Welcome to UKIPland- a nightmare vision of future britain

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Tequila
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27 May 2014, 6:16 pm

thomas81 wrote:
The fact that Scotland unanimously rejected the UKIP project should be a shot across your bows.


David Coburn MEP - Glasgow-born and openly gay - would love to hear you say that. He is living proof that you spout utter horse manure.



thomas81
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27 May 2014, 6:23 pm

Tequila wrote:
thomas81 wrote:
The fact that Scotland unanimously rejected the UKIP project should be a shot across your bows.


David Coburn MEP - Glasgow-born and openly gay - would love to hear you say that. He is living proof that you spout utter horse manure.


...which i suppose makes UKIP not homophobic in the same vein that the BNP aren't racist or anti semitic because they have Sikh and Jewish supporters. Can you say Turkeys voting for Christmas?

Well, now that the genie is ever more out of the bottle regarding your party's true colours we can say with no lack of confidence he will be, unlike the amount of dicey gaffes your party has made, a unique occurance.

Your councillors can only say so many racist and homophobic things before it becomes labelled a racist and homophobic party.


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Tequila
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27 May 2014, 6:45 pm

thomas81 wrote:
...which i suppose makes UKIP not homophobic in the same vein that the BNP aren't racist or anti semitic because they have Sikh and Jewish supporters. Can you say Turkeys voting for Christmas?


I have to marvel at the audacity of you lecturing me on racism!

The BNP is an avowedly racist party. They ally with open neo-Nazis. Griffin is a Holocaust denier.

UKIP is a party that is typically British, and classically liberal, in character. It is full of decent, trustworthy people that want the very best for their country. We have all kinds of people in it. The diversity of experiences is quite something.

If I was a xenophobic person, UKIP wouldn't be for me. There are foreigners everywhere in it! Even in my branch! It is quite cosmopolitan within the party. It reflects Britain in its diversity and its people. You have people sitting next to each other smiling who would have despised each other a few short years before.. Yes, there could perhaps be more voices from ethnic minorities, but I get the impression that many of them would get stick for what they believe in from the usual bigoted, unwashed, violent thugs. Love to hear a Polish (hello KNP!) or Romanian anti-EU perspective.

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Well, now that the genie is ever more out of the bottle regarding your party's true colours we can say with no lack of confidence he will be, unlike the amount of dicey gaffes your party has made, a unique occurance.

Your councillors can only say so many racist and homophobic things before it becomes labelled a racist and homophobic party.


We are embarrassed by these idiots. They let us down. We remove them.

I bet the Greens don't remove their bigots.



The_Walrus
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27 May 2014, 6:50 pm

thomas81 wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
thomas81 wrote:
I hope with every sinew of my being that Scottish independence is realised, so that we can begin the dismantlement of this unequal, forced marriage that was never intended to make the celtic constituent nations equal partners in the first place.

Like with Britain and the EU, better to be on the inside pissing out...
Think how bad the permanent Tory government would manage to screw you over.


I think the union is between the wrong nations. If I had my way, Cardiff, Edinburgh, Douglas, Belfast and Dublin would club together

Leaving the South County and the Raven King's lands to the mercy of London and its allies?



visagrunt
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28 May 2014, 8:56 am

thomas81 wrote:
I think the union is between the wrong nations. If I had my way, Cardiff, Edinburgh, Douglas, Belfast and Dublin would club together


You forgot Truro.


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thomas81
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28 May 2014, 9:51 am

Oh, here is the latest from David Coburn MEP. He is no friend of LGBT advocacy-

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/05/28/ga ... omophobia/


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thomas81
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28 May 2014, 9:52 am

The_Walrus wrote:
thomas81 wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
thomas81 wrote:
I hope with every sinew of my being that Scottish independence is realised, so that we can begin the dismantlement of this unequal, forced marriage that was never intended to make the celtic constituent nations equal partners in the first place.

Like with Britain and the EU, better to be on the inside pissing out...
Think how bad the permanent Tory government would manage to screw you over.


I think the union is between the wrong nations. If I had my way, Cardiff, Edinburgh, Douglas, Belfast and Dublin would club together

Leaving the South County and the Raven King's lands to the mercy of London and its allies?


Ok, the Cornish can join too.


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thomas81
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28 May 2014, 3:51 pm

I think UKIP have made it crystal clear they aren't friends of the LGBT community.

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/05/27/uk ... trination/

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/05/22/ei ... have-said/


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29 May 2014, 12:13 pm

It seems to me UKIP is just an extreme form of Thatcherism. She had her day, long ago and now we are seeing the failures of what she promoted.

