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Are you a truth seeker?
yes 74%  74%  [ 20 ]
no 26%  26%  [ 7 ]
Total votes : 27

tomato
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24 Mar 2014, 3:25 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
Its NOT a site for paranoid schzophrenics!
Maybe paranoid schizophrenia is what I have, and not Asperger. My psychiatrist said he thought I had Asperger but when I mentioned a person with schizophrenia he said that some people who were diagnosed with schizophrenia in the past would have been diagnosed with Asperger today, if I'm not mistaken. I guess it would be good to know what I classify as. Either is good. I'd be disappointed if I have no mental disorder or illness. I want to be mad. f*k normal.

edit: I might have both Asperger and schizophrenia.



Last edited by tomato on 24 Mar 2014, 3:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

tomato
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24 Mar 2014, 3:30 pm

Hopper wrote:
tomato wrote:
I wonder what the response would be if I asked the same question on a forum for stoners...


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3C9rMIRuF8[/youtube]
Haha. The reason I wonder is because I started to become more interested in these subjects after I started using cannabis. I was interested in spirituality before that too though.



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24 Mar 2014, 4:37 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
The OP should keep in mind that this is a site for autism spectrum folks.

Its NOT a site for paranoid schzophrenics!

If you find yourself a paranoid schzophrenic site you probably find many aluminum foil hat wearing enthusiats for many of the topics listed like "conspiracies", "mind control", "illuminati",and the like.


Well natural plastic ..not according to the owner of the site..although surprised ya missed the big bold letters quoted here from THIS SITE...

Quote:
Bipolar, Tourettes, Schizophrenia, and other Psychological Conditions
If you have Bipolar, Tourettes, or another condition, please make Wrong Planet your home! We welcome all neurodiverse individuals, with or without Autism! Have something other than Autism? This is your place


WHILE schizophrenia..can be a very difficult condition..IN FACT..ACCORDING..to the International Classification of Disease..the only place where Asperger's Syndrome still exists..other than the Gillberg Criteria..psychosis is a condition associated with Asperger's syndrome in young adulthood...


Just thought i'd throw that out there..in the ableist environment that sometimes this site can be..for the pecking order of disability..kinda sad in my opinion...there are lots of schizophrenic leaning folks out there..much happier than some of the folks with Asperger's syndrome..after all disability and happiness is in the eye of the 'holder'....

And yah...there have been times in my life that i prayed that i could have something..as imaginative as schizophrenia other than the dead soul that can be the condition of Asperger's...that i know all too well..the dark side of the condition..even darker than psychosis in some ways...according to some of the folks who ARE diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome..from the past...when it existed as a diagnosis in the US...

Life is a spectrum...we put labels on stuff we do not understand so easily..but it's all relative in the long run..of human existence..and what it means for purpose to be alive...i found mine..i just try help other folks find theirs..in OUT OF THE BOX...WAYS...not that dead soul stuff..that again..i'm too familiar with..from my past....

At least this guy has an open mind..and is honest..i give anyone credit for that failing human ethic..in today's society...overall...


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24 Mar 2014, 6:53 pm

Dude: being 'open minded' is one thing. Being convinced that the CIA is beaming commands into your brain via satellite is something else.

Some, but not all, of the topics in his list require a propensity to believe in improbable conspiracies-a propensity which happens to be a symptom of paranoia. So I was being a bit tongue-in-cheek by saying "this is an autistic site, and not a site for paranoids". I hope that you get that I was trying to be cheeky.

It was that 'paranoid' aspect that I was commenting on. Not the overall unorthodoxy of his interests.

The very fact that Alex has that disclaimer shows that the site is thought of mainly as an autism site.



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24 Mar 2014, 9:12 pm

Everyone comes at every subject from a position of ignorance to begin with. Why does a person who reads a book about UFO's (for example) demonstrate less discernment than a person who doesn't? How can it be self evident, from a perspective of complete ignorance, that a certain belief is unjustified?

What I don't like about this list, though, is that it puts self evident fact (conspiracy, mind control), and well justified concerns about encroaching police state (Big Brother) alongside new age stuff like 2012. These things do not belong together.



Last edited by Stannis on 25 Mar 2014, 1:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

aghogday
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25 Mar 2014, 1:16 am

naturalplastic wrote:
Dude: being 'open minded' is one thing. Being convinced that the CIA is beaming commands into your brain via satellite is something else.

