Page 2 of 3 [ 37 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

FMX
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 16 Mar 2012
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,411

26 Nov 2015, 5:46 pm

BeaArthur wrote:
FMX wrote:
I don't think I even understand anymore what "self-esteem" actually means.

I guess it could be paraphrased, how much you like yourself?

Anyone got a better answer?


Thanks, I guess that helps a bit, though it's still hard to give an overall answer. I like some things about myself and dislike others.


_________________
CloudFlare eating your posts? Try the Lazarus browser extension. See https://wp-fmx.github.io/WP/


danum
Raven
Raven

User avatar

Joined: 18 Feb 2011
Age: 57
Gender: Male
Posts: 124

27 Nov 2015, 10:44 am

Jacoby wrote:
I don't think positive self-talk changes anything really, it doesn't matter if I don't believe it. I don't delude myself, I am not narcissist, my self-esteem is a reflection of the circumstances of my life currently so that has to improve for me to feel better about myself. I'm working so hard at it, it is killing me, I just want to be a "functional" person and not a burden to anyone. Relationships of any kind would be welcomed but I'm just too clueless and too anxiety ridden to form any friendship or more. I wish I was 10 years younger, things would be so much easier, seems like it may be too late now.


Self-believe is very important, but I do tend to agree that if you can't change your circumstances you will feel trapped. I know I feel trapped my circumstances.


_________________
Walking every week in the Peak District, the world's most popular National Park. http://peakwalking.blogspot.com


BeaArthur
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Aug 2015
Posts: 4,922

27 Nov 2015, 3:07 pm

FMX wrote:
BeaArthur wrote:
FMX wrote:
I don't think I even understand anymore what "self-esteem" actually means.

I guess it could be paraphrased, how much you like yourself?

Anyone got a better answer?


Thanks, I guess that helps a bit, though it's still hard to give an overall answer. I like some things about myself and dislike others.

I've been thinking about this for a while and I think "liking" oneself doesn't really capture the concept. It also includes whether you feel deserving. You can like your own personality but still feel disabled by the fact that nobody else does. So I would add the dimension of respecting yourself and feeling worthwhile. There is also the dimension, not just of feeling, but acting: a person with high self-esteem does not do things harmful or painful to herself/himself, nor tolerate that from others.

Believe me, I've been on both sides of this. And having a circumstance where someone loves you is very beneficial to self-esteem. I would say it's one of the most important circumstances, more than career or income - for me anyway. This might not be true for everyone reading this; but having someone regularly telling you you are beautiful or saying how much you matter in their life, well, it's hard to have low self-esteem in a circumstance like that.


_________________
Gone.


Deb1970
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 8 Feb 2013
Age: 48
Gender: Female
Posts: 512
Location: Iowa

28 Nov 2015, 8:19 pm

Self Esteem develops by the time we are five. Like me for example, I was born as a red head. Most people responded in a shocked oh poor little girl way. They would say "she is so pale" and "her hair so red". And my father responded negatively to me because I not only had red hair but I was a girl. Because I have Asperger I pulled away from people and cried allot. I got allot of negative attention. These negative responses have continued through out my life. My red hair did darken to a darker brown with red highlights but skin remained pale. People always tell me I need to get a tan. Hello! people I have a very fair complexion. I do not tan I burn even when I use 100 sun block. I have been discriminated against all my life. And the thing about it is most people would say red heads are not discriminated against. I dyed my hair blonde for many years and I was shocked about what people said about red heads. Many said they hated them. I won't continue but this is my take on self esteem.


_________________
"I became insane, with long intervals of horrible sanity."

- Edgar Allan Poe -


C2V
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Apr 2015
Posts: 2,666

28 Nov 2015, 9:21 pm

^ redheaded women are lovely! It's such an unusual and striking look, and that skin that redheads get, like cream. I would have thought being redheaded would have been a positive physical characteristic, not a negative one. After all many women dye their hair red on purpose.
I don't really understand self-esteem either. For me it seems to have very little to do with the quantifiers of others and more to do with how I perceive myself and my own standards. I have been in situations in life where other people were proud of me and respected me and interpreted me as doing well, and I hated myself. There have been other situations that would have been devastating to a "normal" person that delighted me and made me feel much better about myself. People telling me things makes no difference - someone recently told me she likes my company, but I don't see why she should.
What is the point of self-esteem? What does it do? Why do you have to have any whatsoever?


_________________
Alexithymia - 147 points.
Low-Verbal.


BeaArthur
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Aug 2015
Posts: 4,922

28 Nov 2015, 9:38 pm

C2V wrote:
What is the point of self-esteem? What does it do? Why do you have to have any whatsoever?
It affects the choices you make. "I am lucky to have this spouse/job/career, I'd better not ask for anything better." "I don't deserve to be treated any better this." "It costs more ... but I'm worth it." (joking about that last one)


_________________
Gone.


Deb1970
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 8 Feb 2013
Age: 48
Gender: Female
Posts: 512
Location: Iowa

28 Nov 2015, 10:02 pm

If you go to this blog you will learn more on the subject of red heads: http://usepsychology.blogspot.com/2013/ ... ctive.html

I'm not trying to cause a debate on the issue, I was merely stating my experience as a red headed child with Asperger's growing up has contributed to my low self esteem. Yes, red headed woman have less discrimination then there male counterparts but still face similar issues. Why woman are dying there hair red baffles me. People ask me all the time what color red I use when dying my hair. I tell them it is natural and they are silent. It is merely a trend and it is thought to be edgy. But because it is not natural people are okay with it. You add fair skin and freckles to those people and most would not go for that look. It is a scientific fact just as they say blondes are considered most attractive. This is based off of studies done in controlled environments. It is not my opinion.


