Adam Lanza diagnosed Aspergers, what happens with bad care

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ProvokesThinking
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21 Feb 2013, 7:37 pm

I just found this video:

http://video.pbs.org/video/2336615746

Well, it seems like it's official that he was actually diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome and he seems to have had a very severe form, as I am myself autistic I can actually understand the trouble he has been in, although his decisions were wrong.

I will tell in short the most important information about him given in the video:

He was apparently diagnosed with a reflex disorder, which means that his reactions at impulses weren't normal, for instance he couldn't stand being touched at a young age. This is similar to my severely autistic family member who can't be touched, but Adam seems to have had it at a young age. At a later age in middle school he was diagnosed with Aspergers Syndrome. He was known as a brilliant kid, he taught himself Mandarin Chinese and did other complicated things, he wasn't very good at making contact though. According to the journalists, what is one of the factors which could be most responsable for the tragedy is change. Because Adam couldn't stand change and he changed from school to school, while that wasn't good for him. Besides, when he went to university his good health care fell away and he didn't get any good care anymore, which could have lead downwards.

I actually think that if better care was given and a more stable environment for him, this wouldn't have happened in the first place.



redrobin62
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21 Feb 2013, 8:04 pm

They said he went on a murder spree because he wanted to top Anders Breivik's total, but after a short gunfight in the parking lot of the elementary school, he just opted to take himself out.



jk1
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21 Feb 2013, 8:06 pm

I was thinking along the same line about it. Violence is never justified, but I can see what might have been going on in him. He definitely needed more care.



Yuugiri
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21 Feb 2013, 8:19 pm

I'm guessing it's depression as a result of constant, unending overstimulation, then. This whole thing is horrible.


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Dillogic
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21 Feb 2013, 8:24 pm

Just a bad person.



ProvokesThinking
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21 Feb 2013, 8:25 pm

Dillogic wrote:
Just a bad person.


That's very NT-like. NT people also like to just judge: he's bad, he's wrong, without looking further what are the causes and what could prevent it. It's a form of security.



Dillogic
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21 Feb 2013, 8:31 pm

Nurture ain't going to make someone murder a couple of classrooms' full of kids. "Bad", "evil", "the wrong biology", "nature", or whatever you like to call it, does.



ProvokesThinking
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21 Feb 2013, 8:34 pm

Dillogic wrote:
Nurture ain't going to make someone murder a couple of classrooms' full of kids. "Bad", "evil", "the wrong biology", "nature", or whatever you like to call it, does.


What a ridiculous claim. In the army people are constantly 'nurtured' to kill people. One method is learning people how to do it, another method is giving people a lot of stress and humiliation and it could become an outlet.



Dillogic
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21 Feb 2013, 8:40 pm

ProvokesThinking wrote:
What a ridiculous claim. In the army people are constantly 'nurtured' to kill people. One method is learning people how to do it, another method is giving people a lot of stress and humiliation and it could become an outlet.


Yeah, because I'm absolutely sure Adam's mother conditioned him into demonizing children and blaming them for all the wrongs of the world, whilst showing that it's socially acceptable and honorable to do it within the context of "war" (which the military does). There's rules of war though, and that's not killing innocents (not to mention needing a clear lethal threat to induce lethal force as a response).

If stress and humiliation makes you murder 20+ children, there's something "wrong" with you, biologically. You know, considering everyone faces those two things, and almost no one murders 20+ children.



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21 Feb 2013, 9:10 pm

For those who don't want to watch the video, the text version from the Hartford Courant. It automatically plays a video at the top, which you can pause via a button on the lower left of the video. Also, you may get an annoying popup ad for the "Connecticut Home Show".

http://www.courant.com/news/connecticut ... full.story

It seems that Nancy Lanza constantly was shuffling Adam in and out of programs and schools, which is about the worst thing you can do to an aspie. He'd get settled, then she'd decide he was doing poorly, and off he'd go somewhere else. It's no wonder he eventually grew to hate her. In addition, she would fly off to various tourist destinations and leave him all alone in the house with TV dinners to eat; she said she wanted to make him independent, but he likely perceived it as being abandoned. She pulled him out of HS and away from his support system. He was too young and immature for college. When she decided that she was gonna move to some strange city with him, it likely set him off.

It seems that every indignation you can inflict on an aspie, she did it. She wasn't mentally ill unlike some of our parents, but she did everything wrong. An American supermarket tabloid claimed that Adam had started worshipping the devil, burning himself with a lighter, and believing that he himself was the personification of evil. I have to admit that similar thoughts about being the personification of evil crossed my mind more than once, and my upbringing was far more stable. The obsession with the Norwegian gunman would fit. I'm sorry, but Nancy largely dug her own grave here, her son was unstable to begin with and she did all this to him, constantly changing everything, and we hate change.



ProvokesThinking
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21 Feb 2013, 9:14 pm

Dillogic wrote:
ProvokesThinking wrote:
What a ridiculous claim. In the army people are constantly 'nurtured' to kill people. One method is learning people how to do it, another method is giving people a lot of stress and humiliation and it could become an outlet.


