We aren't real. The world isn't real.

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b9
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01 Apr 2016, 3:17 am

is the illusion also just an illusion? i am conscious of something, and if it is an illusion i am conscious of, then the illusion at least must exist. so an illusion is more than non reality, because non reality is devoid of even the perception of it.



auntblabby
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01 Apr 2016, 3:22 am

that reminds me of that "i think, therefore I am" thingie. :nerdy:



b9
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01 Apr 2016, 4:25 am

auntblabby wrote:
that reminds me of that "i think, therefore I am" thingie. :nerdy:


hmm. i am aware of those sayings (there are about 12 variants i think (like "i feel therefore i be" etc)), but i never took any notice of them.

i mean what if he only thinks he's thinking? (joke)



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01 Apr 2016, 4:52 am

My response to the title of this was going to be nothing is real.
+


but you beat me to the nothing is real.


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01 Apr 2016, 4:56 am

In some dimensions this one may not exist.


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b9
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01 Apr 2016, 5:12 am

i believe all dimensions are just a way for the human mind to fit what their senses feed to them in an ordered semblance.
i believe the charting of reality is not really anything else than the construction of frameworks within which consciousness can have direction and form.

i often wondered when i was a child, what a mind that has never been exposed to sensation would operate like.

not just a variant of the "brain in a vat" idea (which is a gruesome idea of how a mind would continue to operate if all sensations that it relied upon for operation were removed), but how a mind that never saw or heard or smelled or felt or sensed anything, would operate.
a mind that is fully healthy and operational but devoid of all external knowledge. devoid of the knowledge that there are other beings in the universe.
devoid of the knowledge or even the question of an "outside of me".

how would it operate? what schemes would it employ to make sense of it's own subjective nothingness?

would anything be sensible?

would it feel bad?

i stopped wondering because i will never know what it is to know nothing but feel something.



TentofMot
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01 Apr 2016, 6:50 am

It's real. If you need proof, go outside and find a rock you can hold in your hand. Feel the shape, the weight of it. It's real. And if that doesn't convince you, tap yourself on the head with it, lightly. It makes an impression, no?



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01 Apr 2016, 7:47 am

"There's no difference between illusion and reality, to the person experiencing it. This is no illusion."
-Shion Uzuki


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01 Apr 2016, 3:11 pm

I suspect a brain disconnected from everything but blood supply would soon lose [via atrophy] all of its higher portions but would retain a brain stem.



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01 Apr 2016, 5:07 pm

The word "real" is just a made up symbol in the English language. Why would we be making up words to describe a reality that doesn't exist?
Our senses evolved to help us navigate and survive in our surroundings. Why would we have senses to sense a world that doesn't exist and how could we think if we weren't real?
Of course it's all real but we are not capable of experiencing all of reality and can only experience it indirectly through the filter of our senses that we evolved to survive with.

So it's not that nothing is real, but that we don't perceive all of reality as it actually is.
We are just animals that evolved a way to sense enough of reality to enable us to live long enough to produce offspring. probably just a fraction of reality.
Scientists work at discovering realities that we have no way of directly perceiving.
It's like science has taken over where our perception ends.
Solipsism makes no sense to me.



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01 Apr 2016, 5:29 pm

TentofMot wrote:
It's real. If you need proof, go outside and find a rock you can hold in your hand. Feel the shape, the weight of it. It's real. And if that doesn't convince you, tap yourself on the head with it, lightly. It makes an impression, no?

I've done that kind of thing in dreams before (I've experimented a lot with lucid dreaming). It felt just as real as it does when I'm awake and we can both agree that dreams aren't real.


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TentofMot
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01 Apr 2016, 6:17 pm

mikeman7918 wrote:
TentofMot wrote:
It's real. If you need proof, go outside and find a rock you can hold in your hand. Feel the shape, the weight of it. It's real. And if that doesn't convince you, tap yourself on the head with it, lightly. It makes an impression, no?

I've done that kind of thing in dreams before (I've experimented a lot with lucid dreaming). It felt just as real as it does when I'm awake and we can both agree that dreams aren't real.


I'm surprised. But it's just a reality field test. However, to really say it doesn't work you'd have to do the whole test, which is the above and to smell the rock and finally taste it, just the tip of your tongue. I will warn you it usually tastes like dirt. :lol:



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01 Apr 2016, 6:20 pm

I'm not sure if being real is that important.

You are experiencing an event, is there anything else?



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01 Apr 2016, 7:51 pm

Something in me has always nagged on this question. Sometimes it feels like a tenuous revelation that I am a living being in a body, surrounded by other bodies, on a busy planet. Like, am I really here? Is this what it is?

I've usually chalked this sensibility up to disassociation or autism, but who knows, maybe I'm gifted enough to realize I'm flipping back and forth through quantum states.


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mikeman7918
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01 Apr 2016, 8:51 pm

TentofMot wrote:
I'm surprised. But it's just a reality field test. However, to really say it doesn't work you'd have to do the whole test, which is the above and to smell the rock and finally taste it, just the tip of your tongue. I will warn you it usually tastes like dirt. :lol:

I have smelled and tasted things in dreams before. Just last night I got shot multiple times in a dream, it actually did hurt and it all seemed so real that by the time I woke up I had a fight-or-flight response going and I was scared out of my mind. How realistic dreaming feels never ceases to amaze me.

I'm not necessarily saying that nothing is real, I'm just saying that nobody can prove that anything is real especially based on just how real it feels.


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Esme
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02 Apr 2016, 2:00 pm

Look up 'simulation theory'. I've always thought we were in a giant Sims game.