_________________
"I became insane, with long intervals of horrible sanity."

- Edgar Allan Poe -


BeaArthur
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Aug 2015
Posts: 4,922

28 Nov 2015, 10:39 pm

If you had grown up knowing you were the gender daddy wanted and hearing that redheads are the most beautiful people in the world - I doubt it would have mattered what society said. You would have felt valuable to your core. But you didn't. I do agree that much of it is in place by age 5 - which is not to say that subsequent experiences can't play a part.


_________________
Gone.


Falloy
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

User avatar

Joined: 1 Dec 2011
Age: 52
Gender: Male
Posts: 342

29 Nov 2015, 12:35 pm

Deb1970 wrote:
Self Esteem develops by the time we are five. Like me for example, I was born as a red head. Most people responded in a shocked oh poor little girl way. They would say "she is so pale" and "her hair so red". And my father responded negatively to me because I not only had red hair but I was a girl. Because I have Asperger I pulled away from people and cried allot. I got allot of negative attention. These negative responses have continued through out my life. My red hair did darken to a darker brown with red highlights but skin remained pale. People always tell me I need to get a tan. Hello! people I have a very fair complexion. I do not tan I burn even when I use 100 sun block. I have been discriminated against all my life. And the thing about it is most people would say red heads are not discriminated against. I dyed my hair blonde for many years and I was shocked about what people said about red heads. Many said they hated them. I won't continue but this is my take on self esteem.


I'm male and I have red hair. I never liked it. It's not a very very bad thing but it does draw unwanted attention and is another reason to single me out. I cannot tan at all and now as my hair is receding I have to take great care of my scalp to avoid sun damage even in England. I've already had to have one BCC cut off my forehead.

There's a surprising amount of ridicule aimed at people with red hair. Most of it is just teasing but if you're being laughed at because you have red hair, and laughed at because you wear glasses, laughed at because you are tall, laughed at because you are a nerd, laughed at because you are crap at sports, laughed at because your family are working class etc etc it all adds up. I couldn't/can't be just a figure of fun all the time.



BeaArthur
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Aug 2015
Posts: 4,922

29 Nov 2015, 1:06 pm

Isn't Prince Harry a bit of a redhead? I thought everybody thinks he is darling. Doesn't hurt to be royalty, I suppose.


_________________
Gone.


FMX
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 16 Mar 2012
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,411

29 Nov 2015, 5:36 pm

I think the combination of factors, like Falloy said, is key, because they reinforce each other. The more different people in different contexts tell you the same thing the harder it becomes to disbelieve it.

I know a red-headed guy (looks a bit like Prince Harry, actually) who is probably the most self-assured, secure, confident person I've ever met. I don't mean that he projects over-the-top confidence, I mean genuine confidence. If he's faking it then he's certainly managed to fool me. I have a great deal of respect for him. This guy also gets red-head jokes all the time and also makes them all the time (pre-empting the others doing it, I suppose), but because he's already so confident this doesn't seem to bother him at all. He's a fun and social guy, good at sports, very tough both physically and mentally and has lots of friends, so he can easily laugh it off. It's like everyone is laughing with him, not at him. Of course, if you don't have all that positive reinforcement things are quite different.


_________________
CloudFlare eating your posts? Try the Lazarus browser extension. See https://wp-fmx.github.io/WP/


BeaArthur
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Aug 2015
Posts: 4,922

29 Nov 2015, 5:42 pm

On the subject of hair color, let's not forget that the jokes about blonde women can get pretty vicious. Red hair has no monopoly on derision. And of course, there's also skin color... no need to say more.


_________________
Gone.


BeaArthur
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Aug 2015
Posts: 4,922

29 Nov 2015, 5:44 pm

cberg wrote:
I suggest learning to enjoy laughing at oneself. It's not like the rest of us jump out of bed onto unicycles on tightropes every day - I'm invariably about to break some code/strip a bolt/stall my car/crash my bike/walk into stuff etc. To me that just becomes funnier & funnier...

Hear, hear! I could not agree more. Of course this ability wasn't born in a day. I'm on the wrong side of 60 (I can say that, you'd better not!) and I find a lot to laugh about in myself.


_________________
Gone.


Falloy
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

User avatar

Joined: 1 Dec 2011
Age: 52
Gender: Male
Posts: 342

29 Nov 2015, 6:11 pm

I have had to learn to laugh at myself. I've had to do it a hell of a lot.

Laugh at my height. Laugh at my poor eyesight. Laugh at my hair colour. Laugh at my weight. Laugh at physical clumsiness.

And over and over and over again, laugh at my physical appearance.

I can often put on a "comedy routine" around a mistake I've made of one of my failings. But not always.

It certainly hasn't helped my self esteem. In fact I think it has damaged it.

You can't just keep laughing. You can't let people laugh at the things and people you love (and in my experience, they will). You have to be more than just a joke.



kazanscube
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2015
Gender: Male
Posts: 26,180

29 Nov 2015, 9:01 pm

Self esteem where do I start? For me it has been a struggle over centuries now with simply acknowledging myself as human. It's not easy to alter a negative perception of oneself to one of a more positive note.

However I try to remind myself I'm still a human being.


_________________
I'm an extremely vulnerable person. Vulnerability and emotion are very closely linked.