Some, but not all, of the topics in his list require a propensity to believe in improbable conspiracies-a propensity which happens to be a symptom of paranoia. So I was being a bit tongue-in-cheek by saying "this is an autistic site, and not a site for paranoids". I hope that you get that I was trying to be cheeky.

It was that 'paranoid' aspect that I was commenting on. Not the overall unorthodoxy of his interests.

The very fact that Alex has that disclaimer shows that the site is thought of mainly as an autism site.


The POINT IS..YOU WERE MAKING FUN OF PARANOID SCHIZOPHRENICS..AS THROW AWAY TOYS..

THAT'S NOT COOL..AND NO MATTER HOW DAM SMART..GOOD LOOKING.. OR RICH I AM..

I'LL SPEAK UP WHEN FOLKS OPRESS WHAT THEY CONSIDER THE LESSER..

AS THE POOREST CONDITION OF ALL..
IS POOR OF SPIRIT AND EMPATHY FOR FOLKS WITH A LITTLE CHALLENGE IN LIFE..

THAT OFTEN RISE HIGHER..THAN ANY DETRACTORS...

AND I'M PROOF OF THAT..IN EVERY WAY..MY
SELF..but that's between me and GOD..for the so called 'foolish' folks who discount more than what they ARE....

And by the way the New England Journal of medicine..in a peer reviewed study..indicates a substantial percentage of the general population inherently falls prey to conspiracy theories..and that has nothing to do with the diagnosed condition of schizophrenia..alone...

And if you've checked the threads around this site..there are plenty of folks on the spectrum around here..that believe in UFO's ...Ghosts..and a plethora of super natural stuff..

And nah not me..i'm all about the Natural ...'plastic'..;)

Link to research..by the way..provided upon request..for evidence..as usual for the naysayers...:)


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25 Mar 2014, 1:25 pm

I think this thread turned into something very interesting which highlights a deep and important subject that one could easily write pages about, but not sure if I have the energy to talk much about what I feel. I feel kind of good when people call me not normal, delusional, have Asperger, schizophrenic etc. Those are all compliments... (not that people called me those things here, just saying)



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25 Mar 2014, 10:04 pm

aghogday wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Dude: being 'open minded' is one thing. Being convinced that the CIA is beaming commands into your brain via satellite is something else.

Some, but not all, of the topics in his list require a propensity to believe in improbable conspiracies-a propensity which happens to be a symptom of paranoia. So I was being a bit tongue-in-cheek by saying "this is an autistic site, and not a site for paranoids". I hope that you get that I was trying to be cheeky.

It was that 'paranoid' aspect that I was commenting on. Not the overall unorthodoxy of his interests.

The very fact that Alex has that disclaimer shows that the site is thought of mainly as an autism site.


The POINT IS..YOU WERE MAKING FUN OF PARANOID SCHIZOPHRENICS..AS THROW AWAY TOYS..

THAT'S NOT COOL..AND NO MATTER HOW DAM SMART..GOOD LOOKING.. OR RICH I AM..

I'LL SPEAK UP WHEN FOLKS OPRESS WHAT THEY CONSIDER THE LESSER..

AS THE POOREST CONDITION OF ALL..
IS POOR OF SPIRIT AND EMPATHY FOR FOLKS WITH A LITTLE CHALLENGE IN LIFE..

THAT OFTEN RISE HIGHER..THAN ANY DETRACTORS...

AND I'M PROOF OF THAT..IN EVERY WAY..MY
SELF..but that's between me and GOD..for the so called 'foolish' folks who discount more than what they ARE....

And by the way the New England Journal of medicine..in a peer reviewed study..indicates a substantial percentage of the general population inherently falls prey to conspiracy theories..and that has nothing to do with the diagnosed condition of schizophrenia..alone...

And if you've checked the threads around this site..there are plenty of folks on the spectrum around here..that believe in UFO's ...Ghosts..and a plethora of super natural stuff..

And nah not me..i'm all about the Natural ...'plastic'..;)

Link to research..by the way..provided upon request..for evidence..as usual for the naysayers...:)


Chill out dude!

Im not making fun of folks with diagnosible conditions.

Its those very folks you mention -who DONT have diagnosible conditions - but who still "fall prey to conspiracy theories" who should know better- and are being willfully ignorant and paranoid- who I am actually making fun of.

Never did get around to answering the question of whether I am a "truth seeker".

