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What's worse, white pride or white guilt/shame?
white pride 19%  19%  [ 11 ]
white guilt/shame 40%  40%  [ 23 ]
both 40%  40%  [ 23 ]
Total votes : 57

MDD123
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15 Dec 2015, 2:14 pm

Its hard to argue that we don't at least benefit from past misdeeds. Slave labor was a pillar of the southern economy, I owe where I live to land-theft from the indigenous population. The holocaust acted as a wealth redistribution program, and most of the original owners were conveniently killed off, making reparations less likely.

Programs like affirmative action and provisions given to tribes at least try to make amends for the damage done in the past.

Things like guilt are personally felt, you can't just command someone to feel guilty. If I even think that someone is trying to make me experience guilt, I just assume it's part of a power-play and blow them off.


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16 Dec 2015, 3:14 pm

C2V wrote:
This whole thing seems to require a personal, emotional self identification with a particular group based on X characteristics or history. Believing you are that group. I've always had difficulty with this, and felt entirely removed.
I guess that makes the concept irrelevant to me. The only relevance would be that imposed on me by an outside source.


...this, i have that same difficulty. i think it requires a level of empathy i cant find in myself.


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16 Dec 2015, 9:15 pm

Kiprobalhato wrote:
C2V wrote:
This whole thing seems to require a personal, emotional self identification with a particular group based on X characteristics or history. Believing you are that group. I've always had difficulty with this, and felt entirely removed.
I guess that makes the concept irrelevant to me. The only relevance would be that imposed on me by an outside source.


...this, i have that same difficulty. i think it requires a level of empathy i cant find in myself.

What about Autism Acceptance Month, World Autism Awareness Day, Autistic Pride Day, or Autistic History Month?



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16 Dec 2015, 9:27 pm

White guilt is inherit for many people who are born white. It's the new era of original sin; you're white, therefore you must be trampled on to elevate the rights of others. Frankly, it disgusts me, but SJW's just don't go away. They have more power than ever right now. :x


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17 Dec 2015, 9:54 am

TheExodus wrote:
White guilt is inherit for many people who are born white. It's the new era of original sin; you're white, therefore you must be trampled on to elevate the rights of others. Frankly, it disgusts me, but SJW's just don't go away. They have more power than ever right now. :x


True. Like, I'm of Polish descent, my grandmother was in a death camp and then captured by the soviets, I have various disorders and I'm on the spectrum. How in the bloody hell am I privileged?

I really wish SJWs would just go away and stop trying to censor the entire god damned world. Like universities, sorry, they aren't safe spaces, they are a place for learning. If you want a safe space, go home.



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17 Dec 2015, 12:19 pm

Raptor wrote:
It never occurred to me to be proud to be white until I heard I should be ashamed of being white.

This.

I wonder if we need a bit of "white pride" here and there just to counter the white guilt machine. Nothing racist, nothing to elevate whites above other races, just to provide a voice that runs counter to the voice telling you you're bad and you should feel bad because of what people did before you were born and the colour of your skin. Because that s**t works. It wouldn't be needed if people just blew off the SJWs but it works on some people, and then they're just puppets of the SJWs. It would be more to say "it's okay to be white" than be proud to be white. Because it's about power, and what they're doing is spreading their white guilt while silencing all voices in opposition. By branding any positivity about whiteness as racist, only their voice is heard, and the indoctrination is free to be spread unopposed. It's what they do. They try to spread their rhetoric and brand anything that threatens it as racist, sexist, whateverist. All this jockeying based on race is pointless imo. Race shouldn't matter when evaluating someone. It shouldn't be a factor at all. That is real equality.

In terms of pride, I can understand national pride. You can be proud to be a part of something, and proud of the accomplishments of others. Pride based on race though, not really. If you're proud of the nation, then that includes the achievements of everyone in the nation. You don't have to cut out minorities that contributed to the success of the nation.



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17 Dec 2015, 12:31 pm

you're either ashamed to be proud,
or proud to be ashamed
but for crying out aloud
i am not the one to blame.



