Tropes vs Women in Video Games: What is your honest opinion

Page 2 of 5 [ 69 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

hanyo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 30 Sep 2011
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,301

07 Aug 2013, 8:56 am

I was surprised that the most sexist game I ever played wasn't in any of her videos. It was the first Lost in Blue for the DS.

After finishing the game as the boy you could "play" as the girl. Playing as the girl you were stuck in a very tiny area by the cave with little resources to collect. You couldn't even fish. You were completely dependent on the npc male to go out and progress the storyline and collect resources while you sat back at the cave keeping the fire going and cooking. Playing as either gender there were strict gender roles, only the boy could light the fire and only the girl could put sticks on the fire, and the boy would not cook at all.

Later Lost in Blue games I played were less sexist.



Schneekugel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Age: 39
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,612

07 Aug 2013, 8:59 am

puddingmouse wrote:

I think any commentary about sexism in games always focuses on specific genres - FPSs and platformers. Even in RPGs you get strong female characters.


Some rare exceptions in some RPGs, dont undo a trend. And specially Japano RPG´s are because of their typical female character design and specially their typical female emotional characteristics, something I simply cannot play. According to J-RPG´s women end with their physical development at 16 and their brain development seems to end with 8. O_o



Jono
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,343
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa

07 Aug 2013, 11:44 am

Schneekugel wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:

I think any commentary about sexism in games always focuses on specific genres - FPSs and platformers. Even in RPGs you get strong female characters.


Some rare exceptions in some RPGs, dont undo a trend. And specially Japano RPG´s are because of their typical female character design and specially their typical female emotional characteristics, something I simply cannot play. According to J-RPG´s women end with their physical development at 16 and their brain development seems to end with 8. O_o


Except that they aren't rare exceptions. In the majority of RPG's where you can choose the gender of your protagonist, the female protagonist is a strong female character. J-RPG's are only a sub-genre of RPG's and the reason for their particular portrayal of women is Japanese culture, it's the same thing with anime.

P.S. I guess this post is going to be ignored just like all my previous posts in this thread.



Geekonychus
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Nov 2012
Age: 34
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,660

07 Aug 2013, 11:49 am

Jono wrote:
Did you feel that way playing female Shephard in Mass Effect? Also, they tried to make Lara Croft less sexy in the reboot of the Tomb Raider series.


I made a Female Shephard and she was exactly how I wish most videogame heroines were portrayed. Deep 3-demensional personality, cool, sexy without being overly sexualized and (literally) just as tough as her male counterparts. She could be either female or male and therefore her gender doesn't define her as a character. Most of the female supporting cast was the same way.

That is where I feel developers get it wrong right from the beginning. They tend to make female characters who's defining trait is thier gender (leading to old standbye archetypes like described in TvW) rather than making strong well developed characters that just happen to be female. There are, of course, exceptions to this but they are rare within geek culture.

I like Tropes vs Women (she's completely on the money) and even donated a fiver to the project after all that nonsense started.



Kurgan
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Apr 2012
Age: 31
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,117
Location: Scandinavia

07 Aug 2013, 11:57 am

Schneekugel wrote:
Quote:
Lara Croft actually has fear and other human reactions.
Causing her to pant, squeek and groan a great amount of the time. If my partner wouldnt be sitting next to me, I wouldnt know if he is looking porn or playing video games. ^^


THis is what someone would do in the situation she's in. Making a video game character sexy is not he same as sexism; an unattractive main character would scare off women just as much as men.



GGPViper
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Sep 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,125

07 Aug 2013, 12:12 pm

If people have a problem with sexualized depictions of women in video games/movies/advertising, then why don't they relocate to countries where such depictions are illegal?

After all, those countries are generally much more dedicated to gender equality and the rights of women.


_________________
Omit needless words.


puddingmouse
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Apr 2010
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,777
Location: Cottonopolis

07 Aug 2013, 1:21 pm

Jono wrote:
Schneekugel wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:

I think any commentary about sexism in games always focuses on specific genres - FPSs and platformers. Even in RPGs you get strong female characters.