As for myself- I would call myself "an interested skeptic" in nonconventional stuff. Have flirted on and off with UFOs, Edgar Cayce, bigfoot, and the like. As a teen I read the Van Daniken "chariots" books -mainly for laughs. But I had already given myself a background in history and basic science to recognize that 90 percent of his books were BS. I consider myself to be rather open minded actually. But some folks go overboard with this stuff, and are very uncritical.



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25 Mar 2014, 10:54 pm

well..i'm glad to hear that..:)sounds reasonable to me...


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25 Mar 2014, 11:05 pm

I don't necessarily believe in all the things I read. The point is to seek. I'm a bit disappointed to see so many "skeptics" among people with Asperger/autism. In my opinion many skeptics are just like psychiatrists and many others, stuck in the paradigm. Maybe it's a matter of having to receive a gift from above.

Here's a video where a Kabbalah teacher says Jews are from another planet. He says Jews are born on Earth, look like earthlings, think like earthlings etc. having forgotten who they are. Then they receive "a call" that tells them they've got to start working. I have been thinking about the similarities between Jews and aspies. It might be that aspies walk through life trying to fit in, struggling, suffering and thinking that psychiatrists, classmates etc. are right. Then they "receive a call", i.e. psychosis/schizophrenia and that's when they "see through the matrix". Just a hypothesis. But I respect all views, "the believer's", "the skeptic's" and anyone's.

http://youtu.be/4Od3LF_opvE?t=13m16s

It's like the Truman show, kind of.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NTPpFNdca0



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26 Mar 2014, 12:18 am

tomato wrote:
I don't necessarily believe in all the things I read. The point is to seek. I'm a bit disappointed to see so many "skeptics" among people with Asperger/autism. In my opinion many skeptics are just like psychiatrists and many others, stuck in the paradigm. Maybe it's a matter of having to receive a gift from above.


1. I think we would expect to see skepticism from ASD people. Just try and convince the people here that GOD exists, and you will see a lot of skepticism. :D It may be against our nature to believe in things that have no scientific/factual evidence, and are likely not to be true.

2. It seems you feel you are borderline ASD/Schizophrenic, so I inquire here. Where does your interest in these subjects come from ? Do you feel you want to find a "hidden meaning" in things ?

3. The reason I ask is because, I can say from my own past experience:

- A person can be diagnosed with both an ASD,and delusional at the same time.
- A person can be a "high functioning delusional" person.
- A person can participate in forums like this, and generally appear to not be delusional.
- The delusional condition can affect the brain to assign a non-rational "hidden meaning" to things.

Thus, it would seem that determining your reason for "seeking the truth" would tell you more about your condition.

Examples of looking for "hidden meaning", or alternatively, "seeking the truth":
-In the movie, "Conspiracy Theory", we see the schizophrenic person search for "hidden meanings" to conspiracy ideas.
-In the movie, "A Beautiful Mind" we see the schizophrenic person become convinced that newspapers articles contained hidden meanings.
-In the tv episode of "Special Victims Unit: SVU", season 9, episode 6 "Weak" - we see a schizophrenic person who sees hidden meaning in atomic structures.

I don't think ASD people enter a state where their minds want to "seek out hidden meaning" such as the above examples. So, that is why I inquired above about why you seek the "truth", or perhaps you seek "hidden meaning".



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26 Mar 2014, 12:26 am

Skepticism should be part of the thinking processes of everyone who doesn't want to believe untrue things. It's worthwhile to be skeptical about a claim until you have sufficient evidence to make a judgement about it.

At this point in the conversation, somebody usually mentions something like, "hope," which they say is important even though there's not always a lot of evidence backing it up. That's fine. There is no skepticism police forcing you to be skeptical about everything, and hope has its place; but it's a really good idea to apply skepticism to major claims, such as god, or the moon being made out of swiss cheese. Our ideas about these things inform our actions, and we have a responsibility to others, and ourselves to make sure that our actions are not based on falsehoods, and so do not cause undesirable outcomes. If someone is going to promote the idea, for example, that vaccines contain mercury (or don't), then they had better do the research required to find out if this is actually true, because someone may listen, and we don't want them to die (right?).



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26 Mar 2014, 9:23 am

tomato wrote:
I don't necessarily believe in all the things I read. The point is to seek. I'm a bit disappointed to see so many "skeptics" among people with Asperger/autism. In my opinion many skeptics are just like psychiatrists and many others, stuck in the paradigm. Maybe it's a matter of having to receive a gift from above.

