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beneficii
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02 Oct 2014, 1:23 pm

Feralucce wrote:
I didn't misrepresent anything. you called me a liar.

Please stop. I am not debating... When someone tells you that you won the argument, accept it with grace...

Thank you, however, for showing me that I need to be offplanet.


If you say I had won, then why did you say you continued to disagree?

I would think that in a debate over a fact, the winner should convince the loser.

Alas, that rarely happens on the Internet, allowing much misinformation to persist!


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Feralucce
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02 Oct 2014, 1:29 pm

Were it not an argument, i would agree... but an argument, according to my NT consultants, does not have the goal of convincing...

I was editing my post when you responded... please go look...


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beneficii
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02 Oct 2014, 1:50 pm

Feralucce wrote:
Were it not an argument, i would agree... but an argument, according to my NT consultants, does not have the goal of convincing...

I was editing my post when you responded... please go look...


Ah, yes, those NT consultants, they can wreck up a lot on this planet!

Anyway, I see your edit, and see that there are researchers who disagree that autism and schizophrenia can be truly comorbid. I take back my calling you a liar and my respect for you is restored, since I see that you were referring to sources beyond the 3 I thought you were referring to.

And I think it is an interesting point. I myself have a professional source that disagrees that autism and schizophrenia can be truly comorbid. I won't reveal her name, since she was simply giving an opinion, but in her opinion, and this is someone who has published much research into schizophrenia, those autistic-like people who score high on the Examination of Anomalous Self-Experience (EASE), which measures self-disorders, should actually be given a schizophrenia spectrum diagnosis instead. She's seen cases of, say, Asperger's syndrome that turned into schizophrenia and in her opinion such person was schizophrenic all along; they just looked like they had Asperger's syndrome, but weren't investigated thoroughly enough and with the right tools.

BTW, here is a link to the EASE, which measures self-disorders (basically, together, they are "a disorder or deficiency in the sense of being a subject, a self-coinciding center of action, thought, and experience"):

http://www.nordlandssykehuset.no/getfil ... r/EASE.pdf

Considering I developed psychosis at age 14, and my experience of it matches many of the descriptions of the experience of schizophrenia given by phenomenological researchers; there was evidence of perceptual distortion and cognitive disorganization at age 8; and I identify with many of the self-disorders listed, I myself wonder if I am truly autistic and not on the schizophrenia spectrum. But, alas, our current classification schemes don't recognize such distinctions, so with ASD, wondering what the heck that all was at 14 and if it can happen again, along with gender dysphoria I go!

(Nevertheless, given the current scheme, if a doctor hands out both an ASD and schizophrenia diagnosis to a patient, that shouldn't throw into question their competency. They could just be working within the scheme.)


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Feralucce
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02 Oct 2014, 10:09 pm

And we disagree... Please let me do so.


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beneficii
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03 Oct 2014, 12:03 am

Feralucce wrote:
And we disagree... Please let me do so.


Disagree about what? What are you talking about? Please be specific.


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Feralucce
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03 Oct 2014, 12:10 am

that's it. I am done with wrong planet. I am gonna lock it out of my router.


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beneficii
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03 Oct 2014, 12:12 am

Feralucce wrote:
that's it. I am done with wrong planet. I am gonna lock it out of my router.


Bye.

EDIT: BTW, for future advice, if you disagree with what someone said on something, but aren't interested in discussion about it, then simply don't bring it up. By stating you disagree, you invite discussion. This is true everywhere, not just on Wrong Planet.


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Aspiewordsmith
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23 Nov 2014, 12:00 pm

Did you know thar delusions/hallucinations can be explained also by temporal lobe epilepsy? but that would need a neurologist to prove it's epilepsy, because temporal lobe epilepsy can also be mistaken for schizophrenia. :arrow:



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23 Nov 2014, 1:20 pm

Documented; only AS and ADD.

Undocumented it gets a bit trickier. I've shown traits of antisocial personality disorder, narcissistic personality disorder, PTSD, depression and a bit of body dysmorphic disorder.

They're all undocumented since they're all quite reactive in that I'm totally fine with most of my impairments the way I live my life now. I mean, yes I'm quite antisocial, but as long as I don't have to interact with people I'm totally fine. It's when I must, where it's obvious I'm perhaps a bit to toxic to put in there. PTSD for me has been an issue after my one short stint of employment and while it's not that I suffer from PTSD issues as such in my daily life, it makes me reluctant to go through that entire process again (which is also why my current documentation for workplace adjustments has quite some extensive adjustments noted in terms of social interaction, the do's and and don't and more of that kind). In short; me getting a job is me expecting to get socked in the face on a daily basis.

In the past I've been partially sidelined with a burnout within the first 6 months of employment.

