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NiceCupOfTea
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24 Nov 2014, 10:16 pm

m8 = mate. Eight sounds like ate, so put m + 8 together and you've got mate.

I like and admire KoR, but if you expect me to ever be a beacon of light, you're looking to the wrong person, m8. I don't "do" being inspirational.



wozeree
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24 Nov 2014, 10:23 pm

That's not what I meant. Oh well it's not my job to tell you how to live anyway, all I meant though is that she does what she is passionate about and that's why it works for her. I wasn't telling you to follow her passion. But good luck with whatever you do!



yournamehere
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24 Nov 2014, 11:09 pm

I don't think kor is doing well. I hope I'm wrong.



B19
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24 Nov 2014, 11:41 pm

I hope she is doing well, and if not, that she soon will be doing well. Such a valued member of WP.



ASPartOfMe
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25 Nov 2014, 6:16 am

I guess Level 0 be relabeled Autistic personality, Level 1 "Asperger-Autism', Level 3 "Kanners Autism" etc


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kraftiekortie
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25 Nov 2014, 6:58 am

I'm wondering if there are people with DSM IV Asperger's who might require a level-2 level of support owing to sensory issues?



Dillogic
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25 Nov 2014, 7:33 am

People with AS could hit level 2. It all depends on how severe your restricted behaviors and social impairments are.

If you can't do almost anything but your special interest, even with help, then you're probably going to hit level 2 in that area.



Adamantium
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25 Nov 2014, 10:09 am

So I keep seeing this association between level 1 ASD and Aspergers and I keep feeling the need to correct that. In my research on ASD when my son was diagnosed, that in turn produced my strong suspicions about myself, that in turn resulted in my diagnosis, I repeatedly read that Aspergers was a spectrum with some highly functional independant people who nevertheless clearly showed the classic triad of impairments and some people who were profoundly dysfunctional and could not live without a great deal of support.

Based on that research, I feel compelled to reassert that It's just wrong to equate level 1 ASD and Aspergers.

Consider again the communication and RRIB requirements for level 2 ASD:

Quote:
Marked deficits in verbal and nonverbal social communication skills; social impairments apparent even with supports in place; limited initiation of social interactions; and reduced or abnormal responses to social overtures from others. For example, a person who speaks simple sentences, whose interaction is limited to narrow special interests, and who has markedly odd nonverbal communication.

Inflexibility of behavior, difficulty coping with change, or other restricted/repetitive behaviors appear frequently enough to be obvious to the casual observer and interfere with functioning in a variety of contexts. Distress and/or difficulty changing focus or action.


Many people with Aspergers have RRIB that are "obvious to the casual observer and interfere with functioning in a variety of contexts." Many people with Aspergers meet level 2 criteria for communication difficulties.

There are undoubtedly many people with an Aspergers diagnosis who meet level 1 criteria and also people with an Aspergers diagnosis who meet level 3 criteria, though the language criteria probably do make this a much smaller group.

But let's not be dishonest about an Aspergers diagnosis: it by no means signifies level 1 severity and there are many people with the diagnosis who are not functional without support.



r2d2
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25 Nov 2014, 10:50 am

quote"Adamantium

"So I keep seeing this association between level 1 ASD and Aspergers and I keep feeling the need to correct that..

But let's not be dishonest about an Aspergers diagnosis: it by no means signifies level 1 severity"



Actually I recall reading that the CDC positions is that those diagnosed under the DSM IV with Asperger's should be diagnosed with ASD under the DSM V - Although their recommendation does not say whether they should be diagnosed with level 1, 2 or 3. But general speaking as is pointed out by the statement from the Mayo Clinic below - Asperger's is usually thought of as the more mild form of Autism.

Note: Individuals with a well-established DSM-IV diagnosis of autistic disorder, Asperger’s disorder, or pervasive developmental disorder not otherwise specified should be given the diagnosis of autism spectrum disorder. Individuals who have marked deficits in social communication, but whose symptoms do not otherwise meet criteria for autism spectrum disorder, should be evaluated for social (pragmatic) communication disorder.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/hcp-dsm.html

And this from the Mayo Clinic:

Autism spectrum disorder (ASD) is now defined by the American Psychiatric Association's Diagnosis and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5) as a single disorder that includes disorders that were previously considered separate — autism, Asperger's syndrome, childhood disintegrative disorder and pervasive developmental disorder not otherwise specified.

