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olympiadis
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28 Aug 2014, 2:29 pm

the-comander wrote:
i really dont think most people try to imitate psycopaths, maybe you do. i sure as f**k dont, and i have yet to meet anyone else who does either.


I have in the past and I still do sometimes.
Perhaps you're thinking more of television characatures.
It seems that you do not fully understand what was being discussed here in terms of psychopathic behaviors. It does not mean that you aspire to be a serial killer, or that you show no sort of outward emotion.
As has been said by many, sociopaths and psychopaths often appear very charismatic, which may look very "normal" to you.
You have to do some reverse-engineering in order to see and analyze the algorithms that they are using.

The algorithms used will take different paths at some point based on if the person really feels an emotion, or they are simply emoting. That's even though the outward appearance may be much the same.

As an example for you, a large part of psychopathic behaviors that I observe come in the form of taking actions that harm the well-being of other living beings (real things) in order to satisfy some social expectation (an imaginary thing). If you're not looking sharp enough at your job to get ahead because of your pet fur getting on your clothes, and you then decide to take your pet to the pound, then that is psychopathic behavior.
I'm willing to bet that you see it very often and just do not realize it.



the-comander
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28 Aug 2014, 3:43 pm

vickygleitz wrote:
As a child I was treated horribly. As a young, shy, but by societys standards quite attractive, people were protective of me.

The last few years have definitely been the most perplexing. I live in a community that is almost a microcosm of society.There are a number of autistics here.They are mostly extremely introverted. I am not. When things became terribly dysfunctional here, as someone obsessed with fairness, I sufferred greatly from being an"uppity"autistic and everything about me was picked apart and judged negatively [this was the period of time that I was accused of faking cancer, even by those who had been in the hospital with me when I had my mastectomy, or been with me to chemotherapy infussions. This was at a nudist club where only 3 days after surgery people saw the tubes where my breasts had been, so everyone SAW my chest] The few people who stood up for me were pushed out.

I think that individually NTs' can be pretty awesome, but when their groups are dysfunctional, as a group they can be monsters.

did you agree to that or no?



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28 Aug 2014, 6:55 pm

There were a bunch of people who didn't believe Vicky had cancer, despite the evidence staring them in the face.



the-comander
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28 Aug 2014, 7:01 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
There were a bunch of people who didn't believe Vicky had cancer, despite the evidence staring them in the face.

what kind of situation was she living in exactly?



kraftiekortie
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28 Aug 2014, 8:19 pm

Now that....you have to ask Vicky :D



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28 Aug 2014, 8:51 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Now that....you have to ask Vicky :D

i will



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28 Aug 2014, 11:58 pm

olympiadis wrote:
the-comander wrote:
i really dont think most people try to imitate psycopaths, maybe you do. i sure as f**k dont, and i have yet to meet anyone else who does either.

As an example for you, a large part of psychopathic behaviors that I observe come in the form of taking actions that harm the well-being of other living beings (real things) in order to satisfy some social expectation (an imaginary thing). If you're not looking sharp enough at your job to get ahead because of your pet fur getting on your clothes, and you then decide to take your pet to the pound, then that is psychopathic behavior.

No, that's cruelty and callousness, but it's not necessarily outside of the boundaries of 'normal' behaviour. I personally think that we should be careful in labelling certain negative behaviours as pathological, because it suggests that anyone who's committing acts of ruthless self-preservation is doing so because there's something wrong in their head, and not due to their personality traits or them being jerks.

Life itself is a rat race, and has been long before rats even evolved. Arguably, every individual is living their lives with their own survival on their minds; some will go to greater lengths of shutting down the competition or walking all over other people to secure that goal of self-preservation and self-betterment. Others won't. The boundaries in which we operate are defined by our personal set of moral values.

Every year, people throw their dogs, cats, and rabbits out of their house because suddenly the pet doesn't fit into their household anymore for whatever reason. That's egotistical and self-serving. OTOH, it's a good thing that animal shelters have been set up in the first place; that shows another side of this 'majority NT society', one that speaks of an inherent altruism and benevolence. You have to look at both sides of the coin.

