Page 3 of 3 [ 48 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 41,808
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

25 Dec 2015, 7:36 pm

I don't think anyone is disputing that far more black Americans are killed in black on black violence, but the whole point of Black Lives Matter is that no one should have to fear the police. And clearly, black Americans do have reasonable fear of the police. And the fact that the police treat blacks differently from whites shows that their lives are not valued as much.


_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Campin_Cat
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2014
Age: 59
Gender: Female
Posts: 25,951
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

25 Dec 2015, 7:43 pm

Adamantium wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
It's not a wrong statement----it's a CORRECT statement, where I live. The only black people, basically, who are acting-like they want to help black people and stopping them from not caring anymore about other black people, than to callously take their life, are those trying to get elected / re-elected----and, they'll say ANYTHING!!

Now, there ARE some black people, here, who are GENUINELY trying to get blacks to respect other blacks / black lives, MORE----and I am very grateful for them (it KILLS me, that there is so much killing, here----over 300 homicides, and the year ain't over)----but, unfortunately, they are extremely few-and-far-between.


Your individual perception of reality is may be distorted by any number of things.
For all I know, you may be lying about your community, you might be living in an Aryan Nations compound putting out anti-black propaganda all day... (I don't suspect this, but your "some of my best friends are black so I am entitled to talk **** about them as much as I want," line is about as weak as you can get on the internet.)
You may actually live in the community you describe, but hardly know any of your black neighbors and thus base your assessment of the feelings of "those people" on imagination and projection.

Now I know and am friends with black people and live in an integrated community, much as you claim to do, but my experience is very different than yours.

So let's set aside the possibly distorting effect of subjective impression and look for empirical evidence on this... and that's easy to start because someone has already done this, as a moments googling will reveal:

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... rwise.html

This evidence-based approach says the belief that black people don't care about violence in predominantly black communities is wrong.

Of course, people are free to choose to believe whatever they want, but the choice to believe an improbable falsehood (e.g., people don't care about being the victims of violence, life is cheap with those people, or some variation on that bunk) really reveals more about the mind and mental habits of the believer than the subject of that belief.

LOL Wow.

I said right in my post, the second paragraph that you quoted, that there are black people, here, who care about black people.

Of course, people are free to choose to believe whatever they want to believe about what they THINK I said, but the choice to read only what they want to read, instead of what is actually there, really reveals alot about the mind and mental habits of the reader.



trayder
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 15 Aug 2015
Age: 1945
Posts: 280
Location: New Zealand

30 Dec 2015, 7:56 pm

MaxE wrote:
@kraftiekortie You are quite right about the police however I stand by my point regarding KKK and related violence. It doesn't pose a threat to white people so it hasn't become a national priority or topic of political debate the way an act carried out by professed jihadists, such as San Bernardino, has.


Thats basic tribalism. For all our vaunted advantages as a species, we are still quite close to our instinctual nature....only 10% of our brain utilises the potential in self awareness.



trayder
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 15 Aug 2015
Age: 1945
Posts: 280
Location: New Zealand

30 Dec 2015, 7:58 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
I don't think anyone is disputing that far more black Americans are killed in black on black violence, but the whole point of Black Lives Matter is that no one should have to fear the police. And clearly, black Americans do have reasonable fear of the police. And the fact that the police treat blacks differently from whites shows that their lives are not valued as much.


Which in turn makes a mockery of secular statism.



techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 21,352
Location: The 27th Path of Peh.

30 Dec 2015, 8:21 pm

A different way of looking at the dynamic actually might be this:
1) There's much less uproar about black on black crime than interracial crime
2) You'll hear about mass killings in the first world immediately, places like India or China similarly, but you barely hear a thing about events like the civil war in the Congo. True, we hear about what Boca Haram is doing in West Africa and what people are doing to fight them but not a lot else.

I think that side of it, especially the first point, is one of the biggest tragedies.


_________________
"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privelege of owning yourself" - Rudyard Kipling


Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 41,808
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

30 Dec 2015, 10:34 pm

trayder wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I don't think anyone is disputing that far more black Americans are killed in black on black violence, but the whole point of Black Lives Matter is that no one should have to fear the police. And clearly, black Americans do have reasonable fear of the police. And the fact that the police treat blacks differently from whites shows that their lives are not valued as much.


