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Kurgan
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18 Nov 2013, 3:02 pm

meems wrote:
Declension wrote:
I think that at the end of the day, eating healthy is just as easy as eating badly. Everyone knows how to make or obtain:
(1.) quick, easy, and cheap healthy food,
(2.) quick, easy, and cheap unhealthy food,
(3.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive healthy food,
(4.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive unhealthy food.

The problem is that eating is such a primal and subconscious instinct that it's really hard to re-train yourself. For example, if you're hungry, it's just as easy to make a salad and feta cheese sandwich as it is to microwave a meat pie. But which one are you going to do? If you've spent your entire life reaching for the pies when you're hungry, you're going to have to make a conscious effort to not do that every single time.

EDIT: The poet linked in the OP says that he is talking about neighbourhoods where there are no grocery stores nearby. I'm not sure I really believe that there are such neighbourhoods. I understand the point he is trying to make, though.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert

It's not an uncommon occurrence in the U.S.

It's not about making better choices, it's about there being a lack of better choices for some people.


A food desert commonly refers to a place where there's 10 miles or more to the nearest grocery store. This is common in all countries of noticable size, not just the US. Do your grocery shopping once or twice per week instead of everyday, and it's no big deal. Furthermore, gas prices in the US are roughly 40% of what they are in Europe, with much cheaper cars.

Besides, only 2,4 million Americans live in so-called food deserts; 200-ish million people in the US are overweight.



meems
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18 Nov 2013, 3:08 pm

Kurgan wrote:
meems wrote:
Declension wrote:
I think that at the end of the day, eating healthy is just as easy as eating badly. Everyone knows how to make or obtain:
(1.) quick, easy, and cheap healthy food,
(2.) quick, easy, and cheap unhealthy food,
(3.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive healthy food,
(4.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive unhealthy food.

The problem is that eating is such a primal and subconscious instinct that it's really hard to re-train yourself. For example, if you're hungry, it's just as easy to make a salad and feta cheese sandwich as it is to microwave a meat pie. But which one are you going to do? If you've spent your entire life reaching for the pies when you're hungry, you're going to have to make a conscious effort to not do that every single time.

EDIT: The poet linked in the OP says that he is talking about neighbourhoods where there are no grocery stores nearby. I'm not sure I really believe that there are such neighbourhoods. I understand the point he is trying to make, though.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert

It's not an uncommon occurrence in the U.S.

It's not about making better choices, it's about there being a lack of better choices for some people.


A food desert commonly refers to a place where there's 10 miles or more to the nearest grocery store. This is common in all countries of noticable size, not just the US. Do your grocery shopping once or twice per week instead of everyday, and it's no big deal. Furthermore, gas prices in the US are roughly 40% of what they are in Europe, with much cheaper cars.

Besides, only 2,4 million Americans live in so-called food deserts; 200-ish million people in the US are overweight.


Not having any transportation is an issue for a lot of these people, not everyone can just go out and buy a car, regardless of how the prices of cars and gas compare to Europe.

In any case, please don't turn this into another thread where you won't shut up about how much contempt you have for fat people.


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18 Nov 2013, 3:50 pm

meems wrote:
ASDsmom wrote:
I didn't read the article but I'm going to say yes and no.

Is it easy? Yes because:
1) you know where to buy wholesome foods for a reasonable price
2) you can grow your own garden
3) tap into your farmer's market
4) eliminate costs by avoiding non-nutritional foods (sugars, grains, preservatives, etc)

Is it easy? No because:
1) food is like politics. people like voice their opposing opinions on you
2) we can't get away from junk food - it's everywhere and it's pushed onto our children by schools, friends, daycamps, etc
3) it takes a while to distinguish health foods from non-healthy foods (do your homework)
4) GMO's are hard to detect. if you haven't done your research, it's hard to tell how to look for it
5) labels are often reworded to fool you into thinking an ingredient is not listed


The link is to an upworthy page with a video and the video is about food deserts. How can any of what you just said be applied to people who literally cannot access healthy food?


Can you grow your own food? You can still read labels and choose the lesser of two evils. I didn't see the video, sorry. Do you not have access to local markets? I always thought that was pretty universal.. I could just be naive.

EDIT.. The link didn't work for me.



Kurgan
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18 Nov 2013, 8:00 pm

meems wrote:
Kurgan wrote:
meems wrote:
Declension wrote:
I think that at the end of the day, eating healthy is just as easy as eating badly. Everyone knows how to make or obtain:
(1.) quick, easy, and cheap healthy food,
(2.) quick, easy, and cheap unhealthy food,
(3.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive healthy food,
(4.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive unhealthy food.

