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techstepgenr8tion
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13 Sep 2014, 12:28 pm

I might suggest that all the holy books and major religious currents are from God.

Zoroastrianism seems to be the flavor that seeded the Abrahamic religions, the later also took on a great deal of Egyptian, Canaanite, and Babylonian mythos - add to that Greek neoplatonism by way of John. Islam seems to sit somewhere between Judaism and Christianity with a streamlined likeness of the Levitical laws and a lot of the 'mercy for believers' that was in mainstream Christianity but with it being direct to the Father rather than the Son (ie. no Tiphareth).

In the East you have Hinduism and Buddhism as the main contenders being more essentially mystic in their basis. The only places where you really see ideas of reincarnation, spiritual evolution, and a Great Work such as outlines in the east are by way of the mystic traditions of the west such as Kabbalism, more general Hermeticism, Rosicrucianism (really a form of the later) and Sufism which in its organized form is a bit like an Islamic Hermeticism.

When one reads the writings of John of the Cross like Dark Night of the Soul or Ascent of Mt. Carmel and then holds these writings up against those from the east like Yoga Aphorisms of Patanjali one sees that they're essentially talking about the same thing and that same thing is a creed-buster, ie. it ignores sectarianism. I think Louis Claude de Saint-Martin put it best when he said that mystics are from the same country (and speak the same language), that seems to hold pretty true.



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13 Sep 2014, 1:51 pm

Jono wrote:
Did you actually create that image. I could of sworn that the names of the threads mentioned in that picture are the exact threads that appeared on WP in the PPR forum.

Of course I did. That was the point... :wink:



0_equals_true
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13 Sep 2014, 1:55 pm

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aghogday
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13 Sep 2014, 8:51 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
I might suggest that all the holy books and major religious currents are from God.

Zoroastrianism seems to be the flavor that seeded the Abrahamic religions, the later also took on a great deal of Egyptian, Canaanite, and Babylonian mythos - add to that Greek neoplatonism by way of John. Islam seems to sit somewhere between Judaism and Christianity with a streamlined likeness of the Levitical laws and a lot of the 'mercy for believers' that was in mainstream Christianity but with it being direct to the Father rather than the Son (ie. no Tiphareth).

In the East you have Hinduism and Buddhism as the main contenders being more essentially mystic in their basis. The only places where you really see ideas of reincarnation, spiritual evolution, and a Great Work such as outlines in the east are by way of the mystic traditions of the west such as Kabbalism, more general Hermeticism, Rosicrucianism (really a form of the later) and Sufism which in its organized form is a bit like an Islamic Hermeticism.

When one reads the writings of John of the Cross like Dark Night of the Soul or Ascent of Mt. Carmel and then holds these writings up against those from the east like Yoga Aphorisms of Patanjali one sees that they're essentially talking about the same thing and that same thing is a creed-buster, ie. it ignores sectarianism. I think Louis Claude de Saint-Martin put it best when he said that mystics are from the same country (and speak the same language), that seems to hold pretty true.


I agree, and truly the problem is folks believing they have the final answer or their man, is the man, if you will, per Jesus being the only begotten son of God or Mohammad being the last prophet because someone said it is so, etc. etc., or stipulations that if any words are added to a text in the future, there will be 'hell' to pay.

The Quran in a lot of ways was ahead of its time back 1400 hundred years ago, given all of cultures everywhere in the world, but taking wisdom there and leaving it as is, considering how big GOD is, is selfish, not rational, and truly with no true respect of ALL IT IS aka GOD; we can only hope to approximate IT and act to the best of all human being interest.

Truth rings true no matter who, when, or where it was and is 'concepted'. The issue is seeking it and finding it and discerning it as truth, as well as continuing to seek new truths.

There are more resources for that than ever with Internet and free flow of information. Many minds working together are certainly greater than a few or one mind working alone and the Internet provides a world wide avenue for synergy of human intelligence, intuition, feeling, and all the other vital human being attributes.

In my opinion, given that fact and true freedom of expression in the wild on the Internet, it will not be long before some amazing new truths are discovered and perhaps conceptualized in a way, that even the common man can understand, and perhaps conceptualized in a manner that is not even verbal, as there is much more to conceptual reality than verbal language.

And of course that's already true for those of us who have sought and found them, and put them into practice in our lives to do amazing things. It's hard enough to share that, now; so obviously, no matter what, lots of folks will be left in the metaphorical dark or cold of life, most sadly of all.

It's hard not to share the mysteries of life, once one truly finds them and puts them into action for an amazing life, but at times I wonder why even try. But it seems like it is part of the whole package as a requirement to share Universal truth for those who find them, to be in a place where they must share them, once found.

Yes, God works in mysterious ways, but yes the GOD of nature works; I definitely know that much to be true, by example of my own life. The one I know the best, of course.