Here's a video where a Kabbalah teacher says Jews are from another planet. He says Jews are born on Earth, look like earthlings, think like earthlings etc. having forgotten who they are. Then they receive "a call" that tells them they've got to start working. I have been thinking about the similarities between Jews and aspies. It might be that aspies walk through life trying to fit in, struggling, suffering and thinking that psychiatrists, classmates etc. are right. Then they "receive a call", i.e. psychosis/schizophrenia and that's when they "see through the matrix". Just a hypothesis. But I respect all views, "the believer's", "the skeptic's" and anyone's.

http://youtu.be/4Od3LF_opvE?t=13m16s

It's like the Truman show, kind of.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NTPpFNdca0


Well Tomato..i am extremely intelligent ..extremely analytical..and there is nothing about me that is amiss..as far as my analytical abilities now..in fact they are greater than ever..as i have finally been able to fully connect my empathic side of my brain..with the analytical side..that produces much more effective short term memory capabilities..along with more coherent language speaking abilities in real life....

Seriously.. before i did that..looking back..i recognize in metaphor that i was ONLY USING..half my brain....

The metaphor of the Matrix is actually applicable..but the issue is..that our complex language..collective intelligence..and ever changing complex culture..takes us away from our instinctual nature as human beings...which is moreover empathic and movement..than abstract thought as an abstract construct generated by our thousands of years of collective intelligence and potpourri of culture...

Such as what would be the case..if a Bonobo was trapped in a classroom all his life learning sign language..and never pursued the instinctual art of movement..thereby repressing a substantial potential of the bonobo brain....or his connections with other members of his species..in development of empathic abilities...

And not only that..the sexual nature of the bonobo that comes from free interaction with other bonobos..that resolves aggression..through sexual stimulation instead of violence....

Humans are literally born into a prison of culture..not of their own evolutionary making...

This is most definitely like the Matrix or the Truman show...

You are a very perceptive and extremely intelligent person 'Tomato or 'Truman';)..by opening your mind up..and taking the 'red pill' if you will..:)

Don't be deterred by the nay sayers..that keep taking that blue pill over and over and over and over...

After all.. as one of the greatest minds of all time..Einstein..suggests..

The definition of insanity is doing the same dam thing over and over and over again..and expecting to get a different outcome or happiness where one did not have it before...

Well.. that does not appear to be your destiny...

You are one of the lucky ones..enjoy your red pill..i know i love mine in more ways than most people here could imagine..in the metaphorical half a brain..been there done it..the blue pill gets rather stale..after 5 decades...

Much better to start with the red pill..at a much younger age..to really just enjoy life...

Period...

Enjoy life..ynot..haha..i dont' give a f** or fun..whatever anyone thinks about me...

i have BLISS..who wouldn't want a path to IT...

but a 'fool' in metaphor only ...please...:)TO ONLY PLEASE OTHERS...

But any way...

Here is an excellent breakdown of the value of allegory in the movie the Matrix...

Lot of truth 'revealed' in this video..i think you'll enjoy it..:)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvKEwr0iNA0[/youtube]

There are many creative artists..doing their best to free the mind of the herd..

simply from subjugation and control..from folks who only desire materialistic gains in life..

The lazy man's way out...controlling other folks..to make 'his' living...

Instead of really working for it..in our inherent instinctual way as a human being...the one we ARE EVOLVED TO BE..not the one other folks say we are supposed to be..for THEIR BENEFIT...

THAT'S NOT CONSPIRACY..AGAIN..IT'S JUST EVOLUTIONARY BIOLOGY AND ANTHROPOLOGY..101..2...

OR WHAT IS OTHERWISE KNOWN AS COMMON SENSE..A LOST ART OF SIMPLY BEING
HUMAN...THE ONE WE ARE EVOLVED TO BE....ONE WITH A FULL 'HE ART'....PER CREATIVITY..EMPATHIC ABILITIES..AND THREE HUNDRED AND SIXTY DEGREES IN MOVEMENT..NOT JUST BEING A DAM MACHINE....WALKING ON A FRIGGIN' SIDEWALK..BRAIN WASHED BY CULTURE..AS SUCH...

AND YUP.. THAT'S ANOTHER ALLEGORY..2...

BUT I AM MORE THAN dead serious on this..as this is how is how i escaped the allegorical MATRIX THAT IS LITERALLY A REAL PHENOMENON GENERATED BY SOCIETY AS WHOLE..

