Student gets suspended for hugging his teacher.

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Robdemanc
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20 Dec 2013, 1:06 pm

Yes, I think there should be special consideration for teenagers. They have hormones buzzing in them all the time.



FMX
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20 Dec 2013, 6:28 pm

That "kid" is lucky he isn't one year older or he'd probably get charged. If the facts in the article are to be believed, he's lucky he's getting off with only a suspension. Sexual harassment is serious business and the fact that the harasser is, technically, a minor (it's really hard to say "child", looking at his picture!) doesn't change that.

TallyMan wrote:
Things seem to be getting very extreme. When I was a school kid aged 15 there was a Christmas school party for my year and several of us horny lads had a snog (made out) with one of the pretty young female teachers (aged 20 something) and this was in public and none of the other pupils or other teachers batted an eyelid. She was a damn good kisser too. "Please miss, can I have a Christmas kiss?" :P How times have changed.


8O Holy s**t! Are you serious? You made out - as in, French-kissed - with a teacher and other staff were OK with it? That's quite amazing!

I wonder how it would play it if it were a 20-something male teacher making out with 15 year-old female students.


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pete1061
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20 Dec 2013, 7:31 pm

TallyMan wrote:
Things seem to be getting very extreme. When I was a school kid aged 15 there was a Christmas school party for my year and several of us horny lads had a snog (made out) with one of the pretty young female teachers (aged 20 something) and this was in public and none of the other pupils or other teachers batted an eyelid. She was a damn good kisser too. "Please miss, can I have a Christmas kiss?" :P How times have changed.


Wow, I wish I went to your school.


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TallyMan
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21 Dec 2013, 2:59 am

FMX wrote:
That "kid" is lucky he isn't one year older or he'd probably get charged. If the facts in the article are to be believed, he's lucky he's getting off with only a suspension. Sexual harassment is serious business and the fact that the harasser is, technically, a minor (it's really hard to say "child", looking at his picture!) doesn't change that.

TallyMan wrote:
Things seem to be getting very extreme. When I was a school kid aged 15 there was a Christmas school party for my year and several of us horny lads had a snog (made out) with one of the pretty young female teachers (aged 20 something) and this was in public and none of the other pupils or other teachers batted an eyelid. She was a damn good kisser too. "Please miss, can I have a Christmas kiss?" :P How times have changed.


8O Holy sh**! Are you serious? You made out - as in, French-kissed - with a teacher and other staff were OK with it? That's quite amazing!

I wonder how it would play it if it were a 20-something male teacher making out with 15 year-old female students.


In the OP's article, if the student hugged & kissed the teacher against her will and especially after being warned not to do so then that is serious and qualifies as sexual harassment IMO. However, in my example the kissing was consensual. Because it took place in a public party context it was OK, certainly back in the 1970's. I doubt such behaviour would happen or be allowed today. I can't remember if any of the 15 year old girls made out with any male teachers, it is possible though. Things were somewhat permissive at my school (and in general) in the 1970's. Some of the 13 year old girls & boys were already (fully) sexually active with one another.


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FMX
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21 Dec 2013, 4:18 am

Sure, I get that the two cases are completely different and I personally don't think your consensual kissing with the teacher is a problem, but I'm still very surprised that others teachers saw it that way. I'd be even more surprised if it was seen as OK with a male teacher. I mean, it's not just the age difference, but also the fact that as a teacher they are supposed to keep a professional distance - or so I thought. Trying to look it from the "responsible adult" point of view: hey, one day they're kissing at a Christmas party, then she's doing some hands-on sex education - it's a slippery slope, so to speak. ;)


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AngelRho
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22 Dec 2013, 5:26 pm

The teacher did the right thing. With all the problems facing teachers when it comes to this sort of thing, it's better for the teacher not to risk it. It starts out this way, and if the teacher keeps quiet about it, the kid can come back saying he had sex with the teacher and he is now "traumatized," poor thing, and the teacher ends up in jail and with a career in the toilet. If the behavior continues and the teacher says nothing, she's in a position in which the kid can blackmail her, i.e. demand she have sex with him so he'll keep quiet (he's not going to, anyway), or he'll continue to make her life hell until she does. Students treating teachers that way is unacceptable, and it's better the teacher speaks out first.