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18 Dec 2015, 12:54 am

I went with white pride, as the white pride movement is actually a reactionary, racist movement meant to roll back civil rights gains for non-whites.
As for white guilt - that's something the right brings up in order to explain why so many whites voted for Obama. And it has as much validity as the notion that all the pre election polls showing Romney losing were somehow falsified.


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18 Dec 2015, 1:02 am

AspieOtaku wrote:
Im proud of my ancestral heritage, the Celts, both Irish and Welsh on both sides, we were a force to be reckoned with, and even the Romans at times feared us, if it weren't for the Romans all of Europe would be Celts to this day and there would be no Celtic slaves and of course there would be no English Language. The Celts were advanced in their techology at their times despite being barbarians who ran naked into battle with blue face paint, they were the first to come up with iron and the Romans eventually copied the helms and spears and such. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celts


Actually, English is a Germanic language with a strong Romance element.
And a very good reason why the Romans had been so greatly influenced by the Celts was because both peoples had shared a common ancestry in the hazy prehistory of the Central Europe, which was the cradle of both material cultures.


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18 Dec 2015, 1:34 am

People voted for Obama for many reasons; I don't believe white guilt is among them.



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18 Dec 2015, 11:10 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
I went with white pride, as the white pride movement is actually a reactionary, racist movement meant to roll back civil rights gains for non-whites.
As for white guilt - that's something the right brings up in order to explain why so many whites voted for Obama. And it has as much validity as the notion that all the pre election polls showing Romney losing were somehow falsified.

I picked white guilt simply because I believe it's more of an issue. White pride normally would be worse, and certainly is on a 1:1 basis, but the racist white pride style movements, I don't know if they've ever been more shoved to the margins of society and more ineffective. They're obvious about who and what they are and people shun them near-universally.

White-guilt is much more insidious. Much more likely to catch people off guard because they're not aware of the nature of it and what a threat it is and there isn't a strong voice to run counter to it, unlike white pride, where it's practically ingrained into society that this is a bad thing. We don't have debates about whether this is right or wrong, it's practically universally accepted as wrong. We don't have articles popping up here there and everywhere in the mainstream media promoting it.



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19 Dec 2015, 3:01 am

Drake wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I went with white pride, as the white pride movement is actually a reactionary, racist movement meant to roll back civil rights gains for non-whites.
As for white guilt - that's something the right brings up in order to explain why so many whites voted for Obama. And it has as much validity as the notion that all the pre election polls showing Romney losing were somehow falsified.

I picked white guilt simply because I believe it's more of an issue. White pride normally would be worse, and certainly is on a 1:1 basis, but the racist white pride style movements, I don't know if they've ever been more shoved to the margins of society and more ineffective. They're obvious about who and what they are and people shun them near-universally.

White-guilt is much more insidious. Much more likely to catch people off guard because they're not aware of the nature of it and what a threat it is and there isn't a strong voice to run counter to it, unlike white pride, where it's practically ingrained into society that this is a bad thing. We don't have debates about whether this is right or wrong, it's practically universally accepted as wrong. We don't have articles popping up here there and everywhere in the mainstream media promoting it.


I'm sorry, but I just don't see white guilt as something the rest of us are afflicted with.


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19 Dec 2015, 5:31 am

I am proud to be White to a point as a Celt, for my ancestry, we did not oppress other races, we were oppressed ourseles, we were a tribal warlike people and seen as savages, and in a way we were, we ran into battle naked and facepaint and beheaded our foes and wore them as trophies! The Romans took over 500 years to make us no longer a threat and since then we gave the Romans nightmares for 500 years and at times we managed to kick the Romans out of Britain only sadly 5 years later they managed to defeat Boutica so that's the end of the Iceni Tribe as for the Irish Scottish and Welsh Lived on the Terrain was too difficult for the Romans to pres further after that and thanks to that the celtic culture was able to live on to this day! After the Roman culture slowly died off the Celtic Culture lives on! St, Patrics day is a drop in the pond and is celebrated worldwide many folks who want to be Irish who are not celebrate it and another twist is St Patric is Welsh and I am both half Welsh and Half Irish so I am the true Maccoy!! I am a proud descentdant of a tribale warrior race who struck fear into the Romans for so long! At least I know this, none of my ancestors on either bloodline enslaved black people or others and I am now free and calm knowing this and I know longer need to be blamed of all of that crap just for being White! So in a sence we were the good white people.