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azaam
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13 Sep 2014, 10:27 pm

TallyMan wrote:
azaam wrote:
scientific evidence the Quran is from God


You have a pretty poor comprehension of what constitutes empirical scientific evidence. Have you ever studied any science?

There are still Muslims who think the earth is flat because that is what is implied in your Quran:

Image

The Quran, Bible, Torah, Upanishads, etc are all mythology, written by man. They are no more credible than the tales of Zeus or Odin. End of story.


I have read the Quran more than you can imagine and I have yet to stumble upon 1 contradiction, errors, or verses about the earth being flat.


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14 Sep 2014, 4:06 am

azaam wrote:
TallyMan wrote:
azaam wrote:
scientific evidence the Quran is from God


You have a pretty poor comprehension of what constitutes empirical scientific evidence. Have you ever studied any science?

There are still Muslims who think the earth is flat because that is what is implied in your Quran:

Image

The Quran, Bible, Torah, Upanishads, etc are all mythology, written by man. They are no more credible than the tales of Zeus or Odin. End of story.


I have read the Quran more than you can imagine and I have yet to stumble upon 1 contradiction, errors, or verses about the earth being flat.


Then read that link I posted on page 1... it shows the Quran is full of errors, ignorance and misconceptions. Here it is again:
http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran


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0_equals_true
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14 Sep 2014, 5:46 am

Here's betting he won't read it, and compare to source.

I love the bit about Mary being Moses's sister, despite 1500 year gap.

Any time anyone public disputes the immutability of the Quran, there are violent riots. Because you that is a normal thing to do...



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14 Sep 2014, 6:10 am

Azzaam I recommend reading the work of Turan Dursun, who was a mufti, who studied the the history monotheistic regions. I also suggest you read up on Ibn al-Rawandi.



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14 Sep 2014, 8:31 am

0_equals_true wrote:
Azzaam I recommend reading the work of Turan Dursun, who was a mufti, who studied the the history monotheistic regions.


Turan Dursun was murdered, don't forget, by Islamists.



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14 Sep 2014, 2:51 pm

Tequila wrote:
0_equals_true wrote:
Azzaam I recommend reading the work of Turan Dursun, who was a mufti, who studied the the history monotheistic regions.


Turan Dursun was murdered, don't forget, by Islamists.


I was aware of that. The reason why I mentioned him rather than other atheists, is he was an Islamic scholar from conservative beginnings an became an atheist though his religious studies, and his life story is remarkable. Rather than just a middle class, bloke from Istanbul who happened to be Muslim.



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14 Sep 2014, 3:18 pm

I know Frederik is real, I'm cuddling him right now. He is a modest god though, with no claims to creating worlds. I love him anyways. <3


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14 Sep 2014, 5:04 pm

I don't see any of those quotes supporting the big bang. People today may equate the Heavens to the sky. But back in Mohammed's day, Heaven was believed to be a physical place. So first you need to show me physically where heaven is.



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15 Sep 2014, 6:03 am

0_equals_true wrote:
I was aware of that. The reason why I mentioned him rather than other atheists, is he was an Islamic scholar from conservative beginnings an became an atheist though his religious studies, and his life story is remarkable. Rather than just a middle class, bloke from Istanbul who happened to be Muslim.


azzam doesn't sound like the kind of man that will see reason.

I think your quest of being reasonable with unreasonable (no matter how nicely that unreasonability is) people will always prove fruitless.

Yer man will have to find his own way out. If there is no mistakes in Quran, there are no mistakes in it. Something else will have to drive his thirst for knowledge.

I wonder if he could find me a flying horse. I need to do some shopping.



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15 Sep 2014, 1:45 pm

drh1138 wrote:
When are the evangelical Satanists going to make one of these threads?

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cku497rURF8[/youtube]


^My second favorite Mr Show sketch. Just behind the Lie Detector sketch.


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0_equals_true
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15 Sep 2014, 1:47 pm

tuffy wrote:
I know Frederik is real, I'm cuddling him right now. He is a modest god though, with no claims to creating worlds. I love him anyways. <3


This thread is to do with Islam and Science, your post is about neither.



Last edited by 0_equals_true on 15 Sep 2014, 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

0_equals_true
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15 Sep 2014, 1:51 pm

Tequila wrote:
azzam doesn't sound like the kind of man that will see reason.

I think your quest of being reasonable with unreasonable (no matter how nicely that unreasonability is) people will always prove fruitless.

Yer man will have to find his own way out. If there is no mistakes in Quran, there are no mistakes in it. Something else will have to drive his thirst for knowledge.

I wonder if he could find me a flying horse. I need to do some shopping.


Nevertheless, I have to give him the opportunity to learn another side.