Some rare exceptions in some RPGs, dont undo a trend. And specially Japano RPG´s are because of their typical female character design and specially their typical female emotional characteristics, something I simply cannot play. According to J-RPG´s women end with their physical development at 16 and their brain development seems to end with 8. O_o


Except that they aren't rare exceptions. In the majority of RPG's where you can choose the gender of your protagonist, the female protagonist is a strong female character. J-RPG's are only a sub-genre of RPG's and the reason for their particular portrayal of women is Japanese culture, it's the same thing with anime.

P.S. I guess this post is going to be ignored just like all my previous posts in this thread.


Not even all JRPGs are sexist. I mean if Final Fantasy is sexist to the females, it's also sexist to the males, which it shows as generally (with some exceptions) as 'bishis', or very young-looking, androgynous beautiful men. They're supposed to look like fantasy characters, not real people in JRPGs. In Western RPGs where the characters are supposed to be more realistic, the women are usually strong characters.


_________________
Zombies, zombies will tear us apart...again.


LKL
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Age: 44
Gender: Female
Posts: 7,402

07 Aug 2013, 5:50 pm

Shatbat wrote:
I don't have much to contribute by myself, but the following link could be useful:
http://thehawkeyeinitiative.com/post/50 ... iative-irl

I loved this! Thanks.



Ann2011
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Jul 2011
Age: 50
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,843
Location: Ontario, Canada

07 Aug 2013, 9:28 pm

I watched Damsels in Distress 2 and it seemed that a lot of plots do revolve on violence against women. (Although, as Jono said, it's probably a characteristic of a certain genre.) But in the end I think it's just a part of our culture. These games would not be popular if no one wanted to play them.
I think the D in D is a natural sexual fantasy. And I think women respond to it too. It's good to be aware of the subtext, but this isn't going to go away.



Schneekugel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Age: 39
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,612

08 Aug 2013, 2:38 am

Jono wrote:
Schneekugel wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:

I think any commentary about sexism in games always focuses on specific genres - FPSs and platformers. Even in RPGs you get strong female characters.


Some rare exceptions in some RPGs, dont undo a trend. And specially Japano RPG´s are because of their typical female character design and specially their typical female emotional characteristics, something I simply cannot play. According to J-RPG´s women end with their physical development at 16 and their brain development seems to end with 8. O_o


Except that they aren't rare exceptions. In the majority of RPG's where you can choose the gender of your protagonist, the female protagonist is a strong female character. J-RPG's are only a sub-genre of RPG's and the reason for their particular portrayal of women is Japanese culture, it's the same thing with anime.

P.S. I guess this post is going to be ignored just like all my previous posts in this thread.


Ok, how many games do you know with strong female characters? Most games I know, woman dont seem to have that strong character, because of it being most important for them to please men by optic. Do you think, that a woman, focusing her life on having a men pleasing physique, wearing men pleasing clothes, men pleasing optics and often enough even when its completly weird, men pleasing shoes, is anyway related to an independent strong female character, that is focusing on her own instead of relating her self esteem, on what others think of her? Does prince Ken, the idol of focusing on being the way woman want him to be, seem like a strong male charakter for you? There are tons of woman who would say yes, because according to the typical Barbie setting he is a hero, saving princesses from witches and knows hell what. So according to many girls he is a real cool, strong male charakter.

But do you think as well of him? Or do you think, he shall get himself some guts and self esteem, and focus a little less on pleasing others and more about pleasing himself and being a normal, average person with an own life?

P.S.: I dont know, why you think I ignored your post, I answered to you my oppinion about the actual Lara Croft game? O_o Second Edit: I just saw, the response to Lara Croft was to Kurgans post, still that doesnt change my oppinion about the Lara Croft game, so the response to your question about the new Lara Croft game, is the same as the response to Kurgan mentioning the new Lara Croft game.



