Linux users-how did you not give up in frustration?

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InTheDeepEnd
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04 Sep 2014, 11:45 am

I'm trying to learn Linux...again. It's so frustrating, just like last time. Can anyone give me any advice or encouragement? Every time I want to do something I have to stop and learn how to do a bunch of other stuff that has to be done before I can do the original thing I wanted to do. I'm lucky if I don't forget what that original thing was after several hours or days of backtracking. Then there's the different favors of Linux which have slightly different ways of doing things, and it's frustrating to find the correct instructions for what I'm using (CentOS, based on Red Hat). How did you stick with it?



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04 Sep 2014, 12:00 pm

I gave up on installing Ubuntu several times over the last few years due to problems getting various drivers and the OS working properly with my hardware.

I recently installed Kubuntu on this laptop and it went on fine first time, no problems. I also installed it on a Windows 8.1 (spit) computer and had some driver problems with the WiFi but a knowledgeable friend managed to sort the problems for me and that computer is now running Kubuntu fine too.

The change from Windows to Kubuntu isn't really presenting me with many problems. As I'm still on the learning curve I often have to google stuff but there is generally the relevant information out there if you need it; either with installing non-standard programs such as Skype or TrueCrypt or doing some complex file manipulation at the command line.

I used to run many of my own programs under windows and as I can't readily port those to Linux, I'll be rewriting those in C++ so the bottom line appears to be that I can do as much as I used to do under Windows and not have to put up with licensing issues or an out of date operating system or a crap user interface (Windows 8.1) and of course there isn't all that virus hassle.


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04 Sep 2014, 12:51 pm

For me, Linux is a kind of academic pursuit; I love being able to share open source with anyone who's interested and I know my BASH/device modding ability will only become more imperative with time. I continue my work because as unpopular as such machinery is right now, in my life, free tech support is an ironically simple means of showing that I care about people. Open source is what the world needs, who are we to deny the world our data and abilities?


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04 Sep 2014, 1:11 pm

The best way to learn Linux is to find an actual reason to use Linux. For me, that reason was low-level programming, but other reasons can be server management, building your own embedded system, and so on. Any reason to install Linux in the first place, is also a reason to install an Arch Linux-based or Slackware-based distro instead of Ubuntu. :)


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TallyMan
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04 Sep 2014, 1:16 pm

Kurgan wrote:
Any reason to install Linux in the first place, is also a reason to install an Arch Linux-based or Slackware-based distro instead of Ubuntu. :)


Why do you say that? What are the main differences between them? I'm still a Linux noob.


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Kurgan
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04 Sep 2014, 2:31 pm

TallyMan wrote:
Kurgan wrote:
Any reason to install Linux in the first place, is also a reason to install an Arch Linux-based or Slackware-based distro instead of Ubuntu. :)


Why do you say that? What are the main differences between them? I'm still a Linux noob.


Bare-bones no-frills distros are easier to customize, mistakes are easier to correct, you don't have to install anything you don't need, they're always more stable, they're faster, and they can still do anything the more feature-complete distros do if you install extra content (without any of the drawbacks you typically get in the more complete distros). :) Nevertheless, they still come with a builtin C compiler.

Arch Linux is a rolling release, so if you want to upgrade the kernel, you simply need to type a single line in the terminal; in the case of Debian based distros, you have to wait until the next release to do so.


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04 Sep 2014, 6:55 pm

I feel like asking Windows users the same question.



1024
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04 Sep 2014, 8:44 pm

If you have hardware problems, it helps to check Linux support before buying hardware. Other than that, it shouldn't be harder than other OSs for common desktop use, other than having to relearn a few things which are different.

I use Linux because I feel more in control of the system, it has a number of features not available on other systems (such as many KDE features), and I like to use the command line (though that can be replicated by Cygwin on Windows to some extent).

I don't think "no frills" is an advantage, particularly to a new user. I like to be able to configure certain things through config files. But in other cases, when I rarely change the settings and I don't have special needs, I don't want to have to learn to configure it manually. I use openSUSE, where a graphical config tool is available for pretty much everything.


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04 Sep 2014, 8:50 pm

The first time I tried Linux at school, I opened a file manager (it happened to be Nautilus on GNOME). I wanted to look around, so I typed C: in the address bar. Error.

Second try: I typed a web address in the Nautilus address bar. Error. (That worked on Windows that time. Incidentally, it would've worked in Konqueror too.) I left it alone for some time.

Next time I reading the then-current SUSE handbook, and the things were clear after a few pages.


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TallyMan
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05 Sep 2014, 3:07 am

Kurgan wrote:
TallyMan wrote:
Kurgan wrote:
Any reason to install Linux in the first place, is also a reason to install an Arch Linux-based or Slackware-based distro instead of Ubuntu. :)


Why do you say that? What are the main differences between them? I'm still a Linux noob.