The problem is that eating is such a primal and subconscious instinct that it's really hard to re-train yourself. For example, if you're hungry, it's just as easy to make a salad and feta cheese sandwich as it is to microwave a meat pie. But which one are you going to do? If you've spent your entire life reaching for the pies when you're hungry, you're going to have to make a conscious effort to not do that every single time.

EDIT: The poet linked in the OP says that he is talking about neighbourhoods where there are no grocery stores nearby. I'm not sure I really believe that there are such neighbourhoods. I understand the point he is trying to make, though.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert

It's not an uncommon occurrence in the U.S.

It's not about making better choices, it's about there being a lack of better choices for some people.


A food desert commonly refers to a place where there's 10 miles or more to the nearest grocery store. This is common in all countries of noticable size, not just the US. Do your grocery shopping once or twice per week instead of everyday, and it's no big deal. Furthermore, gas prices in the US are roughly 40% of what they are in Europe, with much cheaper cars.

Besides, only 2,4 million Americans live in so-called food deserts; 200-ish million people in the US are overweight.


Not having any transportation is an issue for a lot of these people, not everyone can just go out and buy a car, regardless of how the prices of cars and gas compare to Europe.

In any case, please don't turn this into another thread where you won't shut up about how much contempt you have for fat people.


I don't have any contempt for fat people. I was overweight in my late teens, but I did something about it. The first step was to stop blaming genetics, food deserts, economy and similar stuff. Not everyone can afford a car, but only 10% of all households are without a car--and these households are usually in the cities. By applying basic statistics, the 200 million overweight Americans can't all blame food deserts. Studies have actually shown that the obesity rates in food deserts are actually lower than obesity rates in low income areas.



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19 Nov 2013, 4:34 am

You are again in your automatical thinking, that everyone being overweight should as well be interested in erducing weight.

What if overweight people dont blame anything at all, but are simply not interested in becoming sexy to you? XD Some people have better things to do, then getting attractive for you, or blame or seek excuses themselves because of them not being attractive to you. ^^ Some people simply dont care for you and what you think of their weight, but are choosing their lifestyle fully aware, even if you dont agree with it. ^^



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19 Nov 2013, 10:38 am

ASDsmom wrote:
meems wrote:
ASDsmom wrote:
I didn't read the article but I'm going to say yes and no.

Is it easy? Yes because:
1) you know where to buy wholesome foods for a reasonable price
2) you can grow your own garden
3) tap into your farmer's market
4) eliminate costs by avoiding non-nutritional foods (sugars, grains, preservatives, etc)

Is it easy? No because:
1) food is like politics. people like voice their opposing opinions on you
2) we can't get away from junk food - it's everywhere and it's pushed onto our children by schools, friends, daycamps, etc
3) it takes a while to distinguish health foods from non-healthy foods (do your homework)
4) GMO's are hard to detect. if you haven't done your research, it's hard to tell how to look for it
5) labels are often reworded to fool you into thinking an ingredient is not listed


The link is to an upworthy page with a video and the video is about food deserts. How can any of what you just said be applied to people who literally cannot access healthy food?


Can you grow your own food? You can still read labels and choose the lesser of two evils. I didn't see the video, sorry. Do you not have access to local markets? I always thought that was pretty universal.. I could just be naive.

EDIT.. The link didn't work for me.


I have access to healthy, affordable food.

I just felt like it was an interesting video, and focused on something kind of important.


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meems
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19 Nov 2013, 10:59 am

Kurgan wrote:
meems wrote:
Kurgan wrote:
meems wrote:
Declension wrote:
I think that at the end of the day, eating healthy is just as easy as eating badly. Everyone knows how to make or obtain:
(1.) quick, easy, and cheap healthy food,
(2.) quick, easy, and cheap unhealthy food,
(3.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive healthy food,
(4.) elaborate, time-consuming and expensive unhealthy food.

The problem is that eating is such a primal and subconscious instinct that it's really hard to re-train yourself. For example, if you're hungry, it's just as easy to make a salad and feta cheese sandwich as it is to microwave a meat pie. But which one are you going to do? If you've spent your entire life reaching for the pies when you're hungry, you're going to have to make a conscious effort to not do that every single time.

EDIT: The poet linked in the OP says that he is talking about neighbourhoods where there are no grocery stores nearby. I'm not sure I really believe that there are such neighbourhoods. I understand the point he is trying to make, though.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert

It's not an uncommon occurrence in the U.S.

It's not about making better choices, it's about there being a lack of better choices for some people.