Yeah, because I'm absolutely sure Adam's mother conditioned him into demonizing children and blaming them for all the wrongs of the world, whilst showing that it's socially acceptable and honorable to do it within the context of "war" (which the military does). There's rules of war though, and that's not killing innocents (not to mention needing a clear lethal threat to induce lethal force as a response).

If stress and humiliation makes you murder 20+ children, there's something "wrong" with you, biologically. You know, considering everyone faces those two things, and almost no one murders 20+ children.


I agree with you up to the extent that it's biologically determined in how far people can deal with problems. What you don't seem to understand though is that the constant change was very bad for a kid like Adam with Asperger's Syndrome. Just a question, do you consider it possible that Adam Lanza was autistic or do you like to do the not scientific claim that it's completely impossible without any proper arguments?



ProvokesThinking
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21 Feb 2013, 9:15 pm

pezar wrote:
For those who don't want to watch the video, the text version from the Hartford Courant. It automatically plays a video at the top, which you can pause via a button on the lower left of the video. Also, you may get an annoying popup ad for the "Connecticut Home Show".

http://www.courant.com/news/connecticut ... full.story

It seems that Nancy Lanza constantly was shuffling Adam in and out of programs and schools, which is about the worst thing you can do to an aspie. He'd get settled, then she'd decide he was doing poorly, and off he'd go somewhere else. It's no wonder he eventually grew to hate her. In addition, she would fly off to various tourist destinations and leave him all alone in the house with TV dinners to eat; she said she wanted to make him independent, but he likely perceived it as being abandoned. She pulled him out of HS and away from his support system. He was too young and immature for college. When she decided that she was gonna move to some strange city with him, it likely set him off.

It seems that every indignation you can inflict on an aspie, she did it. She wasn't mentally ill unlike some of our parents, but she did everything wrong. An American supermarket tabloid claimed that Adam had started worshipping the devil, burning himself with a lighter, and believing that he himself was the personification of evil. I have to admit that similar thoughts about being the personification of evil crossed my mind more than once, and my upbringing was far more stable. The obsession with the Norwegian gunman would fit. I'm sorry, but Nancy largely dug her own grave here, her son was unstable to begin with and she did all this to him, constantly changing everything, and we hate change.


This one seems to contain more information, certain things aren't mentioned in the video.



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21 Feb 2013, 10:03 pm

Dillogic wrote:
ProvokesThinking wrote:
What a ridiculous claim. In the army people are constantly 'nurtured' to kill people. One method is learning people how to do it, another method is giving people a lot of stress and humiliation and it could become an outlet.


Yeah, because I'm absolutely sure Adam's mother conditioned him into demonizing children and blaming them for all the wrongs of the world, whilst showing that it's socially acceptable and honorable to do it within the context of "war" (which the military does). There's rules of war though, and that's not killing innocents (not to mention needing a clear lethal threat to induce lethal force as a response).

If stress and humiliation makes you murder 20+ children, there's something "wrong" with you, biologically. You know, considering everyone faces those two things, and almost no one murders 20+ children.


Evil is a subjective human concept.

Also, I'm assuming you've never met Adam, so...

About the murdering of 20+ children, this is true, "almost" nobody does it. Yet, nobody sees anything wrong with child sweat shops in developing nations.



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21 Feb 2013, 10:13 pm

He was also on SSRI's, which have been linked to violence by multiple studies and banned in some European countries.

His murder spree may not have had anything to do with "bad care" or Asperger's, for that matter.



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21 Feb 2013, 10:43 pm

Dillogic wrote:
Nurture ain't going to make someone murder a couple of classrooms' full of kids. "Bad", "evil", "the wrong biology", "nature", or whatever you like to call it, does.


That's too easy and leaves out the obvious fact anyone can reach their breaking point, genetic factors can influence what will cause that in an individual but the environmental factors are just as important. The thinking that it's only somehow bad, evil, wrong biology that can lead to such things is ignorant as well as dangerous.


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22 Feb 2013, 12:19 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
Dillogic wrote:
Nurture ain't going to make someone murder a couple of classrooms' full of kids. "Bad", "evil", "the wrong biology", "nature", or whatever you like to call it, does.


That's too easy and leaves out the obvious fact anyone can reach their breaking point, genetic factors can influence what will cause that in an individual but the environmental factors are just as important. The thinking that it's only somehow bad, evil, wrong biology that can lead to such things is ignorant as well as dangerous.


People with Dillogic's personality think it's dangerous to ask "why?" something bad/evil happens beyond "that person must have been bad / evil / genetically defective". That's a nice comforting theory and all, but it doesn't exactly explain why history is full of "normal" people either condoning or actively participating in all kinds of horrific violent massacres.

I find it upsetting that so many people and the media in general seem disproportionately more disturbed when it's someone obviously "weird" or "not normal" becoming violent vs "normal" becoming violent. The media seemed disproportionately sympathetic towards that soldier who murdered 16 Afghan civilians. :roll:



Last edited by marshall on 22 Feb 2013, 12:27 am, edited 1 time in total.