Do girls find it extra hot when big guys bully small guys?

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magz
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09 Aug 2019, 1:59 am

Very interesting study but it describes early farming communities which are - in terms of our species evolution - not much less recent than Christianity - and didn't last very long as in ancient Egypt monogamy was already a social norm.
Older data of hunting gathering communities also does not show such patterns.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3083418/
What the article you linked describes was a very unusual time, thus so interesting.

The graph from the article shows it was a great, worldwide anomaly:
Image
Left: reproducing males, right: reproducing females.


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martianprincess
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09 Aug 2019, 8:54 pm

...What? No.

I think people put way too much stock into their oversimplified ideas of human evolutionary behavior. Maybe we should stop trying to be armchair anthropologists.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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10 Aug 2019, 1:57 am

magz wrote:
Very interesting study but it describes early farming communities which are - in terms of our species evolution - not much less recent than Christianity - and didn't last very long as in ancient Egypt monogamy was already a social norm.
Older data of hunting gathering communities also does not show such patterns.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3083418/
What the article you linked describes was a very unusual time, thus so interesting.

The graph from the article shows it was a great, worldwide anomaly:
Image
Left: reproducing males, right: reproducing females.



The Pharaohs had harems.



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10 Aug 2019, 2:34 am

IMHO the folks who find atavistic behaviors attractive, should be given a wide berth for a similar reason that one would avoid a big pile of feces.



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10 Aug 2019, 12:22 pm

I think women who are bullies might find that attractive...but in general probably not.


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10 Aug 2019, 4:50 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Alterity wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
What is an Alpha? Women on this site usually deny the existence of this term so I would like to see your definition.

That's weird. An Alpha is the socially dominate being. How they reach that status can vary and has more variations when you look at species and gender. Some do get to the Alpha status through physical or psychological aggression, but it's not a requirement when you're talking about humans. I would say it's more to do with personality traits that mark an alpha type. Your alpha tends to be the first person to step up if something needs to be done. On the outside they will show determination and confidence with their decisions and what they do.

There is a bit of a trouble when one is put in a position of power. Lets say you have an alpha individual who generally has good conduct. After being in that position and via the peer pressure of the followers, there could be a decline in their conduct because although they are 'lead', they are susceptible to acting in ways they think may please the ones granting them the power. They can also get cocky. Absolute power can corrupt absolutely. When it comes to working towards a goal or in a group, it tends to be better to have Alpha personalities that can work in conjugation together, rather than them competing over supremacy.


What's weird? Their denial of obvious things? You got to be used to it already.

The human species, as a whole, was extremely an Alpha-male driven and patriarchal species, even more than other cousin primates. https://psmag.com/environment/17-to-1-r ... ve-success , Christianity which had somehow standardized the monogamous marriage (and even influenced other religions like Hinduism and Islam in that) is a recent thing in the humankind timeline you know.

But yeah, let them keep denying that the Alpha man is a thing in human species, whatever floats their boat ha.

It's weird because I don't understand what their reasoning would be for making such a claim. Something around thinking that people are equal, perhaps. We are essentially equal as beings, but socially contributions and roles are different.

Monogamy has existed a long time and along side polygamy, its hard to say just when it started up. Actually its hard to say that human are truly monogamous anyway. If we do take a mate, and then that mate dies, we do then tend to seek another one. And of course we do things like 'break up" and seek others. There's many theories as to what the reason was to proliferation of monogamy but I don't think I would necessarily credit that to Christianity. Christianity is just another patriarchal religion that was essentially put together by borrowing aspects form other already existing religions and re branding them.

In ancient Egypt as magz said, they had standardized two person marriage. Pharaohs were in essence Gods, and thus not held to the same norms as the people. They weren't considered to be human.

Trying to say whether monogamy is 'natural' or not is somewhat of a moot point. As humans do many things that wouldn't really be considered natural. Our evolution has pushed us past many of our base natural occurrences. Which is why the OP's insinuation that we are all stuck at our base instincts is insulting. Personally as for as relationship structure goes, as long as everyone is on the same page an it works for you, do whatever floats your boat.