A food desert commonly refers to a place where there's 10 miles or more to the nearest grocery store. This is common in all countries of noticable size, not just the US. Do your grocery shopping once or twice per week instead of everyday, and it's no big deal. Furthermore, gas prices in the US are roughly 40% of what they are in Europe, with much cheaper cars.

Besides, only 2,4 million Americans live in so-called food deserts; 200-ish million people in the US are overweight.


Not having any transportation is an issue for a lot of these people, not everyone can just go out and buy a car, regardless of how the prices of cars and gas compare to Europe.

In any case, please don't turn this into another thread where you won't shut up about how much contempt you have for fat people.


I don't have any contempt for fat people. I was overweight in my late teens, but I did something about it. The first step was to stop blaming genetics, food deserts, economy and similar stuff. Not everyone can afford a car, but only 10% of all households are without a car--and these households are usually in the cities. By applying basic statistics, the 200 million overweight Americans can't all blame food deserts. Studies have actually shown that the obesity rates in food deserts are actually lower than obesity rates in low income areas.


It's no surprise to me that you couldn't resist trying to make this about your obsession with the subject of overweight/obese people and what you think of every single aspect of their lives, but I am actually surprised to hear it's actually about unresolved emotional damage you went through as an overweight teenager. While you have my sympathies, and I hope you can work that out in a healthy way someday, I'm not going to respond to anymore posts about obese/overweight people, because I have no interest in discussing this topic, and I've made that clear enough.


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meems
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19 Nov 2013, 11:25 am

ASDsmom wrote:
meems wrote:
ASDsmom wrote:
I didn't read the article but I'm going to say yes and no.

Is it easy? Yes because:
1) you know where to buy wholesome foods for a reasonable price
2) you can grow your own garden
3) tap into your farmer's market
4) eliminate costs by avoiding non-nutritional foods (sugars, grains, preservatives, etc)

Is it easy? No because:
1) food is like politics. people like voice their opposing opinions on you
2) we can't get away from junk food - it's everywhere and it's pushed onto our children by schools, friends, daycamps, etc
3) it takes a while to distinguish health foods from non-healthy foods (do your homework)
4) GMO's are hard to detect. if you haven't done your research, it's hard to tell how to look for it
5) labels are often reworded to fool you into thinking an ingredient is not listed


The link is to an upworthy page with a video and the video is about food deserts. How can any of what you just said be applied to people who literally cannot access healthy food?


Can you grow your own food? You can still read labels and choose the lesser of two evils. I didn't see the video, sorry. Do you not have access to local markets? I always thought that was pretty universal.. I could just be naive.

EDIT.. The link didn't work for me.


I didn't actually answer your question, I don't live in a food desert, but the way I eat, I don't think you specifically would think of as healthy. I'm not hesitant to eat genetically modified foods, I consume soy, I don't eat any meat/eggs/dairy etc. and I do garden and all that, but it's not really a significant source of food in my diet.


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woodster
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19 Nov 2013, 2:25 pm

Schneekugel wrote:
You are again in your automatical thinking, that everyone being overweight should as well be interested in erducing weight.

What if overweight people dont blame anything at all, but are simply not interested in becoming sexy to you? XD Some people have better things to do, then getting attractive for you, or blame or seek excuses themselves because of them not being attractive to you. ^^ Some people simply dont care for you and what you think of their weight, but are choosing their lifestyle fully aware, even if you dont agree with it. ^^




what does being healthy have to do with other people? If you're basing your decision to not be healthy purely on whether or not you care about what others think about you then you're doing it wrong.

There's only one reason to be fit and healthy and thats for yourself.

There's two ways you can let other peoples opinions affect you. You can do the opposite of what they think is right to spite them and spite yourself because they're wrong in some ways so you have to avoid everything you associate with them, or you could just do the thing thats the best for yourself and truly ignore the opinions of other people.

I got into that mindset where you're one or the other when i was at school. I was someone who did well at sports naturally, without trying, then i went to high school and i didn't want to be associated with the kind of idiot thats sporty but a complete moron only being sporty because of peer pressure and all that.

i got it into my head that you could be intelligent or you could be sporty. One or the other. So i stopped all my interest in sports and concentrated on improving my brain.

I realised much later that yes there are plenty of people that belong to one group or the other, but do you know who's at the top of the tree? Do u know who the real success stories in life are? They're the people that are both physically fit and intelligent.

But whatever, carry on with your destructive black and white thinking, as long as you dont conform.

It doesnt seem fully aware though btw. Some peoples fully aware is my walking through life with eyes closed. Being fit and healthy has nothing to do with morality or opinions of others, only looking after yourself and your own best interests.

