How can I communicate the why???

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Megsie75
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22 Jun 2015, 6:52 pm

I have a question of all AS people on here. How do you effectively hear....your actions hurt me and I can't just get over it with an "I'm sorry, I said I was sorry what more do you want". Case in point....my partner has lied to me on so many occasions. I actually DO understand the reasoning logically at the very base level (thank you largely to contributions in this forum page) but for me, the hurt remains because without acknowledgement of those consequences. One example....He lied to me about wearing his wedding ring. When we first got together, he still wore it. I understood that as I had known him prior whilst he was still married and I knew how raw it was. It seems he had enough social understanding to know it may not be good with me forever because he came to work one day to visit and slipped it off when I went to attend something in another room. I am pretty observant and called him on it. He said sorry. All over for him. I still felt hurt but understood he was actually trying to protect my feelings but went about it the wrong way. The incident was done. Fast forward and more recently he called to discuss court happenings and have a vent while he was on a break from divorce mediation session. He said she asked for her engagement ring and he told the lawyer to ask her where it is. I asked well where is it and he said in some pawn brokers somewhere. I just let him carry on venting and conversation ended. A few weeks later and our conversation turned to the sale of gold. It came out that he had (after the court day) taken jewellry to his jeweller to sell but the jeweller refused to take the engagement ring because he knew how much was originally paid for it. My mind spun.....hadn't it already been sent off to a pawn broker...wait then you lied. Why would you lie when it was for no gain? Is this related to your inability to let go of those symbols of marriage? Ouch...The pain of when you hid your own wedding ring just came back and winded me too. Compounded pain and confusion. Two separate events. Both apologized for (now) but the collateral damage is that my mistrust is compounded. He can't seem to understand that. To him they are separate events. He said sorry so let's just move on. I feel like that is just convenient for him. I still have to deal with the pain. This is just one example of a multitude. I need to know how I can best communicate the need to address the consequences of his actions. I don't want to be resenting him 10yrs from now.



kraftiekortie
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22 Jun 2015, 7:14 pm

I have to say that it's weird that he still wears his wedding ring.

I wouldn't have a serious, committed relationship with this guy if I were you.



Megsie75
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22 Jun 2015, 7:19 pm

Thank you for the response. He doesn't wear it anymore. He did in the very beginning. His reasoning was that he wasn't ready to deal with the questions from other people. I hear your point of view and definitely take it for consideration.



Marky9
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22 Jun 2015, 7:26 pm

I don't see any AS issues here. I regret to say that, in my experience, someone who is chronically deceitful will always be that way. This is without regard to their NT/AS status, or how sincerely someone expresses the hurt that their actions cause others.



Megsie75
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22 Jun 2015, 7:31 pm

Thanks Marky9. I have this terrible fear you are right :cry:



SmokedFool
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22 Jun 2015, 8:00 pm

I have a similar issue, albeit i am the one who tends to lie about things, and the one with Aspergers.

For me it is a learned behavior, growing up i was indirectly taught that you should lie to stay out of trouble (my mum in particular role modeled this). I say indirectly as it was from my observing what my parents did consciously noting what was expected in certain situations.

The other situation i have learned to lie is to stop people getting angry or hurt from the information, which is exceedingly tricky as I can not tell where the fine line is for a white lie and tend to overdo it.

This has caused issues between my wife and I as I have developed a tendency to lie about things i think are going to make her angry.

What I can say that on the whole i do it to try and protect my wife from being hurt, i know i get it wrong more often than i get it right, but i do it form a place of love and caring. Reading your situation i can see myself in your partners shoes, he may be coming from the same attempt at protecting you.



Megsie75
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22 Jun 2015, 8:13 pm

SmokedFool wrote:
I have a similar issue, albeit i am the one who tends to lie about things, and the one with Aspergers.

For me it is a learned behavior, growing up i was indirectly taught that you should lie to stay out of trouble (my mum in particular role modeled this). I say indirectly as it was from my observing what my parents did consciously noting what was expected in certain situations.

The other situation i have learned to lie is to stop people getting angry or hurt from the information, which is exceedingly tricky as I can not tell where the fine line is for a white lie and tend to overdo it.

This has caused issues between my wife and I as I have developed a tendency to lie about things i think are going to make her angry.