There is a particular thought that Matriarchy once reigned before the Patriarch took over. There are also scientists that say that early men and women were actually rather equal. Whether it was Patriarch, matriarch, or equal basic pecking orders would be around - thus your Alphas would still be in play. Having a alpha male around around doesn't necessarily mean he will be 'leader as there would be a female that sports even more alpha characteristics. She would take the lead by 'out Alpha-ing' him. lol Or in some cases like with grey wolves, they'd form a power couple.

In any case, what is valued and needed has changed so that the Alpha isn't necessarily going to be the more desirable mate choice. Especially if they are, as the OP has described, an a$$hole.


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21 Oct 2023, 7:27 pm

Ratae wrote:
DarkRain wrote:
No. That kind of behavior is disgusting and a complete turn-off. There's no excuse for bullying of any sort.


Females of all species get aroused by seeing the 'alpha males' AMOG/dominate the lesser males. Why should humans be any different?

Don't tell me you still believe in the Disney Movie version of life sold to you by your parents and the mainstream media.

All through my youth all i saw was the cutest girls dating the as*hole bullies and I got nothing. Why is there no truth in it. I'm sure not all these girls were wrong in what they liked. A small, skinny guy that can't fight other men and win just doesn't appeal to them.


The ones who date the "alpha male" A-holes are the ones least likely to be able to have any sort of coversation with.



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21 Oct 2023, 7:33 pm

Women sometimes like strong and confident guys, regardless of the guys morality or whether the guy engages in interpersonal power play, such as being a bully of whatever type.

I wouldn't be bitter over it, it is just how people are.



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21 Oct 2023, 8:15 pm

Ratae wrote:
I used to be a small, weak-looking, timid guy from my middle teens to early 20's and hated it. 5ft7 to 5ft9 and ranging from 110lbs to 130lbs from ages 17-21.

In college, around age 17-20, I used to get bigger guys bully me all the time. I noticed all these guys were very popular with the ladies. They were the sterotypical 'jocks'. They all had girlfriends but still felt the need to pick on and dominate me even though i had 0 girlfriends. I'm sure their bullying ways were not unnoticed by such ladies.

So, ladies, do you like this kind of macho, dominant behaviour in males? I mean, women are attracted to dominance right? And many ladies love the stronger-built looking chaps that can protect them from other males. So why SHOULD they not be attracted to male bullies that have a physical authority over smaller, weaker men.? I mean that's the order of things in animal kingdom - the larger males dominate and bully the smaller males, so why shouldn't it be that way with humans?


The types of girls that went after men like that are usually divorced today and had an abusive marriage or relationship. I say this not to blame anyone, but it is almost obvious. Thankfully there are a few exceptions, but I have noticed that some ladies repeat this process and have had more than one abusive marriage or relationship just because of the type of men they go after and the places that they hang out in the hope to meet them. Yet again there are exceptions to this, but I have seen it a few times. What DOES usually work and an old schoolteacher told me this about some of the pupils she had taught in the past, is that (And she puzzled over this) the gamer intellectual types who avoid trouble that get with the rougher tougher types (And we are talking about the extremes in both sexes here in traditional heterosexual marriages... So a lady who was a bit of a bully and didn't do so well in school marrying am an who did well and kept himself out of trouble and vice versa).... She noticed that these marriages lasted a lifetime! Yet the ones where the rougher types married rougher types, or the ones where the more timid types married the more timid types were generally the ones that didn't last. (Not saying this was always the case, but she noticed that it was generally the case from her experience. This is an elderly lady who taught them when they were little so she had watched them grow up).