Schneekugel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Age: 39
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,612

08 Aug 2013, 3:55 am

About Mass Effect series:

If you want the oppinion about Mass Effect as well: Mass Effect 1: Ok as far as I remember. Mass Effect 2: So exactly why did the mass of the female companions wear exposing cloths all the time? So there is the one, wearing exposing jailclothstyle at the beginning. Ok, so if you are in jail you dont have much wardrobe. But I dont know about others, if I was out, I´d like to wear something else then jailhousestyle. Then there is the other char, that isnt by background story interested in mating guys. Luckily for male players, that doesnt keep her from thinking, its worth wearing uncomfortable, unpractical cloths that are revealing most parts of the chest all the time. Yeah..."Hello I am Knight Strongpaladin from the Order of the Eternal Virgins, that have chosen not to mate with woman.... By the way, do you think my ass-exposing leathertrousers in 80ies gaystyle look will please woman? Yeah, they are a bit shitty to wear in combat and really uncomfortable and whenever we slid down a slope I rip open my backside, but as a someone not caring for female companionship, I think its absolutely worth wearing it." O_o

Or do you think that a marine with a strong character would think himself: "Oh, I am going into battle. Those taliban are trying to get my ass. Which of my sexy armores should I wear, so that I please afghan civil woman. that are watching me on chance, while I fight. Pleasing woman is worth so much more to me, then my life." Ashley Williams: I mean goddamn, that woman is wearing overknee prostitute boots with heels, with an uniform mini skirt. *Head ---> Desk* Do army nowadays have prostitutes departments? "Hello, I am chief sergeant ... of the second prostitute department. You can see my rang on the number and colour of stars I wear as nipplepins, instead of shoulderpatches."

And the strong female character in Mass Effect 3 you speak of, stands up in the morning, and the first thing she seem to think of is perfectly applying lip contours pencil, dark red lip gloss, perfect eyeliner, wrong 1cm eyelashes with mascara, trim her eyebrows, apply eye shadows, do her hair... After wasting an hour on that, to prevent her seeing by someone without make-up, she goes on to less important stuff, like saving the universe.

Male shephard: Shaves his beard every three days, and uses a hairshaver with military 5mm socket.

So which one of both seem to have the strong character to you, the character with self esteem about himself, whose first thought in the morning is not having thoughts about that others are satisfied with their optics?

Thats what I meant with the example with Prince Ken. Yes Prince Ken, is a strong male character in the fantasy of many young innocence girl, just as the shephard Barbie looks like a strong woman to you, because of her being the strong woman you dream of. But for most male guys Ken is simply a complete "not very heterosexual according to classic male models" lamer, a "Sissi" or "p****", but definitly not "cool and strong" or "a strong character". And a Barbie whose first thought in the morning is applying a ton of make up, because its more important for her to wear make up before leaving her private rooms, then saving the world is as well simply a female "Sissy", "p****" and a "lameress". Thats not cool, and thats not a sign of an strong charakter. As you dont wanna play a Ken, anyway if lots of girl think he is a "strong, male charakter" I dont wanna play a Barbie, anyway if lots of boys think she is a "strong female charakter". I would like to be free to choose a charakter that is a "strong female character" according to my oppinion, not those of boy-fantasys. That doesnt mean I blame boys for having phantasies, we all have those phantasies. But I blame game-designers for not giving me the possibility to choose.

That doesnt mean that the actual models must be deleted of the games, but that there should be others added. As example for Mass Effect you could choose of two male characters, the male prefered testosteron chimp and additional a prince Ken rolemodel, and for female character the male prefered: "I always wear my perfect make up and care for my diet so that I look sexy on your screen."-model, and one with a stronger character and natural figure. That simply looks like someone looks like, when wearing heavy armor all day and whose sidebelly muscles are not existing in an parallel dimension to acchieve her the hipwide of an anorexic one.



Jono
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,343
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa

08 Aug 2013, 5:07 am

Schneekugel wrote:
Jono wrote:
Schneekugel wrote:
puddingmouse wrote:

I think any commentary about sexism in games always focuses on specific genres - FPSs and platformers. Even in RPGs you get strong female characters.