BUT it is not something..organized AND CONSTRUCTED as such..it is just the way things currently work..CULTURE IS CAPRICIOUS..HUMAN NATURE...

IS NOT...

ANYMORE THAN A DAM CAT OR DOG...IT IS VERY PREDICTABLE..WHEN FREED AS SUCH....BUT IT IS BEAUTY..TAPESTRY..SEX...LOVE AND ALL THAT ESOTERIC STUFF...NOT A DAM COMPUTER PROGRAM...WITH A BLUE SCREEN... DESTINY...

ANOTHER ALLEGORY..if ya will...:)PLEASE..;)


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26 Mar 2014, 12:19 pm

Stannis wrote:
Skepticism should be part of the thinking processes of everyone who doesn't want to believe untrue things. It's worthwhile to be skeptical about a claim until you have sufficient evidence to make a judgement about it.

At this point in the conversation, somebody usually mentions something like, "hope," which they say is important even though there's not always a lot of evidence backing it up. That's fine. There is no skepticism police forcing you to be skeptical about everything, and hope has its place; but it's a really good idea to apply skepticism to major claims, such as god, or the moon being made out of swiss cheese. Our ideas about these things inform our actions, and we have a responsibility to others, and ourselves to make sure that our actions are not based on falsehoods, and so do not cause undesirable outcomes. If someone is going to promote the idea, for example, that vaccines contain mercury (or don't), then they had better do the research required to find out if this is actually true, because someone may listen, and we don't want them to die (right?).


It's a balance of both emotion and intellect..that makes the perception of Universal truth..even possible..

One does not find this path..with half a brain..in metaphor..either left and intellect or right and emotion..the balance..is the
ultimate path to truth...

But don't take my word for it..this is a Universal truth..that thousands of philosophers have and are professing throughout human history...and nah..it's just common sense..but that too..requires a balance of emotion and intellect..a mind working together..instead of against itself...

Ya see..we ourselves are always our worst potential enemy regardless of our environment....

Free WILL IS POSSIBLE..BUT IT TAKES A BALANCE OF MIND...

DETERMINISM IS ONLY THE SLAVE OF THE LEFT BRAIN IN METAPHOR...

FREEDOM..FULL HUMAN FREEDOM..AGAIN..IS IN BALANCE..

AND QUITE FRANKLY IT WILL NEVER COME..WITHOUT THE ART OF MOVEMENT AND THE MIND AND BODY..AS ONE FORCE..AN INCREDIBLY POWERFUL ONE..I DO SAY..FROM MY OWN EXPERIENCE...

SMARTER..FASTER..STRONGER..AND HAPPIER THAN EVER BEFORE...

AT AGE 53 MOVING IN ON 54..AND YES I CAN PROVE ALL OF THAT TOO..UPON REQUEST....

I PLAY BY EVIDENCE..NOT BY SUPPOSITION AND CONSPIRACY..AS I VALUE MY INTELLECT AS MUCH AS
MY HEART..AND ILLUSTRATE IT AS SUCH...

FULLY...

And nah.. this ain't all about me..but my path is the only one i fully know..so i share it as such...if i ever hope to help anyone find close to the same type of enlightenment i enjoy now..with this balance..i WORK extremely hard for..like an olympic athlete..research scientist..poet..ZEN MASTER..MARTIAL ARTIST..YOGI...ALLINONE....

MIGHT AS WELL HELP THE HERD..HUH...if i can....but i never give up..

That is my greatest asset..along with a fully open mind....body..heart..spirit..soul..and YES..BEYOND....!


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26 Mar 2014, 7:22 pm

tomato wrote:
I have been wondering if many people with Asperger or Autism are truth seekers.

Are you very interested in subjects like these listed below?

conspiracies
aliens and ufos
the esoteric/occult/mysticism
secret societies
hidden history
mind control
the new world order
the powers that be
illuminati
geo-engineering and chemtrails
the paranormal
ancient civilizations
2012
human origins
spirituality
religion
alternative media
alternative healthcare
false flags
big brother
9/11
nature of reality
hidden science


So we're not "truth seekers" if we don't put much stock in a lot of that? Because if that's the case then you are ruling out basically the whole of academia. Yes, I'm interested in those topics. However, I don't have a heavy confirmation bias that makes me put on blinders to everything the academic world has to say. When I'm told of ancient aliens and the paranormal I actually look into it beyond just pulling up a site made by it's proponents.

I can't believe how many people come to me wanting me to look at a site called something like "republicans are racist dot org" or "9/11 was a conspiracy" as if there isn't any overriding bias involved.