In my country as well as all over the world, it's a popular pasttime to fish. It's adverse to my personal sense of ethics; I see nothing in the act of running a hook through the lip of a random fish (tearing open the flesh of its mouth, rupturing blood vessels, and causing a risk for infections for the fish when it is thrown back into the water), but society has deemed this pastime as acceptable and enjoyable. I cringe whenever I pass someone who's fishing by the side of the water, but I know I can't call it psychopathic behaviour. They are, to all intents and purposes, operating within the bounds of psychological 'normalcy'.


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the-comander
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29 Aug 2014, 12:06 am

CyclopsSummers wrote:
olympiadis wrote:
the-comander wrote:
i really dont think most people try to imitate psycopaths, maybe you do. i sure as f**k dont, and i have yet to meet anyone else who does either.

As an example for you, a large part of psychopathic behaviors that I observe come in the form of taking actions that harm the well-being of other living beings (real things) in order to satisfy some social expectation (an imaginary thing). If you're not looking sharp enough at your job to get ahead because of your pet fur getting on your clothes, and you then decide to take your pet to the pound, then that is psychopathic behavior.

No, that's cruelty and callousness, but it's not necessarily outside of the boundaries of 'normal' behaviour. I personally think that we should be careful in labelling certain negative behaviours as pathological, because it suggests that anyone who's committing acts of ruthless self-preservation is doing so because there's something wrong in their head, and not due to their personality traits or them being jerks.

Life itself is a rat race, and has been long before rats even evolved. Arguably, every individual is living their lives with their own survival on their minds; some will go to greater lengths of shutting down the competition or walking all over other people to secure that goal of self-preservation and self-betterment. Others won't. The boundaries in which we operate are defined by our personal set of moral values.

Every year, people throw their dogs, cats, and rabbits out of their house because suddenly the pet doesn't fit into their household anymore for whatever reason. That's egotistical and self-serving. OTOH, it's a good thing that animal shelters have been set up in the first place; that shows another side of this 'majority NT society', one that speaks of an inherent altruism and benevolence. You have to look at both sides of the coin.

In my country as well as all over the world, it's a popular pasttime to fish. It's adverse to my personal sense of ethics; I see nothing in the act of running a hook through the lip of a random fish (tearing open the flesh of its mouth, rupturing blood vessels, and causing a risk for infections for the fish when it is thrown back into the water), but society has deemed this pastime as acceptable and enjoyable. I cringe whenever I pass someone who's fishing by the side of the water, but I know I can't call it psychopathic behaviour. They are, to all intents and purposes, operating within the bounds of psychological 'normalcy'.

i just think his outlook is not a healthy one.



olympiadis
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29 Aug 2014, 3:02 am

CyclopsSummers wrote:
No, that's cruelty and callousness, but it's not necessarily outside of the boundaries of 'normal' behaviour.
Every year, people throw their dogs, cats, and rabbits out of their house because suddenly the pet doesn't fit into their household anymore for whatever reason. That's egotistical and self-serving. They are, to all intents and purposes, operating within the bounds of psychological 'normalcy'.


I didn't say it wasn't considered normal. I said it was psychopathic, because it is.


One of my main points I was trying to make was that psychopathic behaviors have been normalized, and more continue to be so every day.

And yes many folks want to be careful about labeling it as what it is, because they are not comfortable about their own behaviors being labeled as such. That's your identity working to protect you.



asp123
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29 Aug 2014, 6:51 pm

yournamehere wrote:
iRunforfun wrote:
Everytime I tell an NT that I have autism, they don't believe me. I've had undiagnosed Autism for almost 23 years... therefore I've built myself a LOT of compensation mechanisms, to the point where I think I do a pretty good job of hiding my Aspie quirks... usually.

I also find NTs frustrating to speak with as they almost NEVER understand what I'm trying to say. I also find a majority of people to be oblivious, insensitive and rude. Maybe it's just an NT thing. I don't know.

I hate generalizing people though :(


I see an error.