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19 Dec 2015, 2:07 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
Drake wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I went with white pride, as the white pride movement is actually a reactionary, racist movement meant to roll back civil rights gains for non-whites.
As for white guilt - that's something the right brings up in order to explain why so many whites voted for Obama. And it has as much validity as the notion that all the pre election polls showing Romney losing were somehow falsified.

I picked white guilt simply because I believe it's more of an issue. White pride normally would be worse, and certainly is on a 1:1 basis, but the racist white pride style movements, I don't know if they've ever been more shoved to the margins of society and more ineffective. They're obvious about who and what they are and people shun them near-universally.

White-guilt is much more insidious. Much more likely to catch people off guard because they're not aware of the nature of it and what a threat it is and there isn't a strong voice to run counter to it, unlike white pride, where it's practically ingrained into society that this is a bad thing. We don't have debates about whether this is right or wrong, it's practically universally accepted as wrong. We don't have articles popping up here there and everywhere in the mainstream media promoting it.


I'm sorry, but I just don't see white guilt as something the rest of us are afflicted with.

I don't think anyone would start out that way. Someone comes along and makes people that way, and that's the problem. That stuff isn't going to work on me, but it works on some people.



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19 Dec 2015, 11:43 pm

AspieOtaku wrote:
I am proud to be White to a point as a Celt, for my ancestry, we did not oppress other races, we were oppressed ourseles, we were a tribal warlike people and seen as savages, and in a way we were, we ran into battle naked and facepaint and beheaded our foes and wore them as trophies! The Romans took over 500 years to make us no longer a threat and since then we gave the Romans nightmares for 500 years and at times we managed to kick the Romans out of Britain only sadly 5 years later they managed to defeat Boutica so that's the end of the Iceni Tribe as for the Irish Scottish and Welsh Lived on the Terrain was too difficult for the Romans to pres further after that and thanks to that the celtic culture was able to live on to this day! After the Roman culture slowly died off the Celtic Culture lives on! St, Patrics day is a drop in the pond and is celebrated worldwide many folks who want to be Irish who are not celebrate it and another twist is St Patric is Welsh and I am both half Welsh and Half Irish so I am the true Maccoy!! I am a proud descentdant of a tribale warrior race who struck fear into the Romans for so long! At least I know this, none of my ancestors on either bloodline enslaved black people or others and I am now free and calm knowing this and I know longer need to be blamed of all of that crap just for being White! So in a sence we were the good white people.


I'm also very proud of my early Germanic ancestors, for very much the same reasons (despite being barbarians, they had behaved better than the Germans of the Nazi era). They were also fearless, fierce warriors who the Romans feared and respected, and who early on had fought naked against armored opponents. Rome's greatest enemy was without a doubt the Germanic chieftain (and former Roman army recruit), Arminius, who had defeated the Romans in the battle of the Teutoburg forest, freeing Germania, and for the first time pushing back the border in imperial history. Because they were metal poor and slow to come into the Iron Age, they were first under a great deal of Celtic, and later Roman, material culture, but eventually came into their own by the 3rd century, surpassing even the Romans in metallurgy. When the Roman Empire in the west collapsed due to the political and economic division with the Eastern Empire, it was Germanic people such as the Franks, Anglo-Saxons, Alamanni, Ostrogoths and Visigoths, and other peoples who re-peopled the old empire, and remade Europe in the ashes of the old world.
Unfortunately, white supremacists have misused Germanic history to promote their own hateful ideology.


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