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26 Mar 2014, 7:34 pm

aghogday wrote:
Stannis wrote:
Skepticism should be part of the thinking processes of everyone who doesn't want to believe untrue things. It's worthwhile to be skeptical about a claim until you have sufficient evidence to make a judgement about it.

At this point in the conversation, somebody usually mentions something like, "hope," which they say is important even though there's not always a lot of evidence backing it up. That's fine. There is no skepticism police forcing you to be skeptical about everything, and hope has its place; but it's a really good idea to apply skepticism to major claims, such as god, or the moon being made out of swiss cheese. Our ideas about these things inform our actions, and we have a responsibility to others, and ourselves to make sure that our actions are not based on falsehoods, and so do not cause undesirable outcomes. If someone is going to promote the idea, for example, that vaccines contain mercury (or don't), then they had better do the research required to find out if this is actually true, because someone may listen, and we don't want them to die (right?).


It's a balance of both emotion and intellect..that makes the perception of Universal truth..even possible..

One does not find this path..with half a brain..in metaphor..either left and intellect or right and emotion..the balance..is the
ultimate path to truth...

But don't take my word for it..this is a Universal truth..that thousands of philosophers have and are professing throughout human history...and nah..it's just common sense..but that too..requires a balance of emotion and intellect..a mind working together..instead of against itself...

Ya see..we ourselves are always our worst potential enemy regardless of our environment....

Free WILL IS POSSIBLE..BUT IT TAKES A BALANCE OF MIND...

DETERMINISM IS ONLY THE SLAVE OF THE LEFT BRAIN IN METAPHOR...

FREEDOM..FULL HUMAN FREEDOM..AGAIN..IS IN BALANCE..

AND QUITE FRANKLY IT WILL NEVER COME..WITHOUT THE ART OF MOVEMENT AND THE MIND AND BODY..AS ONE FORCE..AN INCREDIBLY POWERFUL ONE..I DO SAY..FROM MY OWN EXPERIENCE...

SMARTER..FASTER..STRONGER..AND HAPPIER THAN EVER BEFORE...

AT AGE 53 MOVING IN ON 54..AND YES I CAN PROVE ALL OF THAT TOO..UPON REQUEST....

I PLAY BY EVIDENCE..NOT BY SUPPOSITION AND CONSPIRACY..AS I VALUE MY INTELLECT AS MUCH AS
MY HEART..AND ILLUSTRATE IT AS SUCH...

FULLY...

And nah.. this ain't all about me..but my path is the only one i fully know..so i share it as such...if i ever hope to help anyone find close to the same type of enlightenment i enjoy now..with this balance..i WORK extremely hard for..like an olympic athlete..research scientist..poet..ZEN MASTER..MARTIAL ARTIST..YOGI...ALLINONE....

MIGHT AS WELL HELP THE HERD..HUH...if i can....but i never give up..

That is my greatest asset..along with a fully open mind....body..heart..spirit..soul..and YES..BEYOND....!


And how do we know whether or not our sensory perceptions aren't just entirely fabricated by someone or something trying to deceive us? Or whether or not it is all an elaborate and lucid dream? What is it that makes your truth a universal truth? Because a bunch of people said so? Argumentum ad populum (appeal to the populace) doesn't really establish anything, because the populace has held wildly varying and contradictory views over time. Is the world both flat and round? Is monism or dualism the truth? Empiricism, romanticism, or rationalism? Cogito ergo sum (I think therefore I am, Descartes' first principle) or utter skepticism (like Plato's academy circa 200 AD)? What is and isn't a reasonable doubt?

You are right, you definitely do enjoy your enlightenment. But what does the mere sensation of it have to do with it's verity? What is it that makes the claims of one yogi, brahman, jainist, romanticist, or emam any more true than the others? They all claim to have very novel and compelling experiences. And what if there isn't some "evil genius" messing with your perceptions but you happen to have some fault in your brain that you haven't found yet, that distorts your perception? What then? Can a blind man tell us of the color blue? Can we experience ultraviolet light like a bee and relate that experience to others in a way that they can understand? Many hindu yogis actually describe samadha (religious epiphany) as an experience that one can't relate to others.

IMO, more people need to learn how to practice Socratic ignorance (an educated declaration of "I don't know because I don't see there being sufficient grounds for me to know").


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There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance.
Nahj ul-Balāgha by Ali bin Abu-Talib