What I can say that on the whole i do it to try and protect my wife from being hurt, i know i get it wrong more often than i get it right, but i do it form a place of love and caring. Reading your situation i can see myself in your partners shoes, he may be coming from the same attempt at protecting you.


I am so grateful you responded. This is exactly how he explains it (trying to protect my feelings and avoid upsetting me. I have to state here that we have been together for 15months so avoiding a committed relationship is no longer an option. I am researching every single thing I can to see if there is any way I can address things differently. His background is very difficult and I can see he has been responsible for his own upbringing and the mental health of his mother at crucial times.

Are you suggesting this is a chronic issue that I may just have to accept also or have you and your wife come to some agreement that helps?



SmokedFool
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22 Jun 2015, 8:38 pm

Megsie75 wrote:
SmokedFool wrote:
I have a similar issue, albeit i am the one who tends to lie about things, and the one with Aspergers.

For me it is a learned behavior, growing up i was indirectly taught that you should lie to stay out of trouble (my mum in particular role modeled this). I say indirectly as it was from my observing what my parents did consciously noting what was expected in certain situations.

The other situation i have learned to lie is to stop people getting angry or hurt from the information, which is exceedingly tricky as I can not tell where the fine line is for a white lie and tend to overdo it.

This has caused issues between my wife and I as I have developed a tendency to lie about things i think are going to make her angry.

What I can say that on the whole i do it to try and protect my wife from being hurt, i know i get it wrong more often than i get it right, but i do it form a place of love and caring. Reading your situation i can see myself in your partners shoes, he may be coming from the same attempt at protecting you.


I am so grateful you responded. This is exactly how he explains it (trying to protect my feelings and avoid upsetting me. I have to state here that we have been together for 15months so avoiding a committed relationship is no longer an option. I am researching every single thing I can to see if there is any way I can address things differently. His background is very difficult and I can see he has been responsible for his own upbringing and the mental health of his mother at crucial times.

Are you suggesting this is a chronic issue that I may just have to accept also or have you and your wife come to some agreement that helps?


Unfortunately my wife and i have yet to work it out properly, we have been together for over 10 years now, for me it is a constant learning curve, unlearning my behavior. The best thing we have done is to start developing some processes that i can follow to better present the information rather than just lieing about it (not that we have found one that works for us yet, but we both see the positive of working on this). For us though the biggest challenge we have had is that i was only diagnosed 6 months ago, and this is caught up in our greater communication issues (which are mainly unless i see a point in saying something i don't, leaves me accused of lieing by omission regularly).

So far that most helpful thing to me was the point that the lie can be more hurtful than the truth, which logically suggests the truth is the best at protecting her from hurt feelings.

Hopefully this has been somewhat helpful.



kraftiekortie
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22 Jun 2015, 9:13 pm

You have to convey to him that you are hurt by lies, and that you will not be hurt by the truth.

Then...if he lies again, just exude irritation with him for lying...and reinforce the idea that you would not be hurt by the truth.



autismthinker21
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22 Jun 2015, 9:25 pm

Megsie75 wrote:
I have a question of all AS people on here. How do you effectively hear....your actions hurt me and I can't just get over it with an "I'm sorry, I said I was sorry what more do you want". Case in point....my partner has lied to me on so many occasions. I actually DO understand the reasoning logically at the very base level (thank you largely to contributions in this forum page) but for me, the hurt remains because without acknowledgement of those consequences. One example....He lied to me about wearing his wedding ring. When we first got together, he still wore it. I understood that as I had known him prior whilst he was still married and I knew how raw it was. It seems he had enough social understanding to know it may not be good with me forever because he came to work one day to visit and slipped it off when I went to attend something in another room. I am pretty observant and called him on it. He said sorry. All over for him. I still felt hurt but understood he was actually trying to protect my feelings but went about it the wrong way. The incident was done. Fast forward and more recently he called to discuss court happenings and have a vent while he was on a break from divorce mediation session. He said she asked for her engagement ring and he told the lawyer to ask her where it is. I asked well where is it and he said in some pawn brokers somewhere. I just let him carry on venting and conversation ended. A few weeks later and our conversation turned to the sale of gold. It came out that he had (after the court day) taken jewellry to his jeweller to sell but the jeweller refused to take the engagement ring because he knew how much was originally paid for it. My mind spun.....hadn't it already been sent off to a pawn broker...wait then you lied. Why would you lie when it was for no gain? Is this related to your inability to let go of those symbols of marriage? Ouch...The pain of when you hid your own wedding ring just came back and winded me too. Compounded pain and confusion. Two separate events. Both apologized for (now) but the collateral damage is that my mistrust is compounded. He can't seem to understand that. To him they are separate events. He said sorry so let's just move on. I feel like that is just convenient for him. I still have to deal with the pain. This is just one example of a multitude. I need to know how I can best communicate the need to address the consequences of his actions. I don't want to be resenting him 10yrs from now.
a guy shouldnt lie about himself, if they do, its only their loss.