Some rare exceptions in some RPGs, dont undo a trend. And specially Japano RPG´s are because of their typical female character design and specially their typical female emotional characteristics, something I simply cannot play. According to J-RPG´s women end with their physical development at 16 and their brain development seems to end with 8. O_o


Except that they aren't rare exceptions. In the majority of RPG's where you can choose the gender of your protagonist, the female protagonist is a strong female character. J-RPG's are only a sub-genre of RPG's and the reason for their particular portrayal of women is Japanese culture, it's the same thing with anime.

P.S. I guess this post is going to be ignored just like all my previous posts in this thread.


Ok, how many games do you know with strong female characters?


Quite a few actually. I've already mentioned The Longest Journey, then there's King's Quest, Gabriel Knight, Kerrigan from the original Starcraft (Starcraft 1, not 2) was a strong female character etc.

Schneekugel wrote:
Most games I know, woman dont seem to have that strong character, because of it being most important for them to please men by optic. Do you think, that a woman, focusing her life on having a men pleasing physique, wearing men pleasing clothes, men pleasing optics and often enough even when its completly weird, men pleasing shoes, is anyway related to an independent strong female character, that is focusing on her own instead of relating her self esteem, on what others think of her? Does prince Ken, the idol of focusing on being the way woman want him to be, seem like a strong male charakter for you? There are tons of woman who would say yes, because according to the typical Barbie setting he is a hero, saving princesses from witches and knows hell what. So according to many girls he is a real cool, strong male charakter.

But do you think as well of him? Or do you think, he shall get himself some guts and self esteem, and focus a little less on pleasing others and more about pleasing himself and being a normal, average person with an own life?


Please identify which of my examples above do that.



Jono
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,343
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa

08 Aug 2013, 5:28 am

Schneekugel wrote:
About Mass Effect series:

If you want the oppinion about Mass Effect as well: Mass Effect 1: Ok as far as I remember. Mass Effect 2: So exactly why did the mass of the female companions wear exposing cloths all the time? So there is the one, wearing exposing jailclothstyle at the beginning. Ok, so if you are in jail you dont have much wardrobe. But I dont know about others, if I was out, I´d like to wear something else then jailhousestyle. Then there is the other char, that isnt by background story interested in mating guys. Luckily for male players, that doesnt keep her from thinking, its worth wearing uncomfortable, unpractical cloths that are revealing most parts of the chest all the time. Yeah..."Hello I am Knight Strongpaladin from the Order of the Eternal Virgins, that have chosen not to mate with woman.... By the way, do you think my ass-exposing leathertrousers in 80ies gaystyle look will please woman? Yeah, they are a bit shitty to wear in combat and really uncomfortable and whenever we slid down a slope I rip open my backside, but as a someone not caring for female companionship, I think its absolutely worth wearing it." O_o


The character with most exposing outfit from Mass Effect 2 as I remember it was Jack, I guess that was the one with the exposing jailhousestyle that you talk about. I'm not sure the others were that exposing.

Schneekugel wrote:
Or do you think that a marine with a strong character would think himself: "Oh, I am going into battle. Those taliban are trying to get my ass. Which of my sexy armores should I wear, so that I please afghan civil woman. that are watching me on chance, while I fight. Pleasing woman is worth so much more to me, then my life." Ashley Williams: I mean goddamn, that woman is wearing overknee prostitute boots with heels, with an uniform mini skirt. *Head ---> Desk* Do army nowadays have prostitutes departments? "Hello, I am chief sergeant ... of the second prostitute department. You can see my rang on the number and colour of stars I wear as nipplepins, instead of shoulderpatches."

And the strong female character in Mass Effect 3 you speak of, stands up in the morning, and the first thing she seem to think of is perfectly applying lip contours pencil, dark red lip gloss, perfect eyeliner, wrong 1cm eyelashes with mascara, trim her eyebrows, apply eye shadows, do her hair... After wasting an hour on that, to prevent her seeing by someone without make-up, she goes on to less important stuff, like saving the universe.

Male shephard: Shaves his beard every three days, and uses a hairshaver with military 5mm socket.

So which one of both seem to have the strong character to you, the character with self esteem about himself, whose first thought in the morning is not having thoughts about that others are satisfied with their optics?