It says your age is 22. That would mean you were undiagnosed at -1 ? :wink:


No she said for almost 23 years :lol:



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30 Aug 2014, 8:26 am

I would never reveal that I'm an aspie irl. Not even when I'm applying for a job in the future. I don't want some separate treatment. I had enough of it.
In some online games, I did so, and gladly, nothing changed.
I end up revealing it to a gifted teen from another country (Before she told me she is) who is probably understands me the most even tho we're not close as best friends. But the things I see and feel from her is almost mutual towards NT. Except, she WANTS to be a true NT, and I don't; yet it's good that we're both fine with that.
Then I revealed it to another NT girl online who is just 4 hrs away from my place; who funny enough suspected me that I'm the spectrum for a year and I end up confirming it. Just about twice or trice, she tells me about her encounters with her autie classmate.
And so on... No more than 6 people whom I know online knows I'm an aspie.

NOW FOR IRL!! !
Currently at my classes they would either; treat me like a child with a tone as if they're talking to a child; yes. If not, overestimating or patronizing me for being 'smart'. As I recall, when I enrolled at my current school, my mom mentioned things to them to the faculty. (Along with a repeated mention about me having above average IQ)
Yes, they talk with their normal voice to my peers, and not to me. I'm rather annoyed and quite feel insulted. I'm being constantly greeted; I don't know if they're just treating me because of things my mom/the faculty told them or I'm not unnoticeable enough to have any peace. Especially the fact that all I want is to sit somewhere comfortable. Then in the next second one of them will ask me the usual rhetorical questions like 'How are you' x.x
And if I speak up, they will either all go quiet as if they're excited to hear some child's cutesy words; or ignore it which is when I'm mostly serious.
They're fine with my answers 'Yes' or "No' or short answers otherwise. But apparently NOT when I'm serious as if they don't want to know. (And half the time at the serious part is when I'm ranting of how I FEEL and what I'm THINKING; which is their usual question) When I'm serious, they mostly joke about it. A tagalog-like phase saying 'My nose is bleeding/My head is overheating' which translates roughly as 'Too deep/Too much info' :?

I really feel like ranting anytime soon. :(


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30 Aug 2014, 12:45 pm

I rarely tell anyone. When I was in the hospital I told one of the staff that my jeans were too tight and she said I'm glad that you are able to recognize that. Seriously, why wouldn't I.

Other times when others have been told I notice that people start ignoring me and talk to me less.


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the-comander
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30 Aug 2014, 3:50 pm

Edna3362 wrote:
I would never reveal that I'm an aspie irl. Not even when I'm applying for a job in the future. I don't want some separate treatment. I had enough of it.
In some online games, I did so, and gladly, nothing changed.
I end up revealing it to a gifted teen from another country (Before she told me she is) who is probably understands me the most even tho we're not close as best friends. But the things I see and feel from her is almost mutual towards NT. Except, she WANTS to be a true NT, and I don't; yet it's good that we're both fine with that.
Then I revealed it to another NT girl online who is just 4 hrs away from my place; who funny enough suspected me that I'm the spectrum for a year and I end up confirming it. Just about twice or trice, she tells me about her encounters with her autie classmate.
And so on... No more than 6 people whom I know online knows I'm an aspie.

NOW FOR IRL!! !
Currently at my classes they would either; treat me like a child with a tone as if they're talking to a child; yes. If not, overestimating or patronizing me for being 'smart'. As I recall, when I enrolled at my current school, my mom mentioned things to them to the faculty. (Along with a repeated mention about me having above average IQ)
Yes, they talk with their normal voice to my peers, and not to me. I'm rather annoyed and quite feel insulted. I'm being constantly greeted; I don't know if they're just treating me because of things my mom/the faculty told them or I'm not unnoticeable enough to have any peace. Especially the fact that all I want is to sit somewhere comfortable. Then in the next second one of them will ask me the usual rhetorical questions like 'How are you' x.x
And if I speak up, they will either all go quiet as if they're excited to hear some child's cutesy words; or ignore it which is when I'm mostly serious.
They're fine with my answers 'Yes' or "No' or short answers otherwise. But apparently NOT when I'm serious as if they don't want to know.
(And half the time at the serious part is when I'm ranting of how I FEEL and what I'm THINKING; which is their usual question) When I'm serious, they mostly joke about it. A tagalog-like phase saying 'My nose is bleeding/My head is overheating' which translates roughly as 'Too deep/Too much info' :?