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Megsie75
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23 Jun 2015, 1:30 am

SmokedFool wrote:
Megsie75 wrote:
SmokedFool wrote:
I have a similar issue, albeit i am the one who tends to lie about things, and the one with Aspergers.

For me it is a learned behavior, growing up i was indirectly taught that you should lie to stay out of trouble (my mum in particular role modeled this). I say indirectly as it was from my observing what my parents did consciously noting what was expected in certain situations.

The other situation i have learned to lie is to stop people getting angry or hurt from the information, which is exceedingly tricky as I can not tell where the fine line is for a white lie and tend to overdo it.

This has caused issues between my wife and I as I have developed a tendency to lie about things i think are going to make her angry.

What I can say that on the whole i do it to try and protect my wife from being hurt, i know i get it wrong more often than i get it right, but i do it form a place of love and caring. Reading your situation i can see myself in your partners shoes, he may be coming from the same attempt at protecting you.


I am so grateful you responded. This is exactly how he explains it (trying to protect my feelings and avoid upsetting me. I have to state here that we have been together for 15months so avoiding a committed relationship is no longer an option. I am researching every single thing I can to see if there is any way I can address things differently. His background is very difficult and I can see he has been responsible for his own upbringing and the mental health of his mother at crucial times.

Are you suggesting this is a chronic issue that I may just have to accept also or have you and your wife come to some agreement that helps?


Unfortunately my wife and i have yet to work it out properly, we have been together for over 10 years now, for me it is a constant learning curve, unlearning my behavior. The best thing we have done is to start developing some processes that i can follow to better present the information rather than just lieing about it (not that we have found one that works for us yet, but we both see the positive of working on this). For us though the biggest challenge we have had is that i was only diagnosed 6 months ago, and this is caught up in our greater communication issues (which are mainly unless i see a point in saying something i don't, leaves me accused of lieing by omission regularly).

So far that most helpful thing to me was the point that the lie can be more hurtful than the truth, which logically suggests the truth is the best at protecting her from hurt feelings.

Hopefully this has been somewhat helpful.


So very very helpful. Just to understand the behavior makes it so much easier to work with. I/we cannot hope to find solutions for the problems we don't understand. I am happy to work hard in this relationship. I have so much to learn and I know he does too. I wish you and your wife the very best of luck. I hope the common ground can be found for you both. :D

Oh and I have to say, the deceit by omission resounds so clearly in our situation too. I know I would rather hear a painful truth than be told a protective lie or just kept in the dark altogether.



Megsie75
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23 Jun 2015, 1:34 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
You have to convey to him that you are hurt by lies, and that you will not be hurt by the truth.

Then...if he lies again, just exude irritation with him for lying...and reinforce the idea that you would not be hurt by the truth.


Thank you. This is a perfect summation of how I feel in this.



Megsie75
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23 Jun 2015, 1:38 am

[/quote] a guy shouldnt lie about himself, if they do, its only their loss.[/quote]

I don't disagree with this statement entirely. I am all for discovering the why and seeing if it's workable. I would like him to get to the point that he feels safe enough to express himself in complete truth.



Vomelche
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24 Jun 2015, 10:47 pm

Megsie75 wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
You have to convey to him that you are hurt by lies, and that you will not be hurt by the truth.

Then...if he lies again, just exude irritation with him for lying...and reinforce the idea that you would not be hurt by the truth.


Thank you. This is a perfect summation of how I feel in this.


I also agree with this. It kind of works over time.