We need a strong social base in this country, not a shrunken state.



Tequila
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29 May 2014, 1:16 pm

Robdemanc wrote:
It seems to me UKIP is just an extreme form of Thatcherism.


It's a lot of different (and sometimes contradicting!) things.

I actually think UKIP has become less Thatcherite as time has gone on. Ten years ago, it was very, very like that. Now... a bit less so.



Arran
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29 May 2014, 2:51 pm

This is all hypothetical.

Nigel Farage is not going to become PM - and he knows it.

UKIP is not going to win the next general election. They might beat the Lib-Dems in terms of votes but they will be lucky to elect even one solitary MP.

The public used the Euro elections as a referendum on immigration and the EU. National policies of UKIP were immaterial for this election.

UKIP might have entered the mainstream but it has too many shortcomings to win enough public support to topple the Labour Conservative establishment in a general election.

Economic policy lets UKIP down badly (it was born in the LSE) and the public doesn't trust them on the NHS. If UKIP economic policies were geared towards financially average people then they could be on for a winner. But will they ever be?

UKIP will only remain popular for as long as the media gives it plenty of positive coverage. If the media decides to ignore UKIP or give it bad press then it's popularity will fall like that of the BNP.

UKIP is a one man band. Not many people can name a senior member of UKIP apart from Nigel Farage.



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29 May 2014, 4:19 pm

Arran wrote:

UKIP is a one man band. Not many people can name a senior member of UKIP apart from Nigel Farage.

In fairness, most people probably couldn't name one senior Conservative.



Arran
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30 May 2014, 12:48 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
In fairness, most people probably couldn't name one senior Conservative.


Michael Gove
George Osborne
Theresa May
Iain Duncan-Smith
William Hague
Chris Grayling

I'm sure that 9 out of 10 people could come up with at least any two from this list.



The_Walrus
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30 May 2014, 4:25 pm

Arran wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
In fairness, most people probably couldn't name one senior Conservative.


Michael Gove
George Osborne
Theresa May
Iain Duncan-Smith
William Hague
Chris Grayling

I'm sure that 9 out of 10 people could come up with at least any two from this list.

I was including the Prime Minister in order to make a joke. But perhaps most people could name Michael Gove.



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31 May 2014, 7:12 am

visagrunt wrote:
Second, UKIP's performance on Thursday was not actually that brilliant.


For a political party without a single MP to take top spot in the Euro elections is hard to say is anything less than brilliant.

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But it was the LibDems who were hurt the worst--not by anything that UKIP did, but rather by their own decision to enter into a coalition and become part of the Government, rather that serving on the Opposition benches and holding the balance of power in a hung Parliament. Clegg might have legitimately believed that he could do more good as a deputy PM in a Conservative led government than he could have in holding the balance of power on a budget vote, but I'm not at all sure about that--and I think a lot of LIbDem voters in the "protest vote" camp were left with little other choice than UKIP.


Historians will look back and say that Nick Clegg destroyed the Lib-Dems but I doubt that many UKIP votes came from former Lib-Dem supporters. A much higher proportion came from people who don't normally vote. Lib-Dem voters cast their votes for Labour, Green, or stayed at home.

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Third, in a First-Past-the-Post system, UKIP are hopelessly handicapped. Their constituency is diffuse--scattered across all parts of Britain, and it isn't cohesive, drawing from conservatives and socialists alike. The issues at hand in a national election are not going to be focused on Europe--they are going to be focused on the economy; on interest rates and housing prices; on employment and benefits. Immigration issues will present some wedge, but likely not enough to translate a UKIP vote into anything other than a watering down of the margins required for the main parties to take the marginals.


There is much truth to this but it is highly likely that UKIP will come third place in about 3/4 of all English constituencies beating the Lib-Dems next general election.

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The prospect of Farage leading UKIP to anything beyond a scattering of seats in Westminster appears to be remote in the extreme. What would be far more interesting is if the Conservatives can reverse some of the rot that seems to be apparent in their support, and pull off a hung Parliament in which both the LibDems and UKIP might have some influence.


A coalition with the Lib-Dems past 2015 is out of the question because they will be slaughtered and reduced to around 5 MPs at the most. The DUP will probably be the third largest party in Westminster.



thomas81
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31 May 2014, 8:34 am

As this blog confirms, UKIP are about introducing a 'Mc Health service' which is the bane of poor and sick people in the United States. Where your entitlement to treatment is not based on need but on ability to pay.

Next time UKIP or someone who supports them tells you they are friends of the working class, wake up and smell the BS.

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