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League_Girl
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09 Mar 2014, 12:52 pm

linatet wrote:
micfranklin wrote:
I tend to go by people's exact words almost all the time, specifically for doing a certain task. In the event that they get mad because I did something wrong, I just point out it's exactly what they said.

I do it too. I say that's exactly what they said and may repeat it word by word.



I remember my old boss asking me about the rugs in the basement and I told him I don't even touch them and he said "Oh yeah that's right, you always do exactly what I say so I shouldn't even be questioning you about it." :lol:

At my old job I would be told I didn't have common sense and I needed to use it.


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League_Girl
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09 Mar 2014, 12:53 pm

delaSHANE wrote:
ImAnAspie wrote:
I'd say - if they say "Come to my house" and you don't have their address and they don't give it to you, there's a pretty good chance they don't mean it. You could freak them out by looking them up, ringing them and say, "I'm outside your house. I've come for that visit!"

That'll teach 'em!


Hahaha! Will have to log this one..!


I would tell them I don't know where they live.


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Bodyles
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09 Mar 2014, 2:27 pm

We tend to take people at their word.
Allistic people lie a lot, though.

That sucks, but what exactly are we supposed to do about it?
I just figure I'm going to get lied to a lot, and so I ask for clarification or specifics a lot of the time.
That's often sufficient to reveal the truth of the situation, and apparently it's generally ok to ask questions about what people mean when they say things.

When in doubt: ask.
Just my 2 cents... :wink:



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16 Mar 2014, 12:49 pm

I remember in my second grade Sunday school class, we were told to to write our prayer requests on little folded pieces of paper and stick them on a wire with clothespins. Every week we had to check what we wrote, and if God had answered our prayers, we were supposed to drop the prayer requests in a little bucket. I grew confused as the other kids tossed their papers into the bucket, and a little jealous; I reread my paper every week, and God never replied to 'answer' my prayer!

I was expecting God to respond to my prayer by actually writing on the paper, kind of like how you send someone a letter and expect a message from them in a few days...

Gosh dang it.


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ImAnAspie
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16 Mar 2014, 5:00 pm

Bodyles wrote:
We tend to take people at their word.
Allistic people lie a lot, though.

That sucks, but what exactly are we supposed to do about it?


Learn! I have had soooooo many fake offers and soooooo few genuine ones to lunch, visits etc. that I just assume now that "Let's go to lunch some time?" Is NT code for "I won't be seeing you for a while!"


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Gizalba
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17 Mar 2014, 8:25 am

GivePeaceAChance wrote:

I neither find it "polite" to be lied to

nor when I make a commitment to I forget it, If say I am going to do something I do it - if some emergency makes it IMPOSSIBLE then I notify everyone involved.




I feel the same as that. I now see that what linatet pointed out is true; that they don't intend to deceive, and I need to try to get used to that. I have always found it irritating when I assumed so many people were just so forgetful and not like me in the way I never say anything like that (or say I will get something done by a certain time to reassure someone etc) unless I fully intend to do what I said by writing it down if need be to make it rare that I forget. But realising that the reason for these statements seeming mysteriously careless to me may have often been because these people never meant it, rather than them just being forgetful, for some reason that makes me feel really sad. Even without the intent to deceive, I still struggle to understand how knowingly making a false statement that is not a joke, is not a lie. So yes I struggle to see it as polite even if they mean it as polite, and I struggle to imagine how it would even enter someone's head to make such a statement to 'be polite'. I've always been told I am polite so I have apparently managed to be polite without saying things I don't mean, therefore I don't see what the point is in saying things you don't mean in order to be polite, when saying those things isn't needed in order to be polite. Argh, mind f**k! Lol.



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17 Mar 2014, 3:40 pm

ImAnAspie wrote:
Learn! I have had soooooo many fake offers and soooooo few genuine ones to lunch, visits etc. that I just assume now that "Let's go to lunch some time?" Is NT code for "I won't be seeing you for a while!"

That probably explains why two guys I thought could be friend material disappeared after I said those magic words. Guess there was a hidden meaning I was not aware of! I literally meant it too!



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18 Mar 2014, 1:48 am

I still haven´t grasped, why people say "visit me", "lunch" or "Yes, you´re free to ask my advice" when in fact they don´t mean it.
What is the point????
It is a great source of frustration, and I would NEVER do that myself.


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18 Mar 2014, 5:07 am

linatet wrote:
Aprilviolets wrote:
I've always taken things literally someone would say something any I'll think they really meant it, as a child I used to get told things that would scare me.
Later they would promise something and never do it.


Quote:
I neither find it "polite" to be lied to

nor when I make a commitment to I forget it, If say I am going to do something I do it - if some emergency makes it IMPOSSIBLE then I notify everyone involved


the difference is that in this case it is neither a promise nor a lie, but a sentence that is said to be friendly. Based on the social rules they all know they expect the person to know they don't mean it. It's like a code that doesn't mean: "come to my house", but "I am being friendly". We have to learn how to decode it.


The one thing I have learnt to decode is that many of those so called friendly people will have a good laugh behind your back with those that do visit their houses.



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18 Mar 2014, 10:32 am

ImAnAspie wrote:
Bodyles wrote:
We tend to take people at their word.
Allistic people lie a lot, though.

That sucks, but what exactly are we supposed to do about it?


Learn! I have had soooooo many fake offers and soooooo few genuine ones to lunch, visits etc. that I just assume now that "Let's go to lunch some time?" Is NT code for "I won't be seeing you for a while!"