Everyone thats overweight should be working at changing their situation and there are very few exceptions to that. And that includes myself more than anyone.

Which of course puts the people here reading my words at a distinct advantage. Intelligence is far harder to come by than a healthy body. You're already closer to having the full package of intelligent mind and healthy body than most people you've ever met.



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19 Nov 2013, 3:00 pm

^^^^ You assume that being healthy is a top priority for everyone. Of course everyone would rather be healthy than unhealthy ceteris paribus, but many (most?) people compromise. Smokers and drinkers generally accept the fact that their lives will on average be a few years shorter, but they do it anyway. Same with many overweight people. Or people who climb Mount Everest (that's just suicide in my view, but apparantly they find it worth the risk).
I don't do sports because I don't like it. If I die a few years earlier, fine.

On topic: I do eat fairly healthy because it isn't hard around here. Beans, cabbage, carrots etc are dirt cheap and easy to prepare. I get the feeling the man in the video uses the food deserts as an example of how the social structure breaks down in bad neighbourhoods.



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19 Nov 2013, 3:13 pm

trollcatman wrote:
^^^^ You assume that being healthy is a top priority for everyone. Of course everyone would rather be healthy than unhealthy ceteris paribus, but many (most?) people compromise. Smokers and drinkers generally accept the fact that their lives will on average be a few years shorter, but they do it anyway. Same with many overweight people. Or people who climb Mount Everest (that's just suicide in my view, but apparantly they find it worth the risk).
I don't do sports because I don't like it. If I die a few years earlier, fine.

On topic: I do eat fairly healthy because it isn't hard around here. Beans, cabbage, carrots etc are dirt cheap and easy to prepare. I get the feeling the man in the video uses the food deserts as an example of how the social structure breaks down in bad neighbourhoods.


well fine, come up with all the excuses you want, but you're the one that loses out. Everyone could benefit from a healthy body and i mean everyone. You will never live up to your full potential unless you realise that.

I never said it was anyones top priority though. It's just part of a healthy balanced life. it doesnt take over your life, its just something you do at regular intervals that benefits your life as a whole.

i feel sorry for you if you've never experienced the energy levels you get from being fit. It's silly really, the amount of mental energy you get is totally wasted on someone that's stupid, and then you get these intelligent people living life with this half used body and not realising how much more powerful the brain is when its housed in a body with massive amounts of energy. Intelligent people have more to gain from physical fitness than anyone.

I go to the gym and rather than feeling exhausted im bouncing with energy and my brain works at full whack all night. It's the best of both worlds if you can manage to introduce it into your life as a regular thing.

The thing that people who are fit realise that people that aren't don't, you can fit fitness into any life. Physical fitness doesn't take time from your life, it gives time. It's hard to explain but believe me, anyone thats been fit will know, being fit makes time for itself and your whole life benefits from it.



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20 Nov 2013, 12:07 am

Being fit/eating a healthy diet doesn't always provide the "total package". I'm pretty physically fit, but I have an autoimmune disorder and OCD, for example. I mean that's not the only stuff I deal with but my point is that physical fitness doesn't create a significantly better life for everyone.

Having access to healthy food is something that I would say makes a significant difference in anyone's life, which was kind of the point of this thread.


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20 Nov 2013, 1:16 am

meems wrote:
I didn't actually answer your question, I don't live in a food desert, but the way I eat, I don't think you specifically would think of as healthy. I'm not hesitant to eat genetically modified foods, I consume soy, I don't eat any meat/eggs/dairy etc. and I do garden and all that, but it's not really a significant source of food in my diet.


ok, you've totally lost me now. :?



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20 Nov 2013, 1:33 am

ASDsmom wrote:
meems wrote:
I didn't actually answer your question, I don't live in a food desert, but the way I eat, I don't think you specifically would think of as healthy. I'm not hesitant to eat genetically modified foods, I consume soy, I don't eat any meat/eggs/dairy etc. and I do garden and all that, but it's not really a significant source of food in my diet.


ok, you've totally lost me now. :?


I was answering your questions.

I don't live in a food desert.


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20 Nov 2013, 1:39 am

meems wrote:
Being fit/eating a healthy diet doesn't always provide the "total package". I'm pretty physically fit, but I have an autoimmune disorder and OCD, for example. I mean that's not the only stuff I deal with but my point is that physical fitness doesn't create a significantly better life for everyone.


ill take your word for it.



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20 Nov 2013, 1:54 am

Mostly I avoid fast food and cook at home. Rarely do I go out to eat, but 1-2 times per week & this works pretty well for me. Also I exercise on a regular basis.


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