Bare-bones no-frills distros are easier to customize, mistakes are easier to correct, you don't have to install anything you don't need, they're always more stable, they're faster, and they can still do anything the more feature-complete distros do if you install extra content (without any of the drawbacks you typically get in the more complete distros). :) Nevertheless, they still come with a builtin C compiler.

Arch Linux is a rolling release, so if you want to upgrade the kernel, you simply need to type a single line in the terminal; in the case of Debian based distros, you have to wait until the next release to do so.


There are a few things so far I dislike about Kubuntu:
(1) Desktop search. I don't want that, full stop. For one thing it seemed to slow down my computer and secondly and more importantly, I don't want it listing sensitive documents inside my TrueCrypt directories thank you very much (banking, financial, password lists and personal docs). Discovered that I could simply disable desktop search in the system settings.

(2) Next I noticed the recently used files list as shown in Dolphin also liked to list my sensitive documents (and Playboy's calender collection JPG files etc :lol: ). That was harder to get rid of. There is a setting to stop Dolphin showing the recent files list but not to stop the "spy" list being created. Turns out there is no way to turn off this unwanted feature and after some Google searches discovered a crude way of wrecking the functionality by deleting the file that stores this list (recently-used.xbel) and creating a directory with the same name to prevent the list being created again.

(3) There still remains at least one more bastion of unwanted tracking in the Kickoff menu, but I haven't discovered how to disable/kill the "Recently Used" functionality there yet.

I dislike systems that keep a track/log of what I'm doing on my own computer. There is no need for it and find it intrusive. Windows is terrible for logging everything users do; I'm disappointed that Kubuntu thought it necessary to include this functionality too; especially with no apparent settings to turn these unwanted features off.

I've heard that Ubuntu is even worse than Kubuntu in that it passes users desktop searches to Amazon first!

Do Arch Linux / Slackware also come with user tracking features, logging what files you've accessed recently and where they are or what applications you've been using?


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05 Sep 2014, 6:18 am

Going back to Windows after some time without using it is indeed frustrating :)


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05 Sep 2014, 6:39 am

TallyMan wrote:
There are a few things so far I dislike about Kubuntu:
(1) Desktop search. I don't want that, full stop. For one thing it seemed to slow down my computer and secondly and more importantly, I don't want it listing sensitive documents inside my TrueCrypt directories thank you very much (banking, financial, password lists and personal docs). Discovered that I could simply disable desktop search in the system settings.

(2) Next I noticed the recently used files list as shown in Dolphin also liked to list my sensitive documents (and Playboy's calender collection JPG files etc :lol: ). That was harder to get rid of. There is a setting to stop Dolphin showing the recent files list but not to stop the "spy" list being created. Turns out there is no way to turn off this unwanted feature and after some Google searches discovered a crude way of wrecking the functionality by deleting the file that stores this list (recently-used.xbel) and creating a directory with the same name to prevent the list being created again.

(3) There still remains at least one more bastion of unwanted tracking in the Kickoff menu, but I haven't discovered how to disable/kill the "Recently Used" functionality there yet.

I dislike systems that keep a track/log of what I'm doing on my own computer. There is no need for it and find it intrusive. Windows is terrible for logging everything users do; I'm disappointed that Kubuntu thought it necessary to include this functionality too; especially with no apparent settings to turn these unwanted features off.

I've heard that Ubuntu is even worse than Kubuntu in that it passes users desktop searches to Amazon first!

Do Arch Linux / Slackware also come with user tracking features, logging what files you've accessed recently and where they are or what applications you've been using?


I recommend Antergos, which is based on Arch Linux. This comes with Cinnamon (although Wine, AppArmor, and so on, you need to install manually), and if you liked Windows XP back in the days, you'll love this interface. It looks sleek and modern, but without any of the Godawful dropshadows, blur effects, or "hey, look at me! I have a GPU" effects of Windows Aero.

1. The desktop search in Cinnamon is located on the start menu, but you don't have to use it. You can file browse manually instead.

2/3. You can turn this off in Cinnamon. Cinnamon was made with userfriendliness in mind. :)

As a bonus: Antergos has tap-to-click disabled by default.


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05 Sep 2014, 7:02 am

Kurgan wrote:
I recommend Antergos, which is based on Arch Linux. This comes with Cinnamon (although Wine, AppArmor, and so on, you need to install manually), and if you liked Windows XP back in the days, you'll love this interface. It looks sleek and modern, but without any of the Godawful dropshadows, blur effects, or "hey, look at me! I have a GPU" effects of Windows Aero.

1. The desktop search in Cinnamon is located on the start menu, but you don't have to use it. You can file browse manually instead.