Learn what exactly?

If I have to assume everyone is lying all the time, I clearly can't having meaningful communication with anyone.
So I just take people at their word for the most part, unless something clearly seems off or I'm concerned about the specifics because whatever it is affects me directly.
All I've learned is that when I'm not sure about specifics and I feel like I really need to understand what's going on, I can ask, and that sometimes I'll get lied to anyhow.
That sort of works, but it violates the unspoken social codes to do so, to some extent at least, since I 'should just know' apparently.
It seems better to me to attempt to achieve clarity then to constantly suffer for the lack of it.

Besides, it's kind of fun to watch people squirm while trying to pin down exactly what they're saying, because often they apparently really don't want to actually say it.
It's almost like making them experience the discomfort & frustration we feel communicating with them.
I guess that sort of attitude doesn't always make friends and influence people, but whatever, I didn't make the world, I'm just trying to live & laugh a bit in it. :roll: :wink: :P :lol:



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18 Mar 2014, 10:35 pm

Bodyles wrote:
ImAnAspie wrote:
Bodyles wrote:
We tend to take people at their word.
Allistic people lie a lot, though.

That sucks, but what exactly are we supposed to do about it?


Learn! I have had soooooo many fake offers and soooooo few genuine ones to lunch, visits etc. that I just assume now that "Let's go to lunch some time?" Is NT code for "I won't be seeing you for a while!"


Learn what exactly?

If I have to assume everyone is lying all the time, I clearly can't having meaningful communication with anyone.
So I just take people at their word for the most part, unless something clearly seems off or I'm concerned about the specifics because whatever it is affects me directly.
All I've learned is that when I'm not sure about specifics and I feel like I really need to understand what's going on, I can ask, and that sometimes I'll get lied to anyhow.
That sort of works, but it violates the unspoken social codes to do so, to some extent at least, since I 'should just know' apparently.
It seems better to me to attempt to achieve clarity then to constantly suffer for the lack of it.

Besides, it's kind of fun to watch people squirm while trying to pin down exactly what they're saying, because often they apparently really don't want to actually say it.
It's almost like making them experience the discomfort & frustration we feel communicating with them.
I guess that sort of attitude doesn't always make friends and influence people, but whatever, I didn't make the world, I'm just trying to live & laugh a bit in it. :roll: :wink: :P :lol:


I agree. It is fun to watch them squirm. Sort of like catching them out on a lie.

What I meant by learn is, you know how you learn what certain body language means through experience?! I've come to learn certain offers like lunches and visits are just empty offers and treat all of them as lies with nice intentions behind them. Not malicious lies. Good intentions with no real intention to back it up. It's just something that sounds nice and friendly at the time but not really fun for either one of us in reality so it's only purpose is to make us feel good at the time with no real intention of doing it. Really doing lunch or visiting would be painful.


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Bodyles
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19 Mar 2014, 10:21 pm

ImAnAspie wrote:
Bodyles wrote:
ImAnAspie wrote:
Bodyles wrote:
We tend to take people at their word.
Allistic people lie a lot, though.

That sucks, but what exactly are we supposed to do about it?


Learn! I have had soooooo many fake offers and soooooo few genuine ones to lunch, visits etc. that I just assume now that "Let's go to lunch some time?" Is NT code for "I won't be seeing you for a while!"


Learn what exactly?

If I have to assume everyone is lying all the time, I clearly can't having meaningful communication with anyone.
So I just take people at their word for the most part, unless something clearly seems off or I'm concerned about the specifics because whatever it is affects me directly.
All I've learned is that when I'm not sure about specifics and I feel like I really need to understand what's going on, I can ask, and that sometimes I'll get lied to anyhow.
That sort of works, but it violates the unspoken social codes to do so, to some extent at least, since I 'should just know' apparently.
It seems better to me to attempt to achieve clarity then to constantly suffer for the lack of it.

Besides, it's kind of fun to watch people squirm while trying to pin down exactly what they're saying, because often they apparently really don't want to actually say it.
It's almost like making them experience the discomfort & frustration we feel communicating with them.
I guess that sort of attitude doesn't always make friends and influence people, but whatever, I didn't make the world, I'm just trying to live & laugh a bit in it. :roll: :wink: :P :lol:


I agree. It is fun to watch them squirm. Sort of like catching them out on a lie.

What I meant by learn is, you know how you learn what certain body language means through experience?! I've come to learn certain offers like lunches and visits are just empty offers and treat all of them as lies with nice intentions behind them. Not malicious lies. Good intentions with no real intention to back it up. It's just something that sounds nice and friendly at the time but not really fun for either one of us in reality so it's only purpose is to make us feel good at the time with no real intention of doing it. Really doing lunch or visiting would be painful.


Painful?
Why?
I like eating & hanging out with like minded individuals.

I have learned that, to some extent, but I generally only decide something is most likely a lie and act accordingly if the statement in question seems extremely unlikely to be true for some reason.
I guess I just can't stop myself from taking people literally & at their word most of the time.
It has something to do with my extreme aversion to lies of all kind.

I understand intellectually that they're not malicious lies, but I instinctively feel as if all lies are intrinsically wrong and should be avoided unless really necessary because lying, malicious or not, is always manipulative and I regard that type of controlling behavior as predatory at best.
The fact that many allistic people engage in this type of behavior casually and on a daily basis doesn't make it any less abhorrent in my eyes.
As for their intentions: the road to hell is paved with good intentions...