The term "spectrum" in autism spectrum disorder refers to the wide range of symptoms and severity. Although the term "Asperger's syndrome" is no longer in the DSM, some people still use the term, which is generally thought to be at the mild end of autism spectrum disorder.

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-cond ... n-20021148

Here is an official CDC Video Addressing the issue:


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Adamantium
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25 Nov 2014, 11:09 am

I must have been unclear. I don't disagree that an Aspergers diagnosis is an ASD diagnosis. It's just the level 1 part that I think is misleading.

"which is generally thought to be at the mild end of autism spectrum disorder." is not supported by the cases described in the material I researched and "mild" is imprecise compared to the three level severity rating. It is quite clear that some people with aspergers should be level 2 ASD not level 1 ASD. This is the only point I wished to make.



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25 Nov 2014, 11:14 am

Adamantium wrote:
I must have been unclear. I don't disagree that an Aspergers diagnosis is an ASD diagnosis. It's just the level 1 part that I think is misleading.

"which is generally thought to be at the mild end of autism spectrum disorder." is not supported by the cases described in the material I researched and "mild" is imprecise compared to the three level severity rating. It is quite clear that some people with aspergers should be level 2 ASD not level 1 ASD. This is the only point I wished to make.


Okay now I understand what you are saying - I would have to agree that there are some people with Asperger's who should be level 2 ASD or perhaps even level 3 - not level 1 ASD. I think this is a case where the way a word is commonly used and its proper psychiatric meaning sometimes differs.


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Adamantium
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25 Nov 2014, 11:54 am

r2d2 wrote:
I would have to agree that there are some people with Asperger's who should be level 2 ASD or perhaps even level 3 - not level 1 ASD. I think this is a case where the way a word is commonly used and its proper psychiatric meaning sometimes differs.


Yes, that's what I meant. Thanks for saying it well.

I tend to think I am explaining my views so clearly, it's always a surprise when I find that I have been misleading or unclear. I know understand that this has to with perspective taking and my tendency to wrongly think that everyone else has my perspective and should understand and agree with me at all times! I think this is not my unique issue but falls under the first ASD criterion.



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25 Nov 2014, 6:22 pm

I am sure that there are people previously diagnosed with AS who need level 1+ support, but I don't have a problem with people saying in general that AS is similar to level 1 ASD.

I think that AS covers the moderate to mild end of the spectrum and blends into BAP/subclinical.

I think that it is best to think about level of support as the level that applies generally to an individual, the majority of the time. So if someone shows more severe traits on occasion, but are not generally at that level, then they should be classified as the level they are most of the time.

Compared to people across the spectrum, I think that it would be rare to have someone with AS classified as level 2 or 3. Only one person (HFA) who has participated in my research studies would likely classify as level 2. All other people previously diagnosed with HFA or AS or PDD-NOS would likely be level 1. Amongst the people who don't participate in research, I know only one other person (autism, low verbal ability) who would be level 2. Level 3 is for people with severe traits all the time.


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25 Nov 2014, 7:26 pm

As far as I understand, AS is just ASD with no delay in speech. That is about it I think. There can be any level. They just have a scale that says, o.k. the guy can walk like me, talk like me, he has a 180 IQ, but he cannot tie his own shoes, and when someone is wrong, and they want to argue with him, he punches him in the face. What severity scale does he belong in?

That level zero bothers me, because you can be fine for 20 years, and all of the sudden BAM! house of cards. I know, it happened to me over a year ago, and I'm still trying to get over some of it. I'm not so sure some of it will :? .

It is not unlike trying to take out the trash, and not knowing where to put it.



Adamantium
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25 Nov 2014, 8:48 pm

btbnnyr wrote:
I am sure that there are people previously diagnosed with AS who need level 1+ support, but I don't have a problem with people saying in general that AS is similar to level 1 ASD.

I think that AS covers the moderate to mild end of the spectrum and blends into BAP/subclinical.

I think that it is best to think about level of support as the level that applies generally to an individual, the majority of the time. So if someone shows more severe traits on occasion, but are not generally at that level, then they should be classified as the level they are most of the time.

Compared to people across the spectrum, I think that it would be rare to have someone with AS classified as level 2 or 3. Only one person (HFA) who has participated in my research studies would likely classify as level 2. All other people previously diagnosed with HFA or AS or PDD-NOS would likely be level 1. Amongst the people who don't participate in research, I know only one other person (autism, low verbal ability) who would be level 2. Level 3 is for people with severe traits all the time.



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