2/3. You can turn this off in Cinnamon. Cinnamon was made with userfriendliness in mind. :)

As a bonus: Antergos has tap-to-click disabled by default.


The Kubuntu GUI doesn't really bother me to be honest. I couldn't figure out why there was a small empty panel sitting on the desktop so got rid of that. Also by default there was a god awful bouncing icon while it opened an application on the desktop; made me feel seasick so changed that to a static icon. Other than that I can live with the GUI. I'm more interested in functionality and also getting rid of unwanted functionality. I've told Kubuntu to ignore my mouse-pad while a real mouse is plugged in which is great as I never use the pad. I turned off the feature to fade the display when the computer has been left a while because on one occasion it didn't restore the brightness again after I started using the computer again and I had to reboot. I'm more interested in ridding the computer of user tracking/logging features like the recently used files and programs lists. Beyond that most of the programs I need are available and those that aren't I'll program myself, as I did under Windows.


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05 Sep 2014, 10:17 am

TallyMan wrote:
Do Arch Linux / Slackware also come with user tracking features, logging what files you've accessed recently and where they are or what applications you've been using?

I suspect these things depend more on the file manager/desktop environment. Except the Amazon thing; I wouldn't trust anything coming from Canonical after that stuff.


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Kurgan
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05 Sep 2014, 1:13 pm

TallyMan wrote:
Kurgan wrote:
I recommend Antergos, which is based on Arch Linux. This comes with Cinnamon (although Wine, AppArmor, and so on, you need to install manually), and if you liked Windows XP back in the days, you'll love this interface. It looks sleek and modern, but without any of the Godawful dropshadows, blur effects, or "hey, look at me! I have a GPU" effects of Windows Aero.

1. The desktop search in Cinnamon is located on the start menu, but you don't have to use it. You can file browse manually instead.

2/3. You can turn this off in Cinnamon. Cinnamon was made with userfriendliness in mind. :)

As a bonus: Antergos has tap-to-click disabled by default.


The Kubuntu GUI doesn't really bother me to be honest. I couldn't figure out why there was a small empty panel sitting on the desktop so got rid of that. Also by default there was a god awful bouncing icon while it opened an application on the desktop; made me feel seasick so changed that to a static icon. Other than that I can live with the GUI. I'm more interested in functionality and also getting rid of unwanted functionality. I've told Kubuntu to ignore my mouse-pad while a real mouse is plugged in which is great as I never use the pad. I turned off the feature to fade the display when the computer has been left a while because on one occasion it didn't restore the brightness again after I started using the computer again and I had to reboot. I'm more interested in ridding the computer of user tracking/logging features like the recently used files and programs lists. Beyond that most of the programs I need are available and those that aren't I'll program myself, as I did under Windows.


Antergos lets you use KDE and Gnome as well. :) If you install it inside VirtualBox and try it, I can almost guarantee that you'll like it.


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05 Sep 2014, 3:06 pm

InTheDeepEnd wrote:
I'm trying to learn Linux...again. It's so frustrating, just like last time. Can anyone give me any advice or encouragement? Every time I want to do something I have to stop and learn how to do a bunch of other stuff that has to be done before I can do the original thing I wanted to do. I'm lucky if I don't forget what that original thing was after several hours or days of backtracking. Then there's the different favors of Linux which have slightly different ways of doing things, and it's frustrating to find the correct instructions for what I'm using (CentOS, based on Red Hat). How did you stick with it?


First off what are you trying to do with Linux? Replacement for Windows? Server admin?

If for Windows replacement, you will find the workflow of the KDE to be quite similar. Conversely, If you're used to the workflow of a Mac, you will find the workflow of GNOME 2.x/MATE desktop to be quite similar.

The /home directory is much the same as 'My Documents' directory in Windows, and MacHD in Macintosh.

Fonts, Desktop wallpapers, themes and such live in /usr/share. paths to binary files always point to /usr/bin/*application name*.

One thing that may be new to you is having a root account that you hardly ever login to other than to install stuff directly to the /usr directories, and setting permissions on the files and directories that you install. --Everything else can be done via the 'sudo' command, and entering you password.

Also, if you're using CentOS as a Windows or MacOS replacement, you've made a bad choice, as CentOS is essentially a free version of Red Hat Enterprise Linux, which is geared more for corporate usage. You'd be better off using Ubuntu, or Ubuntu 'Spins' such as LinuxMint, or if you prefer the stability, Debian stable,(currently 'Wheezy') or spins on debian such as KWheezy (KDE Desktop), or PointLinux with MATE.

Whatever distro that you use, you will usually find support forums for. Use these ofrums, and use the search function on the forums to get answers to whatever it is you want to do.


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