Is the Men's Rights Movement inclusive toward autistic men?

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vermontsavant
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04 Nov 2013, 12:55 pm

I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry


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AardvarkGoodSwimmer
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04 Nov 2013, 3:43 pm

Quote:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... t-mrm.html

'  .  .  The first, entitled ‘Don’t Be That Guy,’ warned young men that having sex with a woman too inebriated to give consent is considered lawful rape. One of the posters featured a picture of a girl passed out on a couch, with the tagline, “Just because she isn’t saying ‘no’ doesn’t mean she’s saying ‘yes’.” Police in both cities credit the campaign with a 10 percent reduction in rapes over the previous calendar year.  .  '


Quote:
'  .  .  Using the same images and graphics as the ‘Don’t Be That Guy’ campaign, ‘Don’t Be That Girl’ claims that many young women who engage in consensual sex later lie about having been raped. “Just because you regret a one-night stand doesn’t mean it wasn’t consensual,” reads one poster. The campaign outraged anti-rape groups and law-enforcement officials alike; University of Alberta’s chair of gender and women’s studies Lise Gotell described 'Don’t Be That Girl' as a “deeply offensive… rape apologist campaign.”  .  '


So, I'd say it's not exactly the finest hour of the men's right movement.  It's like they're not getting the issue of acquaintance rape, and how common it is, and how guys justify it even to themselves.

And the men's group is missing a real opportunity, to publicize among guys that 'that shitt ain't cool.'  And that in addition to the legal argument, come on, man, don't be a jerk, don't be an assholee.



gailryder17
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04 Nov 2013, 9:32 pm

vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry

:huh: :scratch: :roll: :shrug:


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vermontsavant
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04 Nov 2013, 9:59 pm

gailryder17 wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry

:huh: :scratch: :roll: :shrug:
sorry just having fun


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gailryder17
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05 Nov 2013, 10:19 pm

vermontsavant wrote:
gailryder17 wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry

:huh: :scratch: :roll: :shrug:
sorry just having fun

I had trouble detecting the sarcasm, hence all the confused emoticons.


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vermontsavant
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06 Nov 2013, 1:49 am

gailryder17 wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
gailryder17 wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry

:huh: :scratch: :roll: :shrug:
sorry just having fun

I had trouble detecting the sarcasm, hence all the confused emoticons.
my sarcasm is very dry.i fool a lot people


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Verdandi
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06 Nov 2013, 4:53 am

gailryder17 wrote:
Zerbu wrote:
Geekonychus clearly doesn't know a thing. Some of the most active members in the men's rights movement are women (GirlWritesWhat and TyphonBlue, for example). Furthermore, some of the male members are male victims of sexual harassment, sexual assault or even rape - does that sound like they're just bitter that they can't attract women to you?

Maybe he should read less third-party articles about the movement, and do more original research.

Same with CharityFunDay. How the fact that more men choose to pursue certain jobs means all men have the upper hand is beyond me. As for the M(H)RM supporting autistic rights being an illusion? I've mention to them on multiple occasions that I have Asperger's, and have never received any hostility.


I questioned the credibility of the articles he sent me too.


The articles are actually accurate and credible. If the Daily Beast article is the one I think it is, it has links that verify what the author is saying.

I have never had a constructive interaction with an MRA. They're largely bluster and seem to be more focused on hating women, accusing women of hating all men for disagreeing with them, demonizing feminism, complaining that so-called "alpha males" are more successful with women than they are, and generally speaking seem to a disaffected group of cisgender, straight, white, able-bodied, NT men who see gains made by members of other demographics as losses for them. They also tend to obfuscate issues - like claiming that men are sent to prison in disproportionate numbers while neglecting to mention how race and class impacts such statistics. They like to mention autistic men but only for the sake of shoring up an argument that calling someone "creepy" is a slur and the person might be an autistic man who doesn't know how not to be creepy. This is not out of concern for autistic men, this is an attempt to control how men like them are discussed.

I have been in discussions where MRAs have insisted feminists don't care about men who are raped or abused, even while multiple people are giving them links that say otherwise. I wouldn't approach them as a valid or useful movement.

Whenever I see someone defending MRAs or claiming that they're a valid movement, that's generally enough evidence to conclude that they are either liars or badly misled. Either way, trying to engage them is a waste of my time and energy.

Here's Rational Wiki's MRA page, with citations included:

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Men%27s_rights_movement

You can follow the citations at the bottom and see for yourself what MRAs are like.



Adamantium
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06 Nov 2013, 10:02 pm

I looked into this about a decade ago. Seemed to be mostly pissed off divorced guys upset that their wives got anything. They would throw around some talk about legit concerns like abused men, raped men, etc. and then get right back into complaining about how the courts had taken side with that b***h, etc.

They seemed mostly a bunch of sad losers with a few very dangerous, rageful nutcases in the mix.