It is the theory that not only do opposites attract, but opposites rarely compete and with that, opposites also work better as a team together! As the ones natural traits of weakness are where the other is strong and vice versa which is what can help the marriage last. Of course both need to love and fully trust each other! But both realize how much of a good "Catch" they have, as they see their other half of having the qualities that they don't, but also their other half is far less likely to go off the rails like they used to where the timid ones confidence grows being with the more confident and forward natured one. So it is often a win-win situation when it works. :heart:

But what is less likely to work is when a lady who is not of a bully herself gets with a man who is also a bully! Oh boy! I have seen that! Haha! Actually funny! Someone slightly younger than me who was in the same secondary school (11-16 year olds). This young lady was one of those ladies who would flatten many men! Haha! She was nice though as I worked with her. Good and honest, but she would disappear during her breaks to have a smoke. (She was one who started anti out with the rough kids at school). Anyway. One day she found herewith a date. A nice young man but he himself was a tough type, but nice with it. (What I mean is he was one who would be the first to stick up for himself, but not necessarily look for trouble. But he was the male equivalent that she was).
Now they had been eating a while, and one day she came into work with quite a black eye. She had a real good one! Some of the girls in work were sympathetic. She said he had hit her. Anyway. The end of the workday came and he came to pick her up, and I noticed he had two black eyes! Not one but both eyes! So the next morning I asked her " Come on. What happened?
She said "We argued and I hit him. He hit me back so I hit him again!" They were both as bad as each other! ( I knew they loved each other but would it beware for both of them to continue? Haha! I don't know what happened between them after that, but I did tell her not to hit him or she will expect to be hit back and I couldn't blame him for hitting her back as she gave him quite a clout! It was never one way with her! And both are actually nice people. Just not headed :D ).

But what I am saying is that in life, if one looks for trouble one will find it. But at the same time, opposites attract and often run off on each other so both gain from their differences... Uhmm. Something to think about... :D


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21 Oct 2023, 8:30 pm

I wouldn't find that hot at all. I would find that very repulsive.


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21 Oct 2023, 9:08 pm

CockneyRebel wrote:
I wouldn't find that hot at all. I would find that very repulsive.


That's because you are a decent person, CockneyRebel! :)



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21 Oct 2023, 9:19 pm

The women who marry bullies often, if not usually, become victims of domestic violence. If the bully was a football payer, neuroscientists at Purdue University and another nearby university measured loss of IQ in about half of high school football players after their first season from sub-clinical head impacts. 28% of professional players have CTE dementia by middle age and it is as deadly as Alzheimer's disease. Thus, they marry lower intelligence.
That is why I consider high school football, the players of which are not yet adults, as disgusting and offensive a form of child pornography as the sexual kind.
I cannot help but notice that middle-aged men who wear clothes with football team logos on them all have hideous beer bellies. How could any woman stand to be sexually intimate with that?
Women who want bullies instead of people of education and intelligence and conscience are too trashy for me. Evolution has made them obsolete.



Patrick22348
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21 Oct 2023, 9:33 pm

The women who marry bullies often, if not usually, become victims of domestic violence. If the bully was a football payer, neuroscientists at Purdue University and another nearby university measured loss of IQ in about half of high school football players after their first season from sub-clinical head impacts. 28% of professional players have CTE dementia by middle age and it is as deadly as Alzheimer's disease. Thus, they marry lower intelligence.
That is why I consider high school football, the players of which are not yet adults, as disgusting and offensive a form of child pornography as the sexual kind.
I cannot help but notice that middle-aged men who wear clothes with football team logos on them all have hideous beer bellies. How could any woman stand to be sexually intimate with that?
Women who want bullies instead of people of education and intelligence and conscience are too trashy for me. Evolution has made them obsolete.


Interesting


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21 Oct 2023, 9:33 pm

People find themselves in abusive relationships for various reasons, but it's not usually because they wanted to be with a bully. No one wants to experience domestic violence. I certainly didn't.


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21 Oct 2023, 9:38 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
People find themselves in abusive relationships for various reasons, but it's not usually because they wanted to be with a bully. No one wants to experience domestic violence. I certainly didn't.


Have you?


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21 Oct 2023, 9:41 pm

Patrick22348 wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
People find themselves in abusive relationships for various reasons, but it's not usually because they wanted to be with a bully. No one wants to experience domestic violence. I certainly didn't.


Have you?

Yes, I was in an abusive marriage.


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