I really feel like ranting anytime soon. :(

people have done that to me too. sometimes ive been told its in my head but the more i hear people on sites like this say its happened to them to so i really dont think it is. you should demand the respect you deserve. people think im weird and im fine with that because i probably am but you should never let people talk down to you that way. they should treat you the same as anyone else.



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30 Aug 2014, 5:22 pm

the-comander wrote:
Edna3362 wrote:
I would never reveal that I'm an aspie irl. Not even when I'm applying for a job in the future. I don't want some separate treatment. I had enough of it.
In some online games, I did so, and gladly, nothing changed.
I end up revealing it to a gifted teen from another country (Before she told me she is) who is probably understands me the most even tho we're not close as best friends. But the things I see and feel from her is almost mutual towards NT. Except, she WANTS to be a true NT, and I don't; yet it's good that we're both fine with that.
Then I revealed it to another NT girl online who is just 4 hrs away from my place; who funny enough suspected me that I'm the spectrum for a year and I end up confirming it. Just about twice or trice, she tells me about her encounters with her autie classmate.
And so on... No more than 6 people whom I know online knows I'm an aspie.

NOW FOR IRL!! !
Currently at my classes they would either; treat me like a child with a tone as if they're talking to a child; yes. If not, overestimating or patronizing me for being 'smart'. As I recall, when I enrolled at my current school, my mom mentioned things to them to the faculty. (Along with a repeated mention about me having above average IQ)
Yes, they talk with their normal voice to my peers, and not to me. I'm rather annoyed and quite feel insulted. I'm being constantly greeted; I don't know if they're just treating me because of things my mom/the faculty told them or I'm not unnoticeable enough to have any peace. Especially the fact that all I want is to sit somewhere comfortable. Then in the next second one of them will ask me the usual rhetorical questions like 'How are you' x.x
And if I speak up, they will either all go quiet as if they're excited to hear some child's cutesy words; or ignore it which is when I'm mostly serious.
They're fine with my answers 'Yes' or "No' or short answers otherwise. But apparently NOT when I'm serious as if they don't want to know.
(And half the time at the serious part is when I'm ranting of how I FEEL and what I'm THINKING; which is their usual question) When I'm serious, they mostly joke about it. A tagalog-like phase saying 'My nose is bleeding/My head is overheating' which translates roughly as 'Too deep/Too much info' :?

I really feel like ranting anytime soon. :(


people have done that to me too. sometimes ive been told its in my head but the more i hear people on sites like this say its happened to them to so i really dont think it is. you should demand the respect you deserve. people think im weird and im fine with that because i probably am but you should never let people talk down to you that way. they should treat you the same as anyone else.


I did so whenever I'm serious. I've been asking them for a year in different ways, and nothing. All of those, same outcome. If this still keeps up, I'm moving out of that school this year after graduation (that is if I still make it until the final sem due to financial issues), get another course and pray that my mom won't tell things that would spread through the student's ears.
Or hopefully that a certain school where there's no former batchmates of mine had been there. But then again, NTs likes to spread 'stuffs'; it's how I never trust them.
I prefer them to leave me alone instead of talking to me like that everyday.


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the-comander
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30 Aug 2014, 6:52 pm

Edna3362 wrote:
the-comander wrote:
Edna3362 wrote:
I would never reveal that I'm an aspie irl. Not even when I'm applying for a job in the future. I don't want some separate treatment. I had enough of it.
In some online games, I did so, and gladly, nothing changed.
I end up revealing it to a gifted teen from another country (Before she told me she is) who is probably understands me the most even tho we're not close as best friends. But the things I see and feel from her is almost mutual towards NT. Except, she WANTS to be a true NT, and I don't; yet it's good that we're both fine with that.
Then I revealed it to another NT girl online who is just 4 hrs away from my place; who funny enough suspected me that I'm the spectrum for a year and I end up confirming it. Just about twice or trice, she tells me about her encounters with her autie classmate.
And so on... No more than 6 people whom I know online knows I'm an aspie.

