepared. I need to prepare and rehearse for things like that and it helps me if I can anticipate some of what might be said on the other side.

He has ADHD and NVLD and all of his teachers know. We have had team meetings and he gets informal support through the school district. For example he gets organizational support and they have moved him into math enhancement even though he tests at or above grade level on standardized tests.

98% of his cohorts met grade requirements in ELA last year according to the state website, so I don't necessarily think it is that she is probably that distracted by kids performing below grade level. But I do think that his personality could create a situation in which a teacher may be satisfied with less than his best. He is very endearing and sweet. Very naive for a boy his age. Very kind and generous. So eager to please. So I do think it is possible that because he is such an "easy" student that sometimes teachers don't push him as hard as they should. By "push" I do not mean anything extreme. I do mean "____, this is not your best work. Why don't you try it again, and this time add X,Y, and Z." The two years that he did his best in school so far, he had the same teacher and that is exactly what she would do. She would even let him argue his "wrong" answers on tests because she said that often she could tell that he knew the material, maybe even better than kids who scored higher on the test. But sometimes a simple misread of the question made him answer it incorrectly, even though he had the knowledge.

Yes, I don't want her to think that she is wording her questions "wrong." There is nothing wrong with the way she words them, because I have read them. Quite possibly every other kid in the class does fine with it. They just don't work for him. But the last thing I want her to think is that it is because he is not trying, ykwim?

We have been in this district for only a year and I have been so, so pleased and impressed. Both kids have gotten support without an IEP. Without even any formal evaluation or testing. I never even had to provide "proof" of their diagnoses. All I had to do is meet with the school and tell them what I thought they needed to be successful, and they have provided it. This has been the perfect set-up for me because I want my kids to have the least amount of support possible, while still achieving to their potential. I know all may not agree with that, but I do think it is what's right for my kids. I do not want to do anything that makes me look over demanding or I am afraid they (the SD) will be less willing to help (without a fight). So I want to tread lightly. Make sure their needs are met, but do not offend people or put them on the defensive in the process.

I think your post somehow ended up in the wrong thread!

Thanks, everyone, for your feedback. I think I will just keep an eye on how things are going and request a meeting if he continues to have the same problem.

To keep my attitude in check, I am going to assume she said it because my son is very easy to work with and she appreciates someone who is not a part of the middle school drama! LOL!

Another thing that occurred to me when you were explaining his misunderstanding of the assignment.

A lot of kids and adults in general are uncomfortable with public speaking. And while it may not seem to be formally "public speaking" Asking a question in a room full of peers is exactly that. It may just be that he did not question her enough to indicate there was a problem. Because he was uncomfortable making these request publicly.

This was a bridge we had to cross at one point. I stress to my kids to ask. If they dont understand ask again. And not to stop asking until the completely understand. Even if that means asking after the class ends for the day. I explain this is a large part of the purpose of having a teacher.

LOL - we got this 8 times during DS's conferences! "Your son is so wonderful and a delight to have in my class!" Out loud, so the other people could hear - and I didn't hear this kind of enthusiastic response for other kids.

I think sometimes when teachers find a kid with special needs who has a parent who is on top of it, and who has some kind of gleam of hope for something great (you know, the magical aspie thing) they tend to play it up. DS is very, very charming and we've learned that we will get this response until the teachers finally figure out that we aren't kidding when we say he's disabled - if you know what I mean.

My favorite was when I was regularly dropping him off at school in tears (we had two years of school refusal that was similar to what many parents face in preschool - except it was 3rd and 4th grade!) The principal used to say to me "Oh, he'll be fine! He's fine!" in what I think was meant to be a reassuring way, but which somehow also erased the fact that somebody had to physically remove him from around my ankles (not kidding. Glad we've moved past that.)

I think many teachers struggle with the cognitive dissonance of intelligent kids with disabilities. In our experience, DS has done better with teachers who see him through rose-colored glasses than the other way, so we just make sure the teacher is accommodating/supporting him the way he needs and grin appreciatively when they compliment him.

We also do a lot of teaching at home, one of DS's rewards is Khan Academy or related videos, I bought him the Cartoon Histor of the Universe/US and Manga Shakespeare - also rewards for him. Less of a reward, but something he enjoys when he gets into it, we cook and do math...things that don't seem like education to him but which reinforce or pre-teach the things that he's learning in school. IMO, he's in school to learn executive function skills and how to get by socially - anything else is gravy. (DS is very bright and I'm convinced he can catch up outside of school - YMMV)