Said PTSD issues probably stem partially from a combination of things; In sense my aspieness might act up in that I'm just weird to work with in general, but if you add up forced social interaction according to certain "rules" (which might or might not even be clear because of AS) and dealing with someone telling you what to do (never tell a narccisist what to do)... one might also wonder how much these personality disorders developed because of AS and living in your own world and being extensively bullied in the past.

If I were to dig in deep and find every possible thing that's being perceived as "wrong" or a "disorder" I'm probably up for a one way trip to the funny farm for a permanent stay.



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23 Nov 2014, 2:36 pm

Feralucce wrote:
beneficii wrote:
Feralucce wrote:
I recommend a new Psych. According to diagnostic criteria, schizophrenia and autistic spectrum disorders are mutually exclusive diagnoses.

Autism does not come with schizophrenia and as a matter of fact according to both the DSM-IV and ICD-10, the diagnoses are mutually exclusive: ?criteria are not met for another specific Pervasive Developmental Disorder or schizophrenia?, as stated in the DSM-IV.


Actually, they can be comorbid. If the patient develops the ASD first, and then later develops schizophrenia, they can be comorbid. It's only that once a patient develops schizophrenia then they cannot develop an ASD afterwards (as the symptoms would be considered to be "explained" by the schizophrenia). The DSM, however, makes clear that for someone who already has an ASD, they must have prominent delusions and/or hallucinations for at least one month (or less if successfully treated) to be diagnosed with schizophrenia. Basically, for someone with an ASD, having just, say, disorganized speech and negative symptoms without prominent delusions or hallucinations wouldn't cut it, whereas for someone without an ASD disorganized speech and negative symptoms would be enough (provided other criteria are met). The reason is to prevent the comorbidity from being greater, because disorganized speech and negative symptoms tend to already occur to some extent in an ASD anyway, so they can be considered to be "explained" by the ASD. Prominent delusions and/or hallucinations are the only schizophrenia symptoms that cannot be explained by an ASD, so those would allow a person with ASD to be diagnosed with comorbid schizophrenia (provided all other disorders are ruled out and all the other criteria are met), in the DSM at least.


I disagree. As do my Psychiatric professional sources. The two are mutual exclusive diagnoses.



So does that mean people with ASD's cannot end up with schizophrenia?...hmm, interesting I wonder if there is a way to test this immunity. Or would it mean if someone with an ASD develops schizophrenia they don't have an ASD anymore? In which case if one could induce it they'd be cured of ASD? But then of course stuck with scizophrenia. Just doesn't seem to add up, that they'd always be mutually exclusive diagnoses with no exceptions.



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28 Nov 2014, 4:57 am

Feralucce wrote:
I recommend a new Psych. According to diagnostic criteria, schizophrenia and autistic spectrum disorders are mutually exclusive diagnoses.

Autism does not come with schizophrenia and as a matter of fact according to both the DSM-IV and ICD-10, the diagnoses are mutually exclusive: ?criteria are not met for another specific Pervasive Developmental Disorder or schizophrenia?, as stated in the DSM-IV.


I'm curious then. What would you diagnose somebody with if they had autism all along and then developed hallucinations, delusions and typical schizophrenia symptoms later on?
Would you explain that as autism turning into schizophrenia?
I have been diagnosed by both by practically every doctor I have seen. I have met a few others with similar diagnosis as well and the treatment is differe t than somebody who has autism without psychotic symptoms. Also the typical person with schizophrenia does not have the same sensory and neurological symptoms seen in autism.

All psych labels are vague terms used to catagorize symptoms to determine treatment. The actual causes for symptoms vary but it is important to look at the range of symptoms individual to each person rather than treat everybody with the same diagnosis the same.



FautheralLoather
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29 Nov 2014, 10:48 am

I also have Dysgraphia (which is a disabilitiy in writing) and it actually does exist, probably a long with a lot of learning disabilities on top of that.

I supose I can also count lacking in atteniton and sensory problems but that is a trait of autism.

I also do have a neuological tic disorder but that wasn't because of the atism, it was because I was jumped when I was around 15 or so and get occasional seizures and tics spazms and made me to go the ER a few times.

There is a lot of things wrong with me.



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30 Nov 2014, 12:02 pm

Well, a long long time ago when I was young (a child) I got diagnosed with BPD.

Then before I was diagnosed with AS and ADHD I was diagnosed with Schizotypal personality disorder.

I aslo have dyslexia.

Not sure what any of this means still, but hey.


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LokiofSassgard
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08 Dec 2014, 4:52 pm

Aside from autism, I've been diagnosed with ADHD. I also suspect that I have developmental and learning delays, but I think a lot of it could be due to my autism. Same goes for me having severe anxiety.


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Taylor1002
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05 Feb 2015, 4:29 pm

I've been diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome, inattentive ADHD, and an emotional disturbance. I don't remember which emotional disturbance I was diagnosed with, but it was recorded that it affects pragmatics the most.