Which in turn makes a mockery of secular statism.


Forgive me, but I'm not seeing how secular statism comes into the picture here.


_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


AR1500
Sea Gull
Sea Gull

Joined: 27 Oct 2015
Age: 36
Posts: 229
Location: Unknown

01 Jan 2016, 5:11 am

Edenthiel wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
I think you're probably oversimplifying things.

The San Bernandino shooters have been well-publicized because it was a TERRORIST act.


Just to clarify, Dylann Roof's action in SC was also a TERRORIST act. He intended to intimidate a group of people, specifically, african american people.
From the AP"
"Roof later confessed that he committed the shooting in hopes of igniting a race war."

White Supremacists, Islam Supremacists, Christian Supremacists...they are all terrorists.



CORRECT :!:


But the thing about the Charleston shooting is that despite the tragic loss of innocent lives, it was ultimately a tactical failure on the part of roof who intended it to incite more violence. But the reason why it hasn't come up in the presidential debates is that he was very much a lone terrorist and not part of an organization that continues to recruit new members and can carry out more attacks.



Adamantium
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2013
Age: 1020
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,863
Location: Erehwon

01 Jan 2016, 5:28 pm

Campin_Cat wrote:
I said right in my post, the second paragraph that you quoted, that there are black people, here, who care about black people.


You said "some", who are "extremely few-and-far-between." While this has a certain Trumpian flair, it is not supported by my subjective experience or objective evidence. Most people care about being victims of violence and don't decide that it's OK if it's coming from people of similar appearance.

You are saying you know black people, live in a black community and that not caring about violence against black people by other black people is representative of the community in which you live. You may believe that, but the preponderance of the available evidence says that this claim is not true.

Merry Christmas and happy New Year!



Campin_Cat
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2014
Age: 59
Gender: Female
Posts: 25,951
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

03 Jan 2016, 7:16 am

^^ We are at an impasse----you will never, in-my-book, prove me wrong and yourself, right, on this particular topic----so, I’ll just leave our conversation, here.













_________________
White female; age 58; diagnosed Aspie.
I use caps for emphasis----I'm NOT angry or shouting. I use caps like others use italics, underline, or bold.
"What we know is a drop; what we don't know, is an ocean." (Sir Isaac Newton)


wittgenstein
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 May 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,512
Location: Trapped inside a hominid skull

03 Jan 2016, 10:55 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I think you're probably oversimplifying things.

The San Bernandino shooters have been well-publicized because it was a TERRORIST act. People just fear Jihadis, unfortunately, more than they fear white racists. I don't believe this is a good example of "black lives mattering less."

BI.

In other words, it is not based on racism,it is based on self interest. If some crazy serial killer is killing people with blue eyes I will be less concerned then if he is targeting brown eyed people (I have brown eyes). I do not think blue eyed people are inferior to me. Its just that that serial killer that only kills blue eyed people aint my problem.


_________________
YES! This is me!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gtdlR4rUcY
I went up over 50 feet!
I love debate!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtckVng_1a0
My debate style is calm and deadly!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-230v_ecAcM


AspieOtaku
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2012
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,051
Location: San Jose

06 Jan 2016, 2:38 pm


_________________
Your Aspie score is 193 of 200
Your neurotypical score is 40 of 200
You are very likely an aspie
No matter where I go I will always be a Gaijin even at home. Like Anime? https://kissanime.to/AnimeList


wittgenstein
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 May 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,512
Location: Trapped inside a hominid skull

06 Jan 2016, 9:25 pm

Yes, those particular black lives matter people were trolls. They knew (or maybe they are totaly ignorant ) that Sanders marched with Martin Luther King. Actually, the truth is, is that that lady doing the shouting is a tea partier. Yep! Shocked me! A black tea partier! Dirty tricks are unfortunately part of politics. Those shouting in that video almost destroyed the black lives matter by making it look grotesquely uninformed.