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11 Nov 2013, 2:27 pm

I grew up in an atmosphere of progressive politics and feminism, and was scruplulous about not taking advantage of my position as a white male. Eventually, I was the first man invited into a group of feminists who wanted a combined action and support group, and their first co-ed experiment. Eventually I learned that the support was only for the women - the men were on strict probation. I had to keep giving them the benefit of the doubt, until I realized that they had almost no other intellectual capital.

What finally tore it for me was when we were discussing a future without men, and I countered one of their examples with a scholarly, co-ed written paper giving more details on the behaviour of baboons. By the next meeting, not only my group, but all their friends had sworn off all primate studies. To me, that made as much sense as discussing climate without looking at ice cores, or fighting the Jets with one hand tied behind your back. I finally realized that I was in a cult, not a science.

The MRM has a lot of hurt, cheated men who are not thinking very clearly either, but unfortunately, something like it is necessary to restore balance. When feminists use the word "equality" it always means more for them, and they never admit a fault. When challenged on facts, they go ad hominem with devastating force. E.O. Wilson was the only academic to be physically assaulted in his class in the 20th century, AFAIK, and Sociobiology made a pariah, instead of a wonderful tool for promoting co-operation.

The concept of patriarchy is a red herring, used to divide and cripple all the progressive people. Men in general have been blamed for a history created by psychopathic plutocrats. "Women's liberation" is an adaptation to the outsourcing of education, clothing manufacture, and food production, which left women with too little value in the home. The most androgynous women led the charge, and still treat heterosexuality as unenlightened.



old_badger
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11 Nov 2013, 2:31 pm

Whenever I here somebody talk about “white male privilege” , I have to wonder what privilege they are talking about. Yes, it does exist, even with the majority, but as people who fight for justice we can't speak in absolute terms. I have never seen it.

If I were offered a chance to join a group (it would have to be one of equality), I would be pessimistic.



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12 Nov 2013, 10:52 pm

Dear_one wrote:
The MRM has a lot of hurt, cheated men who are not thinking very clearly either, but unfortunately, something like it is necessary to restore balance.


I agree with you about the feminist movement's flaws, but I think to restore balance (not restore actually, as I'm not sure there ever was balance; let's say promote balance) we need a movement that is balanced. Not one that is even more sexist and insane than the movement it is reacting to, which is exactly what MRAs are.

The only reason I don't speak out against the men's rights movement as often as (or more than) I do against feminism is because they just don't have anywhere near the same level of influence.


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12 Nov 2013, 11:52 pm

gailryder17 wrote:
Now, this question is for the autistic men: do you feel that the Men's Rights Movement is inclusive toward you and the issues you face as an autistic?

I would challenge you to prove there is a significant and unified "men's movement". The two closest male movements I've come across whom use the media to promote their causes are i) gay rights and ii) single fathers groups.

gailryder17 wrote:
Do you think that the Men's Rights Movement only focuses on the issues of the most privileged of men

I doubt it, it's only men whom feel marginalized such as divorcees trying to get access rights to their kids who feel the need for "men's rights"

gailryder17 wrote:
or do you think that the Men's Rights Movement is willing to take intersectionality into account?


No idea what you are talking about



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12 Nov 2013, 11:59 pm

vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry

When my wife gets home from a hard day's work she usually does all this. I usually get out of her way and put my feet up and watch TV :wink:
(Of course if she ever finds out I wrote this I'll be sleeping in the garden shed :( )



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13 Nov 2013, 2:33 am

vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry


I'm great at cooking!
One out of 3 makes me... a failure at being a woman.

/manytears

:lol:


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Apple_in_my_Eye
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13 Nov 2013, 4:15 am

cyberdad wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry

When my wife gets home from a hard day's work she usually does all this. I usually get out of her way and put my feet up and watch TV :wink:
(Of course if she ever finds out I wrote this I'll be sleeping in the garden shed :( )

There's a study that says that married couples who share chores are more likely to divorce, so, excellent relationship skills there! :lol:
Quote:
The figures clearly show that “the more a man does in the home, the higher the divorce rate,” he went on.

See? It's not only is it god's intention for women to do the cooking, cleaning, and laundry, it's science's, too. (har har)
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... finds.html



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13 Nov 2013, 4:33 am

cyberdad wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
I respect women very much because:
there so good at cooking,cleaning and doing the laundry

When my wife gets home from a hard day's work she usually does all this. I usually get out of her way and put my feet up and watch TV :wink:
(Of course if she ever finds out I wrote this I'll be sleeping in the garden shed :( )

There's a study that says that married couples who share chores are more likely to divorce, so, excellent relationship skills there! :lol:
Quote:
The figures clearly show that “the more a man does in the home, the higher the divorce rate,” he went on.

See? It's not only god's wish for women to do the cooking, cleaning, and laundry, it's science's, too. (har har)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... finds.html



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