I spent some 5 years as a classroom teacher and continue to take music students privately. The closest physically I ever got to a student was when I helped a female student get accepted into a public boarding school for visual and performing arts. I was outside my building on my usual parking lot duty when the girl ran up and tackled me. Her parents had just arrived to pick her up from school when they gave her the acceptance letter. She was excited and couldn't wait to tell me. Her parents were in the car and saw the entire exchange. I was a little weirded out, but went with it. I was happy for her, so…what am I going to do here?

There's a fine line between this girl jumping on me because she got good news and some inappropriate touching for other reasons. I'd generally advise against allowing even that kind of thing from happening with the understanding that circumstances aren't always predictable and that some students are going to act out just a little when you do something that completely changes their life!

I no longer teach in that setting or that age group (high school), and I'm seen more as just a regular guy. I have a female student in elementary school who is on-again/off-again with guitar lessons who is more affectionate than I'm really comfortable with--when I go by her school to pick up my daughter, she makes a point of giving me a hug when she sees me, usually about the time she gets out of lunch. I don't mind accepting hugs from kids, and age isn't really an issue. It makes me uncomfortable, but I don't want to be seen as some weird guy who doesn't seem to like anyone and freaks out over hugs. What I DO NOT do is go out of my way to solicit affection from kids, and I'm completely hands off unless someone else initiates contact with me. Not many people go to jail for two pats on a kid's back. I've never had a kid try to get downright inappropriate with me, but I'd have no problem telling a kid, "Dude, you're creeping me out…don't ever do that again…'kay?"



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26 Dec 2013, 12:03 pm

AngelRho wrote:
The teacher did the right thing. With all the problems facing teachers when it comes to this sort of thing, it's better for the teacher not to risk it. It starts out this way, and if the teacher keeps quiet about it, the kid can come back saying he had sex with the teacher and he is now "traumatized," poor thing, and the teacher ends up in jail and with a career in the toilet. If the behavior continues and the teacher says nothing, she's in a position in which the kid can blackmail her, i.e. demand she have sex with him so he'll keep quiet (he's not going to, anyway), or he'll continue to make her life hell until she does. Students treating teachers that way is unacceptable, and it's better the teacher speaks out first.

I spent some 5 years as a classroom teacher and continue to take music students privately. The closest physically I ever got to a student was when I helped a female student get accepted into a public boarding school for visual and performing arts. I was outside my building on my usual parking lot duty when the girl ran up and tackled me. Her parents had just arrived to pick her up from school when they gave her the acceptance letter. She was excited and couldn't wait to tell me. Her parents were in the car and saw the entire exchange. I was a little weirded out, but went with it. I was happy for her, so…what am I going to do here?

There's a fine line between this girl jumping on me because she got good news and some inappropriate touching for other reasons. I'd generally advise against allowing even that kind of thing from happening with the understanding that circumstances aren't always predictable and that some students are going to act out just a little when you do something that completely changes their life!

I no longer teach in that setting or that age group (high school), and I'm seen more as just a regular guy. I have a female student in elementary school who is on-again/off-again with guitar lessons who is more affectionate than I'm really comfortable with--when I go by her school to pick up my daughter, she makes a point of giving me a hug when she sees me, usually about the time she gets out of lunch. I don't mind accepting hugs from kids, and age isn't really an issue. It makes me uncomfortable, but I don't want to be seen as some weird guy who doesn't seem to like anyone and freaks out over hugs. What I DO NOT do is go out of my way to solicit affection from kids, and I'm completely hands off unless someone else initiates contact with me. Not many people go to jail for two pats on a kid's back. I've never had a kid try to get downright inappropriate with me, but I'd have no problem telling a kid, "Dude, you're creeping me out…don't ever do that again…'kay?"


Hopefully your (what I think of as) minimal attempts at self preservation in the school "jungle" are sufficient. But unfortunately this can be useless in some cases. I refer to a story a few years back, in which it was found a group of female students conspired to remove a teacher who had had grading issues on one of the student's test because of cheating. Fortunately this plot was found out in time to prevent further harm. But this points out the not-so-wonderful aspects of teaching are sometimes beyond control.

Oh, for the simpler days.