_________________
YES! This is me!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gtdlR4rUcY
I went up over 50 feet!
I love debate!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtckVng_1a0
My debate style is calm and deadly!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-230v_ecAcM


adifferentname
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,885

07 Jan 2016, 5:59 am

cathylynn wrote:
of course, all lives matter, but historically, white lives have mattered more, so black lives matter (too) is a fair antidote.


What antidote would you prescribe to someone a cancer sufferer who was once bitten by a venomous snake? #BLM is a toxin, not a cure.

What annoys me about #BLM is that its usage is effectively saying "Black Lives Matter (less)", with every additional voice a reinforcing amplification of the '(less)' part. Obviously #ALM is the sensible position to take, but this effectively renders #ALM redundant except as a response to the inherently racist #BLM.

In other words, #BLM was either an incredibly misguided idea or a deliberate and cynical move to sow division and mistrust.

BeaArthur wrote:
I would like everybody who has posted on this thread to ask himself, "Does this conversation make a black autistic person feel welcome to participate at WrongPlanet?"


To what end? I find the idea that we should pander to the fragile sensibilities of others, based solely on the colour of their skin, to be highly patronising and disgustingly racist. As such, my response to the question would be an impolite admonishment of myself. That doesn't seem to be terribly productive, so I'll pass.



AspieOtaku
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2012
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,051
Location: San Jose

07 Jan 2016, 6:35 am

wittgenstein wrote:
Yes, those particular black lives matter people were trolls. They knew (or maybe they are totaly ignorant ) that Sanders marched with Martin Luther King. Actually, the truth is, is that that lady doing the shouting is a tea partier. Yep! Shocked me! A black tea partier! Dirty tricks are unfortunately part of politics. Those shouting in that video almost destroyed the black lives matter by making it look grotesquely uninformed.
Even if not tea prtiers they are supporting fuel for racist white supremists groups, black supremist hate groups support white supremist hate groups without knowing so, hate fuels more hate and this is part of the cycle.


_________________
Your Aspie score is 193 of 200
Your neurotypical score is 40 of 200
You are very likely an aspie
No matter where I go I will always be a Gaijin even at home. Like Anime? https://kissanime.to/AnimeList


Campin_Cat
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2014
Age: 59
Gender: Female
Posts: 25,951
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

08 Jan 2016, 1:25 pm

adifferentname wrote:
cathylynn wrote:
of course, all lives matter, but historically, white lives have mattered more, so black lives matter (too) is a fair antidote.

#BLM was... a deliberate and cynical move to sow division and mistrust.

BeaArthur wrote:
I would like everybody who has posted on this thread to ask himself, "Does this conversation make a black autistic person feel welcome to participate at WrongPlanet?"

I find the idea that we should pander to the fragile sensibilities of others, based solely on the colour of their skin, to be highly patronising...

EXACTLY----I agree!!






_________________
White female; age 58; diagnosed Aspie.
I use caps for emphasis----I'm NOT angry or shouting. I use caps like others use italics, underline, or bold.
"What we know is a drop; what we don't know, is an ocean." (Sir Isaac Newton)


wittgenstein
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 May 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,512
Location: Trapped inside a hominid skull

16 Sep 2020, 6:40 pm

"Black Lives Matter (BLM) is a DECENTRALIZED political and social movement advocating for non-violent civil disobedience "
FROM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter
1.BLM is not an organization. There is no leadership.
2. To say that EVERYONE or even a majority of people that think that black lives matter are violent is stupid.
3. Even if all the looters believed that black lives are important does not mean that all those that believe that black lives matter are looters. I realize that this will go over trumper's heads but " All dogs are mammals does not mean that all mammals are dogs.
I am sick of all the self righteous morons that proclaim " all lives matter." If you saw a person being stabbed to death and he was screaming, " my life matters." Would you scream back, " Hey self centered idiot. What about my life? Doesn't it matter? " OR WOULD YOU HELP HIM?


_________________
YES! This is me!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gtdlR4rUcY
I went up over 50 feet!
I love debate!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtckVng_1a0
My debate style is calm and deadly!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-230v_ecAcM