NOW FOR IRL!! !
Currently at my classes they would either; treat me like a child with a tone as if they're talking to a child; yes. If not, overestimating or patronizing me for being 'smart'. As I recall, when I enrolled at my current school, my mom mentioned things to them to the faculty. (Along with a repeated mention about me having above average IQ)
Yes, they talk with their normal voice to my peers, and not to me. I'm rather annoyed and quite feel insulted. I'm being constantly greeted; I don't know if they're just treating me because of things my mom/the faculty told them or I'm not unnoticeable enough to have any peace. Especially the fact that all I want is to sit somewhere comfortable. Then in the next second one of them will ask me the usual rhetorical questions like 'How are you' x.x
And if I speak up, they will either all go quiet as if they're excited to hear some child's cutesy words; or ignore it which is when I'm mostly serious.
They're fine with my answers 'Yes' or "No' or short answers otherwise. But apparently NOT when I'm serious as if they don't want to know.
(And half the time at the serious part is when I'm ranting of how I FEEL and what I'm THINKING; which is their usual question) When I'm serious, they mostly joke about it. A tagalog-like phase saying 'My nose is bleeding/My head is overheating' which translates roughly as 'Too deep/Too much info' :?

I really feel like ranting anytime soon. :(


people have done that to me too. sometimes ive been told its in my head but the more i hear people on sites like this say its happened to them to so i really dont think it is. you should demand the respect you deserve. people think im weird and im fine with that because i probably am but you should never let people talk down to you that way. they should treat you the same as anyone else.


I did so whenever I'm serious. I've been asking them for a year in different ways, and nothing. All of those, same outcome. If this still keeps up, I'm moving out of that school this year after graduation (that is if I still make it until the final sem due to financial issues), get another course and pray that my mom won't tell things that would spread through the student's ears.
Or hopefully that a certain school where there's no former batchmates of mine had been there. But then again, NTs likes to spread 'stuffs'; it's how I never trust them.
I prefer them to leave me alone instead of talking to me like that everyday.

just dont put up with it, if they keep doing it then stop talking to them.



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30 Aug 2014, 10:40 pm

(From someone not diagnosed on the spectrum, but was referred to a specialist today because of what I told my new therapist)

In college
I was either condescended upon because of my social awkwardness and/or intensity in wanting to pursue certain goals professors didn't think were "right" for me, or patronized out the wuh-zoo. I think those who patronized me where only doing so to say "Oh, look how politically correct I am!"

I remember in my research methods class we were assigned descriptive studies to complete at the end of the semester. I chose "dolphin laterality" (You weren't even going to the aquatic park to watch the dolphins in person. You were coding videos that probably were already coded...) but my professor emailed me back saying I was going to code children's clothing for age-inappropriate sexuality. She said in the email that it was "for the greater good." I remember feeling so enraged that the girl who was assigned the project on dolphin laterality pretty much took a sh_t on it, falling behind, faking personal emergencies for assignment and draft extensions (I was friends with her on FB and did spot some inconsistencies), and ultimately getting a C as her final grade. I was livid, and was sure to let everyone I knew of how wrong it was. The student was the professor's neighbor and they went to the same church, but I think it's wrong that she got a project she showed herself incapable of completing. I never did have a good relationship with that department at college anyway...

In a lot of ways I felt like I was a pet to some people so they could get their egos fed by my coming to them for advice and mentorship. They didn't sincerely care about me but only said nice things because I wasn't a particularly liked student by some faculty and this was probably a way to get me to stop complaining.

At jobs:

Bewilderment at my behaviors and occasional irritability, but because I've consistently been a good employee, I've never been terminated. I was a waitress and blew up at someone who accused me of stealing money off the other waitresses' tables, but even after the things I called her in front of all the guests, my boss called me up asking me to please come back and that I can still keep my job. I said no because she still worked there. He asked me at one point if I had Asperger's and I told him I didn't think so, but he told me if there is a time when I'm just too overwhelmed by the noise and people in general, to just let him know and I can chop vegetables in the back. He then joked that I was some "savant" for no reason, and I was annoyed with him frequently.

My boss suggested I at least talk to a counselor to sort some baggage out. She comments often over my "useful ability to ferret and memorize crucial information." Sometimes she would drive to some meetings with me in the car and often ask, "Are you anxious? Does the way I brake make you anxious?" No, it doesn't...