Thats what I meant with the example with Prince Ken. Yes Prince Ken, is a strong male character in the fantasy of many young innocence girl, just as the shephard Barbie looks like a strong woman to you, because of her being the strong woman you dream of. But for most male guys Ken is simply a complete "not very heterosexual according to classic male models" lamer, a "Sissi" or "p****", but definitly not "cool and strong" or "a strong character". And a Barbie whose first thought in the morning is applying a ton of make up, because its more important for her to wear make up before leaving her private rooms, then saving the world is as well simply a female "Sissy", "p****" and a "lameress". Thats not cool, and thats not a sign of an strong charakter. As you dont wanna play a Ken, anyway if lots of girl think he is a "strong, male charakter" I dont wanna play a Barbie, anyway if lots of boys think she is a "strong female charakter". I would like to be free to choose a charakter that is a "strong female character" according to my oppinion, not those of boy-fantasys. That doesnt mean I blame boys for having phantasies, we all have those phantasies. But I blame game-designers for not giving me the possibility to choose.

That doesnt mean that the actual models must be deleted of the games, but that there should be others added. As example for Mass Effect you could choose of two male characters, the male prefered testosteron chimp and additional a prince Ken rolemodel, and for female character the male prefered: "I always wear my perfect make up and care for my diet so that I look sexy on your screen."-model, and one with a stronger character and natural figure. That simply looks like someone looks like, when wearing heavy armor all day and whose sidebelly muscles are not existing in an parallel dimension to acchieve her the hipwide of an anorexic one.


Oh sweet Jesus, you can customise what she looks like. So, if the game allows the player to customise the appearance of the protagonist and some 15 year old boy decides to make the female protagonist look like barbie, how is that the fault of the developers exactly? The point you're missing is one could also make male Shephard look like Ken if you want to because the appearance of the protagonist is determined by the player, not the developers.

Also, I was talking about her personality, not what she looks like (which again is completely determined by the player, so it's got nothing to do with sexism in the game itself). Her personality is in fact not actually really different from male Shephard because about all the dialogue in the game, except for the optional dialogue between her and her romantic interest, is identical to dialogue for male Shephard. That's really what I meant, character development and personality are not defined by gender in this case.



Schneekugel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Age: 39
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,612

08 Aug 2013, 6:19 am

What helps customizing, if there is no variety to choose? Star Wars online is one of the rare games, where you can choose additional body types that are not only a variation of "small barbie", "tall barbie", "extra anorexic barbie", but that gives you the additional possibility of an muscular muscle type or one with an normal female silhouette. Guild Wars 2: If you want to play a normal looking woman, you are reduced to one race, the Norns. Because human race dont have normal womans to choose and elves seem to be the new word for "wet dreams of 9 year old boys starting puberty". In World of Warcraft the old female beta trolls even were removed, because of them being "to trollish" O_o. Instead troll female now look like humans with supertiny cute, little fangs, and only the feet are a bit else. I mean its trolls, why the hell do trollwoman have to look sexy for humans, if I wanna play a troll, I wanna play a troll, means I wanna look like a troll and not like a "Dawn-Barbie". And your Merrigan even cared for make up and Hairstyle after being assimilated by a race of slimy insects. Never heard of Locutus caring for his lipstick, while being a Borg. Why is all I get for playing Resident Evil an additional dumb lame golden latex pornsuit? Is it so hard to understand for you, that its simply depressing if you play that game, unlock the second wardrobe which normally means in most games cooler clothings than the original: And instead you got the suit of the YMCA rocker? And why do bother about that I would ignore your post, while you ignore everything that I wrote and goes against your oppinion, like the Ashley Williams prostitute department army clothings?

I dont know about Gabriel Knight, so I cannot know every game you play. But some rare excuses simply dont undo a trend. And the trend is that an great amount of the characters are simply Barbies. Why you try so hard to deny that I dont know. As said I dont blame anyone. So whats so horrible, that I dont want something to be forbidden, but simply additional options? Why is it bothering you, that I think its simply stupid that 40% of the female armor models specially in Hellgate London, but in many other games as well, are totally dumbass, because of them exposing the upper chest and having high heels? I mean sorry, but you wont find any midieval armor with an exposed chest in the heart area, simply because its stupid to wear an armor, and leave your vulnerable heart area unguarded. Why is it bothering you, that it sucks for me, when I find a really, cool, amazing armor...and when you add it to your female character, it suddenly becomes a hipfree SM-partyclothing? Why do female characters often be really sooooooooo dumbass that you wanna punch them into their faces 50% of the time like as example in the new Lara Croft part you spoke off "Land the helicopter. - No, we cant, we will crush! - I said, land the helicopter! - Thats suicide! - *Lara pulls weapon and point at helicopter pilot - pilot goes down - helicopter crushes* - Lara: "Buhuhuhu...I am so sad, buhuhu...why did that happen..." (Because you f*****g idiot pulled a weapon and forced a helicopter pilot to land, when the helicopter pilot who is the one with the helicopter experience, told you five times, that it would be totally dumbass to do so, you brain-silicon doped moron!)

Why do you try to deny, that this simply happens pretty often in many of the games and why the hell is it bothering you so much, that I simply would like to have additional not other models, so I can play as well with a character that seems cool to me? Free character modeling pretty often simply means nothing but an empty phrase. Right now I play Divinity. No possibility to choose a body type, and 6 barbiefaces. Wow. Great. Story and game is great, handling is not that well...but being forced to see 100% of my playtime a bitchy woman, wobbling her ass and hips for me, simply sucks. Not to mention Lineage. Or WoW blood elves...



Declension
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Jan 2012
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,807

08 Aug 2013, 6:28 am

GGPViper wrote:
If people have a problem with sexualized depictions of women in video games/movies/advertising, then why don't they relocate to countries where such depictions are illegal?


You can want something to be rarer without wanting it to be illegal.

For example, I wish people wouldn't ask dumb questions they already know the answer to, but I don't want it to be illegal.



MindBlind
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 1 May 2009
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,341

08 Aug 2013, 7:00 am

I also want to make a point about how Anita doesn't seem to understand satire. She said in the last of her Damsels in Distress trilogy that satirical versions of the damsel in distress was still sexist because it is still trying to make light of sexism, when it isn't. That's absurd and completely misses the point of satire all together. The whole point of satire is to expose the absurdity of something by portraying it in a humorous manner. The only way you can possibly find humor in satire is when you already acknowledge that there is something terribly wrong with that line of thinking. A good satirist can make someone also see the error in their way of thinking. I mean, was Jonathan Swift actually suggesting that people just sell their children as meat to rich people during the Irish Potato Famine? No! He was satirizing the apathy that people were showing towards the poor . It wasn't making light of starvation, nor was it making fun of victims.

Another thing that bothers me is the way she speaks as if we must completely do away with the trope or that the media has an obligation to do away with this plot device or at least use it in a way she approves. They don't have to do squat for anyone. If Anita wants this trend to change, she has to get the ball rolling with her own ideas or helping to promote the ideas of other fledgling game developers. Anita already pitched a video game idea in the video itself and I don't see how she doesn't have the resources to make this game happen.

To me, it just seems Anita's real problem is not that there are few games that meet her criteria, but that there are games that exist with elements she finds problematic. I actually remember leaving a comment on one of her videos (the one about Kanye West and his song "Monster"). I was trying to defend Kanye West (which is difficult enough) by saying that it was satire attacking the misogyny of the music industry and that anything and everything can and must be the subject of art. Her response was essentially that topics that upset her sensibilities can never be justified as the subject of art. I find that a cowardly stance. Art doesn't have to be pretty or positive, nor does it have to meet your personal standards of what constitutes great art (but I'm getting ahead of myself).

I guess the that irks me the most about the series is that she suffers from confirmation bias and speaks authoritatively on things she doesn't have a lot of knowledge of.

Oh and guys, why are we attacking sex appeal? We don't need to get rid of sex appeal - we just need to make a wider array of female characters in games. That's it. There's nothing wrong with having happy-hand-fun-time :P